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Author Topic: Governor problem, help/comments welcome  (Read 11738 times)

cujet

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Re: Governor problem, help/comments welcome
« Reply #15 on: July 08, 2006, 07:44:38 PM »
I corrected a miswording in my post. Otherwise, I know what i meant to say :)

In my experience, the OEM spring has been so far off what is necessary it is not even funny. 45 to 75HZ was what Bruce was getting with his OEM spring.

Chris
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JohnF13

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Re: Governor problem, help/comments welcome
« Reply #16 on: July 08, 2006, 09:18:27 PM »
Pat:

While it is possible that the weights are not well balanced, it should not be enough to make a difference.  When you have a look at the weights it seems that they are all cast in a similar mould - they all look as rough as each other.  Some people recommend taking the weights out, polishing, drilling them out and filling with lead to make them heavier - I'm not sure this is necessary.

Something is making your govenor rack bind, it could be as simple as a slightly bent rod, or as complicated (not really!!!!) as a dropped pin on the govenor wheel.

Give me a call if you can't find the culprit.

cujet - I used to be a big fan of changing the springs to longer and softe ones, since I have started using the mod kit on all my engines it seems to be no longer necessary - I'm thinking that the "straight line" spring and bolt arrangement helps a lot.

John F.
John F
2 x 6/1 JKSON.  1 x 10/1 JKSON, 1 x 27hp Changfa, 1 x 28hp AG295, 1 genuine 1939 SOM, a couple of others in test mode and a Hercules Multu-fuel still in the box.

Jim Mc

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Re: Governor problem, help/comments welcome
« Reply #17 on: July 08, 2006, 09:20:46 PM »
...I doubt it is just a spring issue, Will check the weight pins and let you know....



Why do you doubt it is "just a spring issue"?  Jeesh, if you want to tear into the engine to inspect the flyweights, be my guest.  But I don't see why you won't experiment with the spring first.  Maybe you like doing things the hard way?

Had the exact same problem with my Listeroid.  Changed the spring to a longer, weaker spring.  Had to move the stationary mounting point a tad, and the governor performance improved a lot.


albany dbd

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Re: Governor problem, help/comments welcome
« Reply #18 on: July 08, 2006, 10:29:06 PM »
you can lead a horse to water but you cant make them drink.
class 5 steam fitter - millwright - class 6 code pipe and pressure vessel welder - fabricator.  oh and good old country boy from the farm. 
( Beat it to fit paint to match ) oh and X-ray of course

JohnF13

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Re: Governor problem, help/comments welcome
« Reply #19 on: July 09, 2006, 02:40:34 PM »
Quote:

"Why do you doubt it is "just a spring issue"?  Jeesh, if you want to tear into the engine to inspect the flyweights, be my guest.  But I don't see why you won't experiment with the spring first.  Maybe you like doing things the hard way?"

Hmm....I once spent about 5 hours and around $60 bucks in springs to get a particularly stuborn engine to perform the way it should, sometimes it's not as easy as it sounds.  Changing the orientation of the govenor mechanism (a.k.a. GB's UPGOV kit) costs about $10 and takes 5 minutes and uses the original spring, so which is easiest?  As for tearing into the engine to inspect the govenor mechanism, it is a simple job that shouldn't take more than 20 minutes.
John F
2 x 6/1 JKSON.  1 x 10/1 JKSON, 1 x 27hp Changfa, 1 x 28hp AG295, 1 genuine 1939 SOM, a couple of others in test mode and a Hercules Multu-fuel still in the box.

dkwflight

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Re: Governor problem, help/comments welcome
« Reply #20 on: July 09, 2006, 04:15:06 PM »
Hi Group
I have been useing a lighter & longer spring.

http://s29.photobucket.com/albums/c294/dkwflight/?action=view&current=100_0155.jpg&refPage=&imgAnch=imgAnch1

Since shortning this spring about 1" the hunting is much less. I used some wire to shorten the spring just visible behind the oil line. The white is a pvc cap used to move the spring away from the crankcase stopping the rubbing.
The other factor is I am getting some hours on the engine, under load. Some say it takes 250 hours to achieve breakin.
Dennis
28/2 powersolutions JKSon -20k gen head
Still in devlopment for 24/7 operation, 77 hours running time

sid

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Re: Governor problem, help/comments welcome
« Reply #21 on: July 09, 2006, 04:44:19 PM »
 
Dennis... I noticed the ref, hose in the picture/// good use for old ref. hoses.I usually throw them away but I think I found a new use for them//sid
15 hp fairbanks morris1932/1923 meadows mill
8 hp stover 1923
8 hp lg lister
1932 c.s bell hammer mill
4 hp witte 1917
5 hp des jardin 1926
3 hp mini petters
2hp hercules 1924
1 1/2 briggs.etc

dkwflight

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Re: Governor problem, help/comments welcome
« Reply #22 on: July 09, 2006, 05:19:24 PM »
Hi I was experimenmting with an oil burner pump. The hoses were expedient for a quick experiment.
The hoses are carrying oil to a TP oil filter and returning to the oil pickup screen at the bottom of the sump. Not very effective due to low oil pressure at the pump outlet. Stricty  temporary. I intend to pick up a power steering pump and serpentine belt for permanent.
Dennis
28/2 powersolutions JKSon -20k gen head
Still in devlopment for 24/7 operation, 77 hours running time

altopro

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Re: Governor problem, help/comments welcome
« Reply #23 on: July 09, 2006, 05:23:51 PM »
John,

Quote
Why do you doubt it is "just a spring issue"?  Jeesh, if you want to tear into the engine to inspect the flyweights, be my guest.  But I don't see why you won't experiment with the spring first.  Maybe you like doing things the hard way?

Your absolutely are right! We will try reverting the spring first. Unfortunately, this engine is not in my shop, it's already in its final remote location. I just wanted to have as many things as possible to check.  I think it was a good choice to consider something else than just the spring. Having received many suggestions, we could now look at all of them, one after the other.

Will let all of you know of any progress. Thanks group!
 :)

PAT
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dkwflight

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Re: Governor problem, help/comments welcome
« Reply #24 on: July 09, 2006, 06:53:00 PM »
Hi I had the heads off a while ago. The hunting was worse for a while until I got the injecter lines bled out completely.
You should go over every thing.
Also the engine being at running temp. helps too. I think the weight of the oil has some bearing on how fast the engine responds to governor inputs.
Dennis
28/2 powersolutions JKSon -20k gen head
Still in devlopment for 24/7 operation, 77 hours running time

Jim Mc

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Re: Governor problem, help/comments welcome
« Reply #25 on: July 09, 2006, 08:26:54 PM »
...We will try reverting the spring first....

Keep us posted.  If you ever get a configuration where the engine hunts, that's not necessarily a bad thing.  It just means that you've a gone a bit too far with whatever change you made.  For example in the case of spring rates, if it hunts, find one a bit stronger and shorter. 

There is a definite 'sweet spot' in governor setup.  To far in in one direction, and the engine speed regulation is poor.  Too far in the other and it hunts.


dkwflight

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Re: Governor problem, help/comments welcome
« Reply #26 on: July 09, 2006, 09:51:51 PM »
Hi Jim Thats what I said. It was hunting a lot and I bled the injecters some more and it hunted less. The long spring( much weaker than stock) hunted some. Shortened it doesnt seem to hunt much at all!


It is much more sensetive and RPMs don't change much from full load to no load.
Dennis
« Last Edit: July 09, 2006, 09:53:25 PM by dkwflight »
28/2 powersolutions JKSon -20k gen head
Still in devlopment for 24/7 operation, 77 hours running time

BruceM

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Re: Governor problem, help/comments welcome
« Reply #27 on: July 13, 2006, 02:04:09 AM »
I installed the Utterpower governor kit this morning. Nice, easy, better looking setup. Alas, it didn't jazz up my lazy governor much at all. I'm going to mess with the linkage length and springs next.

Bruce M