Author Topic: Gov stuck, any easy suggestions?  (Read 683 times)

Hugh Conway

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Gov stuck, any easy suggestions?
« on: January 18, 2021, 12:17:42 AM »
After a few years of non operation, I have finally started up this 6/1. After a fuel bleed, it started easily.
To my dismay, I could see that the gov is not operating. With the linkage removed, it's easy to realize that the problem is internal, as the injector rack and external  linkage is free of any binding.
The flyweights or the sliding sleeve or the internal linkage is stuck. Before I (sigh) take things apart, does anyone have a possible solution. I've just re-installed the wheels and it's a startomatic, so they are heavy.
All suggestions entertained, though I think I will have to do some disassembly to remedy the situation.
Cheers
Hugh
JKson 6/1  (Utterpower PMG ) Off-grid
Lister 6/1 Start-O-Matic engine......running with PMG
1978 Royal Enfield (glutton for punishment by Indian iron)
1963 BMW R-27 project

mike90045

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Re: Gov stuck, any easy suggestions?
« Reply #1 on: January 18, 2021, 03:05:34 AM »
take your good shirt off and get your arm up in there and see if you can wriggle it free or loosen it up.   

Hugh Conway

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Re: Gov stuck, any easy suggestions?
« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2021, 12:07:36 AM »
@mike.....
Took your advice, put on a very old shirt. The flyweights  and/or governor sleeve were stuck. It was an easy thing to get unstuck. re-fit the gov linkage and gave it a spin without trying to start.
Crikey ! ! ! Stuck again, and I could see no obvious cause.
With the need for more information, I then removed the camshaft cover (after first removing the gib key, and the flywheel, and the injector pump, etc)
Nothing amiss, the bellcrank was free and not deformed, the governor sleeve was free to slide and rotate, the flyweights were free. WTF?
I held the sleeve while slowly rotating the crank and then found that one of the flyweight fingers became stuck on the sleeve, jamming the whole assembly.
A small, sharp burr on the sleeve face where the bellcrank roller rides is the culprit. It could be remedied with a few passes of a file, Quite easy except that the camshaft has to be removed in order to gain access for smoothing out the burr.
Maybe tomorrow.
Cheers
Hugh
JKson 6/1  (Utterpower PMG ) Off-grid
Lister 6/1 Start-O-Matic engine......running with PMG
1978 Royal Enfield (glutton for punishment by Indian iron)
1963 BMW R-27 project

mike90045

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Re: Gov stuck, any easy suggestions?
« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2021, 07:41:41 AM »
Any chance you can access it from a Lifter port, pull the intake lifter - is the hole big enough to get a tool in there ?

Hugh Conway

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Re: Gov stuck, any easy suggestions?
« Reply #4 on: January 26, 2021, 07:51:49 PM »
OK, success! problem solved. I had a look at the burr with a dental mirror, it looked like welding slag (?)
The governor sliding sleeve is about 1/2 inch inside of the block. Use of a file to remove the burr was out of the question as there was insufficient clearance. Last night the solution appeared in a dream. A miniature angle would do the trick without removing the camshaft. I have a Dremel tool. After packing everything with oily rags to catch debris, The burr was easily dealt with, and there was no need to remove the cam. The rags caught all of the grit (not much). Things move freely now, and it will be all back together after lunch.

BTW, here's a link to 38AC's excellent short vid on adjusting the governor linkage  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4otiDKDiyk

Cheers
Hugh
JKson 6/1  (Utterpower PMG ) Off-grid
Lister 6/1 Start-O-Matic engine......running with PMG
1978 Royal Enfield (glutton for punishment by Indian iron)
1963 BMW R-27 project

BruceM

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Re: Gov stuck, any easy suggestions?
« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2021, 04:16:21 PM »
Bravo, Hugh! Glad you were able to diagnose and fix it successfully.  Thanks for sharing your experience here.
Unusual to me that such a flaw would only show after so many hours.

I had governor sticking on occasion many years ago, but traced it down to terrible fit and finish of the sliding yoke piece that connects to the IP rack and the hole in the upper arm. I had to drill out and put in a bronze bushing in the arm, drilled to the fit the carefully smoothed pin.  The stock setup was loose, with the pin tilting in the arm and binding even after correcting the arm angle.




Hugh Conway

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Re: Gov stuck, any easy suggestions?
« Reply #6 on: January 27, 2021, 11:00:16 PM »
@BruceM
Yes, Unusual in that this is an start-o-matic engine from 1952. Not running when I bought it. I stripped it down, cleaned it, had a machine shop install new valve seats and guides. Also re sleeved the cylinder etc. I did not notice the cam problem on clean-up or reassembly. The stickiness showed up after running it. I cannot guess how welding splatter (if that's what it was) got on that sleeve. After cleaning the camshaft, I wrapped it up and put it aside for reassembly. I don't have any welding equipment, and the cam never left my workshop. As far as I can tell, it's an original Dursley camshaft, and it was apparent that when I got it, the engine had not been opened up for many years. It's a mystery to me. It is an unusual problem.

Usual problems are more like your binding yoke....I had the very same problem with my Listeroid, solved it the same way. It's still fine 2500 hours later.
Cheers
Hugh

 
JKson 6/1  (Utterpower PMG ) Off-grid
Lister 6/1 Start-O-Matic engine......running with PMG
1978 Royal Enfield (glutton for punishment by Indian iron)
1963 BMW R-27 project