Author Topic: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab  (Read 35889 times)

dieselspanner

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #60 on: December 12, 2017, 03:35:36 PM »
Drilling small holes to stop cracks spreading and getting out of hand is old, old tech.

Check out the female reproductive organs.........

Stef
Tighten 'til it strips, weld nut to chassis, peen stud, adjust with angle grinder.

mikenash

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #61 on: December 13, 2017, 06:34:37 AM »
Hi Folks, haven`t posted for a couple of days, been crook (Oz for sick).Another round of visits to doctors, more expense, more time without work, no closer to a diagnosis. What a crock of sh1t. Got to go for another MRI scan more blood tests & etc.
Symptom: loss of feeling/numbness in hands and fingers shooting pains up my arms.
History: broken neck 12 months ago. Stiffness and pain ever since.
Doctors suggested diagnosis: celiacs disease, poisoning, alcoholism, vitamin deficiency, smoking.
Thank God none of these highly paid individuals service diesel vehicles or the entire Australian transport industry would grind to a halt.
Back to the main topic. Managed to haul my cracked crankcase to a series of engineering shops. Prices varied from $50 to over $200. Further conversation with these welding experts revealed that none of them planned to pre heat the casting, no annealing after welding, no peening of the weld, no facilities for a controlled cooling.
My crankcase is now back home. I have access to oxy-acetylene but no confidence to braze it myself. So I propose to do what I do know how to do, (an engineers solution). Today I ordered a pack of JB weld (very strong epoxy adhesive). I plan to make a 1/2" steel plate that I will fit to the back of the crack. I will grind and shape it to be as close a fit to the back of the cracked area as possible. I will drill a hole in each corner. I will then clamp it in place and drill through it into the crank case. I will tap the holes in the crankcase. I intend to score the steel plate and crankcase before applying JB weld and bolting. The following day, when everything has hardened, I will V-out the front of the crack and fill with JB weld.
This is not a perfect solution but requires no heat and should provide a lasting & invisible repair. I will post photos as I go.
Thank you Mikenash and Dieselgman, both of you suggested drilling a relief hole at the end of the crack to stop it spreading. I will be taking your good advice before proceeding with my repair.

I`m not sure how we got off Listers and onto the subject of pickup trucks but for what it`s worth, in Australia all pick up trucks are called utes. They come in all sizes and shapes and are all now made overseas mostly the USA, Taiwan and Japan.
Sadly the government felt that it was not economically viable to support a local motor vehicle industry here. So we now have to import all our vehicles and provide welfare to thousands of skilled people and their families. Way to go! The rich must get richer and the workers can go f*ck themselves. Who are the rich going to sell their products to when no one has a job?

Crook and cranky Bob.

I don't know if we have JB Weld here but American engineers seem to love it.  Must be good stuff.  I will watch with interest and hopefully learn something

ajaffa1

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #62 on: December 13, 2017, 11:27:37 AM »
Doctors suggested diagnosis: ..... alcoholism, .......


Getting out and doing things is the best treatment for physical recovery.  While I don't doubt the difficulties you face and the pain and frustration you suffer, You could still be worth off without any injury at all.

This looks a great project and I hope you keep us updated till it's completion.


Thank you so much Glort. It grieves me to know that you are also suffering health problems. You at least have found a doctor you trust. Every time I visit a GP I see someone I have never met before, so I have to spend most of my time explaining previous history leaving no time for diagnosis of problems
I will continue to post questions and progress reports
Doctors suggested diagnosis: ..... alcoholism, .......

That's a favourite fall back for doctors.
I have been Diabetic for a bout 10 years. Every time I have a blood test and a doctor who is not familiar with me and remembers will look at the results and tell me I have to cut down on drinking.

I'm lucky, as I point out with varying levels of contempt for the their Diagnosis, I'm lucky to have one drink a month.
When I have questioned the cause of the result that all makes them think I'm an alco, the usual response is to have another  look at the test results and cross referencing them with other indicators, conclude that it's not actually drinking that's the problem but rather a side effect of the diabetes Meds!!

You are right, if they were doing other things with the "Suck it and see" and see methodology, there would be big trouble which is amazing seeing they are dealing with peoples health.  Don't know how many things I have been given and told " Try these and we'll see how you go and if you have problems with them we'll try something else".

I saw a specialist about 3 weeks ago that cost me $400 for a 30 min consult.  Told me 4 of the 5 last meds I had been put on I should have never been given and wanted to know who would do that.
The one Doc that I travel an hour to see because I have faith in him proved that was well placed. He was the only one that gave me the right stuff.

Getting out and doing things is the best treatment for physical recovery.  While I don't doubt the difficulties you face and the pain and frustration you suffer, You could still be worth off without any injury at all.

This looks a great project and I hope you keep us updated till it's completion.


. Thanks Mike, I did the prep work today,(see photos). I believe that this gusset with JB Weld will stabilise the crack without resorting to welding and the dangers of cracking associated. Yes JB Weld is available here. about $13 on fleabay.
Drilling small holes to stop cracks spreading and getting out of hand is old, old tech.

Check out the female reproductive organs.........

Stef
My experience of female reproductive organs is that they heal over in time, no need for welding. peening or heat treatment, Just time.

So few photos to show progress:

dieselgman

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #63 on: December 13, 2017, 02:12:55 PM »
I like your gusset solution plus the relief hole. The casting should be stable with that installed and tightened. The JB Weld is not something I would use on cast iron in that particular type of repair... but it surely will not hurt anything.

dieselgman
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ajaffa1

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #64 on: December 18, 2017, 08:57:03 AM »
G`day everyone, The JB Weld finally arrived today, so I have used it as a bonding agent/filler for the gusset I showed earlier.
I believe that this will produce a strong and lasting fix without having to resort to welding/brazing with the inherent danger of further cracking. See photos. Got to wait overnight for it to harden before finishing/painting.
I have used the time while waiting to continue with the cleaning process, I now have a bucket full of shiny nuts, bolts, washers, and assorted fittings.
All going to plan, will have to wait till new year to start ordering new parts.
Bob

dieselgman

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #65 on: December 18, 2017, 02:31:16 PM »
Looks like an excellent repair to me. I suspect you will want to avoid putting any excess stresses on that corner when you mount the unit.

dieselgman
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ajaffa1

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #66 on: December 19, 2017, 11:43:35 AM »
Thank you so much Glort. It grieves me to know that you are also suffering health problems.

Well you sure got that right.  My problems are mental and grief related.  I have never had any physical problems anything like what you have and I would have said a while back that mental problems were BS and all in a persons head..... till I got and suffered with them.
It's hard to get better when you don't care about anything, least of all yourself.

You sound like you have real motivation and drive and that's your biggest asset.

I looked after my father in law through cancer.  He was incredible. He had to do these exercise as part of his rehab after being bed ridden for months.
the Phisio told him to do the exercises so many times a day and when he could do them easily, make another appointment and he'd show him the next lot.
If father had to do them 3 times a day, he did them 15. I had to help him and he'd no sooner  do one lot, catch his breath and we were back at it.
After a few days he got me to ring the physio to make another appointment. Guy said must be doing them wrong, it should take him at least a week to get up to doing them properly, Bring him in and we'll see where he's going wrong.

Took him in, father reeled off a set and the guy was amazed.  Told me I would have never thought he would be doing that.  This went on several times.
Physio was in awe of him and said I can't understand how he's doing it. I said I can, he hates being sick and relying on other people. He'll get better or kill himself trying.

We went one day and the local first grade footy team were there who father idolised.  The physio got father to come meet them and gave them a pep talk and said father left them all for dead in how hard he worked on his recovery and he was a real role model.  After that, the physio would book father in whenever the bulldogs were coming in for their workouts and he trained with them which was a dream come true.
He went from hobbling along on on rail supports and a wheel chair to walking normally around the shops in less than a 1/5th of the time they predicted.


If you want to get better as you do, you will despite what the medicos tell you.  The mind is the most powerful thing of all. In your case it's a real asset.  Mine is the opposite. Physically I'm fine but there is more to incapacitation than the physical side.  You have to make the most of what you have going for you and that's the determination you clearly have. There is no Physio, pills or anything else that can match that let alone outdo it. What they expect of you is always the Minimum. If you treat it as such and always exceed it as far as you can you will get better in a fraction of the time. I saw my father in law do it first hand.

I bought myself a 12/2 today with a gen head kind of thinking of this thread.

I have been told to do something I enjoy and find an interest I can stick with. I couldn't be bothered doing much past getting out of bed for a long time.
The solar thing I have been playing with is pretty much a goal reached now. i don't think there is much more I can learn with it and now it's on the roof doing what I want, all I can do is add some more panels to the system and enjoy the free power.
I have another roid I could play with but I want something that I can play with running rather than fixing. I wanted a gen head for the 6/1 but haven't found one in years of looking. This one came up, 600Km away and I thought stuff it, I'm going to try that one as some of my rehab. I'll do a road trip with the Mrs south near the Vic border and make a weekend away of it.

When I get it back I want to set it up in the shed and see if I can make it as nice as your ST. I have always had this thing about power independence and this will fill that nicely. I have other gennys but this one will be  the icing on the cake.  Promised the Mrs to offload some of the others to make room for this one.  Might sell the 6/1 but I'll get rid of some of the China verticals I seem to have amassed first. From now on, water cooled engines only.
In two minds about my Merc engine. I won't need it but I have been talking about setting it up as a genny for years so I kind of want to complete that even if I offload the thing once it's done.

First thing to do will be clean the shed to make way for the thing. Still disorganised from moving in a few months ago. Mrs is partial to the new engine for the motivation to do that alone! :0)
I want to set this engine up in a multi configuration. I want it to be able to backfeed through the solar inverters if I want to play catch up and I want to put a transfer switch on the meter box so I can run the whole house off it. Not sure if I can wire the single phase gen head across all 3 phases but I can't see why not.  Only the AC is 3 phase, everything else is single, so I won't be able to use  the air but everything else should be fine. Might just be some creative wiring through the transfer but that will be something else to learn about.

I want to go north next year to Visit family and friends.  Maybe I could call in and see your engines in the flesh?
I think it won't be long before this one is finished and you are running round all over the place like nothing ever happened!



Hey Glort. sorry to hear you are suffering black dog syndrome. I have had it myself(my father passed away and I walked in on my wife fu**ing the next door neighbour in the 1990s). The hardest thing for any man to do is acknowledge that they have a problem. Men are supposed to be tough and anything less is considered weakness. What a crock of sh1t! I was lucky, I spoke to my boss at the time and he phoned my Brother, that night I tried to take my own life. I failed(just another in a long line of personal failures). I was collected from the local hospital by my Brother and delivered to the Priory Hospital in London. I spent six weeks as an in patient and twelve months as an out patient, I underwent a lot of therapy. I am very glad that I did. When I had my accident, and was disabled for months on end, the lessons I learned in therapy kept me sane.

So, you have already taken the first step towards recovery by admitting that you have a problem. Well done!
The next step is to seek out and find the help that works for you, even if it scares the sh1t out of you.

One of the things that my Psychiatrist told me was to think back to when I was 18 years old and imagine that I had a pile of pennies six foot tall, for everything good that happens add one penny to the pile, for everything bad that happens  take one penny away. When you run out of pennies it`s game over. Time to start stacking up those pennies.

My father told me that life is short and the way to a happy life is to find out what you like and then make sure you get plenty of it. Sounds selfish but still very sound advice.

I am very glad to here you have followed me in using your obvious mechanical abilities as a form of rehabilitation, I hope it takes your mind away from grieving and to a happier place. I look forward to seeing future posts of positive progress on the 12/2 and your own state of mind.

If you and the Mrs are out and about near Grafton NSW I would love to meet you, please send me a PM.

Bob



ajaffa1

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #67 on: December 19, 2017, 12:09:46 PM »
A quick update on progress. Hotter than hell here today so a good day for painting. Sadly I was running out of red oxide primmer, I had a full can of grey primmer and considered mixing the two but thought better of it when I realised that posting photos of a CS painted pink would probably get me banned from the forum as a demented, homosexual communist.
So one coat of red, one coat of grey followed by two coats of Brunswick green all hand painted in a day. These are all oil based and each coat was touch dry before the next coat, might give you some idea of how hot it is here. I`ll give her one more coat of BG before assembly and touch up as required after.

Bob

AdeV

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #68 on: December 19, 2017, 09:32:16 PM »
a demented, homosexual communist.

I'm pretty sure that wouldn't be the weirdest thing we've seen around these parts.....

Superb work on that engine BTW. At the rate you're going, you're going to need a collection of them to keep the rehab going. And I guess no-one will be complaining about that!  :laugh:
Cheers!
Ade.
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1x Lister CS Start-o-Matic (complete, runs)
0x Lister JP4 :( - Sold to go in a canal boat.

mike90045

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #69 on: December 20, 2017, 03:12:32 AM »
Will that red oxide oil based paint survive inside the crankcase with tepid motor oil sloshing around ?

ajaffa1

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #70 on: December 20, 2017, 09:33:42 AM »

This is going to be one smick looking engine!
Was 44 today on the outskirts of " Sidiney".  Funny you mention painting, I pulled out the paint I bought about 6 weeks ago to do the bedroom feature wall tomorrow. Too damn hot to go outside!

I would love to call in for a visit.  I always stop at Grafton on the way up to the Goldie at the strangest maccas I have ever seen.

Hey Glort, feel free to drop in any time, please just PM me first so I know to tidy up, wouldn`t want you to find me too drunk or dirty. There is a more normal Maccas in town at shopping world.
Good luck with the decorating, personally I hate decorating don`t have the patience to watch paint dry and moving all the furniture about, bug*er that.
No surrender,
a demented, homosexual communist.

I'm pretty sure that wouldn't be the weirdest thing we've seen around these parts.....

Superb work on that engine BTW. At the rate you're going, you're going to need a collection of them to keep the rehab going. And I guess no-one will be complaining about that!  :laugh:
Hi Ade, pink would just be too much, would have been funny though.
The rebuild is going ok but will slow down over xmas/new year. I`ve got an ever growing list of parts I need and can`t order them till January. I`ve also got to think about where to mount the engine so the noise won`t drive the wife mad. I`d  like to come up with a plan to make it mobile and possibly take it to the local show.

Just in case I run out of rehab projects I know where there is a similar sized Southern Cross air cooled diesel and a Lister L, both in need of renovation. I have also got a lead on a 3.75Kva generator head of the same age as the CS. Don`t tell Glort, he`s been looking for one for ages.

Bob

ajaffa1

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #71 on: December 20, 2017, 09:38:55 AM »
Will that red oxide oil based paint survive inside the crankcase with tepid motor oil sloshing around ?
Hi Mike, yes I checked with the manufacturer, It`s epoxy based and should be fine, it also has three coats of epoxy enamel over the top. Worked ok in my ST2 for the last two years.

ajaffa1

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #72 on: December 23, 2017, 05:22:51 AM »
Will that red oxide oil based paint survive inside the crankcase with tepid motor oil sloshing around ?
Hi Mike, yes I checked with the manufacturer, It`s epoxy based and should be fine, it also has three coats of epoxy enamel over the top. Worked ok in my ST2 for the last two years.
I know where there is a similar sized Southern Cross air cooled diesel and a Lister L, both in need of renovation. I have also got a lead on a 3.75Kva generator head of the same age as the CS. Don`t tell Glort, he`s been looking for one for ages.

Bob

Forget the gen head, I want the southern Cross!
What more Aussie engine could you have than that?  Is it a YB? they seemed popular.


Hey Glort, sorry I didn`t reply earlier. We had a mini cyclone come through here on Thursday evening. Power out. telephone blew up, trees down every where, roads blocked and flooded. Normal unpredictable Australian weather.
The old Lister ST2 ran like a charm but the residual current breaker didn`t like the water pump starting up, kept tripping out, had to bypass it. Wife had a fit at me for playing with electrics in the pouring rain.
Spent all day today cutting up fallen trees, should have enough firewood for several years.

That Southern Cross motor is an air cooled single cylinder painted light grey, probably an ETB, late 50 or early sixties at a guess. Don`t know if the guy would sell it, he did ask me if I would consider restoring it for him. It`s up north west of Brisbane.
Should have known you`d like that. Being a Pommie I just take it for granted that everyone likes old British stuff.

I`ve got a mate who goes all over NSW and QLD fitting solar systems for farmers. I`ve asked him to keep his eyes open for barn finds. I`ll let you know what he comes up with.

So to my CS rebuild, haven`t had much time but I did manage to strip the injector and pump. Injector cleaned up pretty good and is now in a jar of clean diesel until needed. The pump is toast, the rack is badly worn and the lugs on the element are snapped clean off. I guess It was left outside and someone decided to try to free the rack with a hammer.

So to questions: I can get a replacement Bosch pump for about A$90 or I could get a Bryce or CAV for three times that price any advantages in using the more expensive items?

Does anyone know the diameter of the holes in either end of the rack on a Bosch. is it the same as the originals? I`ve tried to measure what`s left of the connecting pins on the govern assembly but they are so corroded that they could be 3/16", 13/64"
or 5mm. I was planning to order some silver steel and make replacement pins myself. I don`t have a problem with reaming out some of the linkages and fitting bigger pins but that ain`t going to work for the rack It`s just too bloody hard.

I`m not expecting to get much in the way of response at this time of year, hope you`re are all too busy plucking Turkeys.  eating mince pies and consuming industrial alcohol.

Merry Christmas to you all,
Bob


basewindow

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #73 on: December 23, 2017, 08:38:12 AM »
I replaced my orginal pump on my cs with a Bosch unit. It only has holes on one end of the wrack so you cant use the excess fuel pawl. The inlet to the pump is smaller than the original banjo as well,  so make sure you order a new pipe for between the pump and the filter if it doesn't come with one.
On the governor linkage side everything seemed to fit back together with original parts no problem.
Starts perfectly without the pawl, but I guess its not quite 'original'.
Cheers,
Cam.
1953 CS Lister 3.5hp, 1938? Bamford SD1 3.5hp, 1962 Fordson Super Dexta, 1969 International 434.

dieselspanner

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Re: Lister CS 6/1 as form of rehab
« Reply #74 on: December 23, 2017, 03:16:19 PM »
Cam is right about the banjo being a different size, I've had a couple of 'Indian' IP's and one is better than the other, no leaks. The second, non leaking, one was so full of some sort of preservative / assembly grease I had to strip it down and clean it out. What it was I've no idea but it wouldn't wash through with diesel.

I've nothing to compare performance with but my tin ear say's it's somewhere close to good enough!

I might be teaching you to suck eggs but when you set the timing wind the adjuster bolt down and work up, if it binds on over adjustment it'll be expensive. 

Have a good one, one and all.

Cheers Stef
Tighten 'til it strips, weld nut to chassis, peen stud, adjust with angle grinder.