why did you buy a listeroid, or why do you want one?

[mobile_bob]

it appears there are at least 4 camps relating to this question

1. those that intend to work these engines hard, and see them as a means to an end.

2. those that like to play with mechanical stuff, experiment, reegineer, and can't stand to leave as is.

3. those that just want to have a backup power source

4. those that just want an unusual engine to paint pretty and show.

5. install your reason here

it occurs to me that once i stepped back and thought about all the various motives behind having or getting a listeroid, it becomes apparent why some topics are so heated in debate.

to me getting an understanding of each of you in this regard, makes it easier to accept your position on different topics.

i will start off with my answer,
i bought the listeroid to be a source of power and hot water, running 2 hours out of every 24, dependably! without having to reengineer the damn thing. blue print? yes.. reengineer? no!
now that is just me, and i know i may come off as a bit wierd, but i have overhauled too many diesels over the last 31 years to want to reinvent anything i don't have to..  but again that is just me.

if i stop to think about it i can rationalize each of the other 4 positions,,, problem is that after a hard day making shit run or keeping it running for other folks, with a bad back and carpel tunnel in both hands, i don't stop to think that others might have other priorities.

so please, take a minute and pick a position, let everyone know your viewpoint on your listeroid, or if you are one of the lucky few a genuine lister.

bob g

[GuyFawkes]

Original Lister start-o-matic

As shipchief said, want an engine room, but there is more to it.

It is going to work for a living as soon as we move, fuel costs are high and getting higher, thinking about DC storage and inverters too to run all my computers.

[DaveW]

dependable backup power with less noise level, and diesel stores longer than gas.  Think Houston and hurricanes.

[t19]

Lister SOM - now sitting in my Garage.

I live in the country, and power can be a problem.  During the ice storm, the house I now live in was without power in the middle of the cold Canadian winter for 2 weeks.  During the great blackout it was without power for over 1 week.  I don't want to run everything in the house... but I would like water (by pump) my sump pump to work and some lights and the fan in my gas stove.

Everyone here told me all the horror stories.  The Coleman gensets lasted 12 horus or so in the cold, the Hondas are good but are limited too in  fulltime work.  The Geniac Natural gas units sold by Home Depot were designed for the states, and not the cold of Canada so many did not start.  I started looking at Listeroids, then got an oppertunity to get an original.  Mine will be tarted up for looks (JohnDeer Green and Yellow) and will be put to work.

I figure they got it right years ago, I just want it to work when I ask it too.

[bitsnpieces1]

12/1 Listeroid
#1 and #3 for sure, North Central Fl.  #2 to some extent,  love to play with it, experiment but can leave it as it is (after making sure nothings going to break). 
  Would need to add some things to accomodate some medical/physical problems I have.  Electric starter for one.  ?Full flow pressure lubrication?  Input physical work now to save mind bending pain later in the middle of the storm. 
 Experiment with alternative fuels out of pure cussedness.  Would like to get it to run as Rudolph intended (whichever fuel is cheapest and easiest to get).   
  Also as a test bed for ideas, start with a known good design and work up for different end applications. 

[JohnF13]

O.K. Mr. Global Moderator - gotcha beat by 9 days!  We were out of power for 23 days after the ice storm.  As you noted, being in the Country in Canada has its "challenges" as far as reliable power supply is concerned.  I vowed it would never happen again but it took a few years (and a few more power outages) to figure out the solution.  I cut my umbilical cord to the Provincial power grid last week and I am now totally dependant on my Listeroids, both for power and battery charging.  So I guess the answer to Mobile Bob's question has to be #1 - my engines work hard and I view them as tools.  As such I'm not much interested in the "roller rocker" discussion nor in other people's interminable and increasingly ludicrous suggestions as to how a Listeroid can be "improved".  Mine work well in their original configuration, thank you.  The problem with a lot of people on this list is plain overthinking.  Yes, I have to do some tweaking, but where would the fun be if I didn't?  The extent of my improvements will llikely be the addition of starters (already done) bypass oil filters and the regualr changing of "wear parts".   I am in the fortunate position of being able to have spare engines on hand but quite frankly, if anyone is interested in the same scenario as me - total indepence - then that is an expense that is necessary to bear.  Last thing I need is my dearly beloved looking daggers at me because a light won't come on when she flicks the switch!

Last thing - I do run on Waste Veggie oil 99% of the time - stop and start on BioDiesel.

Happily independent,

[cujet]

I wanted reliable back up power. In addition, I want to work the engine hard as I have thousands of gallons of waste fuel. So the answer is two fold.

Chris

[wldhoss]

This time next year I will be homesteading land i own Down River on the Salmon, 55 miles from Salmon, Idaho and 35 miles from power poles. The Frank Church River of No Return Wilderness is out the back door and the Selway-Bitterroot wilderness is out the side door.  Together there is over 3 million acres of roadless area, the largest roadless area in the lower 48. 
I needed engines that are efficient,simple,cheap, quite, and sound good.  Living in a river canyon there will be two months in winter with no direct sun, because of the high canyon walls.  The listeroids will be generating and battery charging.  I'll also use some solar. I can't wait!!

[rpg52]

#1, a reliable power source for a sawmill I am still building.  Have a 21 KV line going right past my house, so I could have run a line to it, but didn't want to trench and lay several hundred feet of underground cable.  Already have a 12 kw st gen head run off a Detroit Diesel 3-71, but it makes too much noise, and the little Honda generator does too, plus I wanted a diesel.

[Jackpine Savage]

My interest is in a backup power source. We live in a rural area in central MN, extended power outages are possible, ice, snow, etc. I was also interested in a power source that I could work on and maintain, just in case the world really does go down the tubes.

I am also interested in alternative fuels. An oil press is on my wish list, and I hope to plant some canola next year.

Oh yeah, I received a 6/1 GM-90 from Mike about 5 weeks ago. Unfortunately my generator head is still someplace between here and Texas.

[rsnapper]

Dependable backup power source here. Think Hurricane Katrina. We got power back on in two weeks, and we were ahead of LOTS of homes.

[rjcroc]

If you see one, hear one run, have any respect for engines, you gotta have one period. I have grid power where I am but justified getting one by deciding that I could power the barn for now. The overhead lines were taken out about 12 yrs ago. The final resting (running) place will be in the Gila nat'l forest, I have grid power on the property but if you watch the wild fires out west there is a need for backup power.If that is not a good rational for a listeroid then a got one cuz I could and have a good source for wvo.

Rick

[Doug]

When its late at night and I'm at work with nothing to do I watch the metering on the main incoming feed. Its not a prety sight anymore I see dips and transients that only a few years ago didn't happen. Our utility system is under duress. I sat out a storm two weeks ago un the dark for 5 hours this never happened in this part of Ontario, at least not every summer. And thanks to climate change ( or insert other reason for wacky weather ) we get blistering geat up here now, brown Christmases ( and the possibility of ice stroms that come with it), and believe or not tornadoes ( never had a tonado here in my lifetime unitll two weeks ago ).

So I think everyone should have generator, 20 gallons of reserve fuel a couple of weeks of dried goods and canned food, potable water on hand or well as in my case. The Petteroid holds the promiss of standby power and a , little heat scavenged from the cooling system in a package that easy to repair on the spot....

Doug 

[Rtqii]

I am getting ready to buy a 20/2 - It will start out it's long life as the primary "grunt" power for an off-grid construction project. I will run it outdoors with the skid bedded in sand and chained down to ground anchors to prevent walking (and with a jury rigged cooling system)... It will be mixing concrete, compressing air, and running power tools (circular saw, rebar cutter etc.) during break in. The energy produced will go into building its permanent (we all hope) home. The first job it will have will be to mix a few yards of concrete to pour the permanent engine mount blocks and vibration isolated slab floor (you can't machine stuff accurately if your floor is vibrating). Once the engine house is roughed in I will lift it with the backhoe/grader, and get it through the door...  Another lift with an overhead equipment hoist, and set it onto the mount... Grout and bolt it down securely.

I actually see the need for a second engine of lower HP to serve as a backup and for light duty... The engine house is being designed with room to tear engines down (full walk around access with raised engine & equipment mounts placed down the center line of the room) and a hoist system on I-beams to move things like engines, cylinders, flywheels, genheads, compressor heads, cranks, etc. off the mounts and onto workbenches. I will put workbenches down one side with big windows, and on the other side I will have shelves for a battery bank, power cabinets, inverters, storage. I will have a few solar panels on the roof, but the horsepower for this homestead is going to come from slow speed diesels that can be overhauled in place, burn multiple fuels, and hopefully share parts.  This way I can tear an engine down and overhaul while a second engine is supplying power for grinders, parts washer, you know the drill  

The second phase is to put up a connecting shop/laboratory/storage building (moderate sized pole barn with straw bale walls, the engine house will be cinderblock)...

Give me a few years, I will use that 20/2 to mix concrete for the foundation of my house.

I am going to try to buy an abandoned jojoba plantation to set this up on.  Jojoba is a wild "oilseed" (really it contains no oil, the seed is 50% by weight a non-edible liquid wax, no glycerides, no fatty acids)... In the 1990's agri-investors took many hectacres out of cotton production in the Southwest US as the water table dropped and tried cultivating native jojoba on a commerical scale. Jojoba grows in the desert wasteland without irrigation but there were a number of problems: the payback time on plantations takes 20-30 years, they seeded wild varieties with uneven yields and requirements, then they hit a couple of bad frosts back to back that killed the young plants... Today there are thousands of acres of abandoned plantations that have mature plants established, but the nuts produced per acre will not support commerical harvesting. These plantations can be rehabilitated by tearing out the male plants (which produce no seeds) and the low yeilding female plants and gradually replacing them with clones developed by the University of Arizona.

Burning oil in a slow speed diesel is a lot cheaper than solar panels... And this oil comes from the sun without irrigation in what is now considered waste land which can be bought as low as $50 an acre. I may have to haul water, but most of this land had wells, tho they no longer produce enough water to support cotton.

I love to tinker and build things... Best to work on my own engines rather than someone elses I also have a high energy physics lab in storage... I have patents I need to work on, prototype equipment I need to build, test, and run... And I need 6+ kilowatts of flywheel delivered electrical energy to do that work.

http://www.nic.funet.fi/pub/sci/electrical/tesla/pictures/rq/rq_a800.gif

I am shooting for it all. Besides, this gives me an excuse to run a big, cool, engine (two actually)

http://listerengine.com/smf/index.php?topic=808.0  <-- But it starts here, a backhoe, rebar, and a few yards of cement, sand, and gravel... And I am not mixing it in a wheelbarrow!!!!

[mobile_bob]

hmmmm,   fascinating responces so far.
actually a bit surprising, tell ya why later


bob g