Author Topic: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab  (Read 35896 times)

ajaffa1

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #75 on: December 31, 2017, 10:16:30 PM »
Hey guys, Happy New Year to you all. I`ve been busy cutting up fallen trees for a week so no progress on the rebuild.
Found these two engines on gumtree the first is lister S?1 possibly startomatic the second is a southern cross I think. Both are in Northern New South Wales, should suit Glort if he`s coming up this way soon.
Bob

ajaffa1

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #76 on: December 31, 2017, 10:18:53 PM »
don`t know what happened there, only posted one picture so here is the other.

dieselgman

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #77 on: January 01, 2018, 02:32:13 AM »
Could be SR1, maybe also LD or LR or SL as they all have quite similar outward appearances.

dieselgman
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ajaffa1

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #78 on: January 06, 2018, 02:18:48 PM »
Thanks guys for all the support, Haven`t been able to make much progress but have done a lot of cleaning and painting. I now have a bench covered in shiny new looking parts.
I examined the cylinder head and found that it has corroded/worn to about 30 thou in the piston compression area. Would it be safe to have thirty thou skimmed off it? I checked how far below the cylinder head the surfaces of the valve faces are and they are both around 100 thou, so skimming the head would bring them back within tolerance.

ajaffa1

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #79 on: January 08, 2018, 09:20:49 AM »
Hi guys, Just in case you think I`ve been slacking off here is a photo of my crankcase dry assembled.
Bob

dieselspanner

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #80 on: January 08, 2018, 02:52:24 PM »
Looks like proper one!

Nice job.

Stef
Tighten 'til it strips, weld nut to chassis, peen stud, adjust with angle grinder.

ajaffa1

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #81 on: January 09, 2018, 07:08:36 AM »
Thanks Dieselspanner. Still hoping someone on the forum can tell me is it`s safe to skim 30 to 40 thou of the cylinder head. I should be able to shim up the cylinder to achieve a suitable bump clearance.

Bob

AdeV

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #82 on: January 10, 2018, 04:35:59 PM »
Thanks Dieselspanner. Still hoping someone on the forum can tell me is it`s safe to skim 30 to 40 thou of the cylinder head. I should be able to shim up the cylinder to achieve a suitable bump clearance.


I can't see any reason why it wouldn't be safe - although that's quite a skim (nearly 1mm @ 40 thou). Does it really need that much? Main changes would be: Increased compression due to smaller combustion chamber; possibly you might need to recess the valves by a similar amount to avoid striking them with the piston, although IIRC the piston doesn't come that close to kissing the head in a Lister anyway? And again IIRC (haven't looked for a while), it's a flat head?

Skimming the top/bottom of the barrel would be better, if that cures your issue; the barrel can be shimmed with copper shims as appropriate.
Cheers!
Ade.
--------------
1x Lister CS Start-o-Matic (complete, runs)
0x Lister JP4 :( - Sold to go in a canal boat.

starfire

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #83 on: January 11, 2018, 05:27:28 AM »
Ummmm no, not always, Compression only needs to be enough to cause ignition via the heat produced. Any more than this actually reduces power output, as much of the developed power is used to compress the next power stroke. My 3.5hp Lister is very much more capable when running with the COV out, and will struggle with the same fixed load when the COV is wound in. Unlike a petrol engine, the cylinder pressure is largely constant over the power stroke as fuel, and combustion continues as the injector squirts, fuel burns and is available over a longer time. The same high compression benefits are not so pronounced with a diesel. Turbocharging a diesel does produce more power, not  because of any raised compression, but because there is more air to allow a longer burn.

dieselgman

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #84 on: January 11, 2018, 03:47:43 PM »

Any increase in compression is a good one.

Don't think the valves on these things are near an interference fit.
Bring the thing up to TDC and push down on a valve and see how much movement there is. Pretty sure even like that you'll get more than 1mm on these things.

Be careful about that valve clearance assumption when setting up a new engine and figuring your valve lash. On our 18/1 engines it is possible to hit the valves with the piston crown.

dieselgman
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ajaffa1

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #85 on: January 12, 2018, 11:28:57 AM »
Hi Guys, I put a straight edge across the surface of the head and measured the divot in the head at 30 thou, so a skim of 30 thou plus is inevitable. The valve heads are circa 100 thou below that so reducing the head surface would bring them back to circa 60 thou below the head surface, this would be well within tolerance and shouldn't cause interference with the piston.
I guess we will just have to try it and see what happens, I`ll let you know.

Bob

mike90045

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #86 on: January 12, 2018, 07:07:21 PM »
Hi Guys, I put a straight edge across the surface of the head and measured the divot in the head at 30 thou, so a skim of 30 thou plus is inevitable. The valve heads are circa 100 thou below that so reducing the head surface would bring them back to circa 60 thou below the head surface, this would be well within tolerance and shouldn't cause interference with the piston.
I guess we will just have to try it and see what happens, I`ll let you know.

Bob

Is the divot in the gasket sealing surface?  is there enough meat around it the gasket would still seal ?  30thou is pretty radical

ajaffa1

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #87 on: January 13, 2018, 11:31:17 AM »
Hi Mike 90045.
Sadly the corrosion/wear has taken a chunk out of the gasket surface. It isn`t as bad as the 30 thou in the compression zone and could probably be removed with a 15 thou skim. I don`t know what this engine was run on but I suspect that something like hydraulic oil was used which would explain the excessive wear to the piston crown and head. It could just be that it`s done a lot of hours but the lack of wear on the crankshaft suggests otherwise.

dieselgman

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #88 on: January 13, 2018, 02:04:41 PM »
Hi Mike 90045.
Sadly the corrosion/wear has taken a chunk out of the gasket surface. It isn`t as bad as the 30 thou in the compression zone and could probably be removed with a 15 thou skim. I don`t know what this engine was run on but I suspect that something like hydraulic oil was used which would explain the excessive wear to the piston crown and head. It could just be that it`s done a lot of hours but the lack of wear on the crankshaft suggests otherwise.
Soft cast iron will really erode quickly under severe service, it also does not do very well with constant water contact. The OEM crankshaft journals will live well beyond the rest of the engine unless they are subjected to a lot of dirt in the oil or water contamination. I have built a lot of them up from units left out in the weather for decades... cylinders and heads almost always replaced - bottom ends usually survived with minimal damages. The quality of steel and hardening of original parts is of very high quality.

dieselgman
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Apogee

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #89 on: January 14, 2018, 12:07:41 AM »
Ajaffa1,

Beautiful job so far!  Perfect choice for a rehab project.  As Glort pointed out it's 99% mental and I'm sure you will be back to normal soon.  One thing to keep in mind is nerve damage takes a very long time to heal.  It's not something that is gone is a few weeks.  A year or two would be an appropriate timeframe to expect.  Having suffered a neck broken in multiple places, you could easily have suffered cord damage that will take much longer than expected to heal.  It's a pain in the back side, but it is how it is.  You might ask your doc about supplementing with vitamin B because the nerve sheaths are primarily made up of the stuff.

Regarding your Lister, what did you end up using to get the crankcase so clean?  I have multiple old engine projects to tackle at some point so the knowledge would be very helpful.

Again, beautiful work!

Wishing you the very best in your recovery and an excellent 2018!

Kind regards,

Steve