DC Charging with 16/1

[vtmetro]

The part I thought was especially interesting was the 50% discharge provided a greater number of total stored amp/hours over the life of the battery bank than shallower discharge levels.

Since batteries are a high capital expense, that is an economic efficiency, by comparison with shallower discharges which yield more cycles, but fewer total stored amp hours. (or killowatt hours, if you multiply by the battery voltage. In other words, from the battery cost perspective, a lower cost per killowatt hour.

Incidentally, my local electricity costs about 10 cents / kwh off peak, and 20 cents peak. Diesel fuel through my Lister would cost more than 50 cents (using the figures of consumption provided here) for fuel alone, not including oil, maintenance, repairs.

It looks like fuel would need to cost about $1.20 a gallon to break even on fuel costs.

[Incredilion]

VT, you make really good points.
Funny, I generally charge my batts back up at around 50% or so, and once a month I'm supposed to (per my battery guy) let them get really low, as in 20%, then charge them back up.

Here; our power is at 8 cents a KWH, so it's real cheap. Using the Lister won't save me money, no way, but this for me/us in all in Preps, It's all about 100% self sufficiency, and I'll use the Lister exclusively in December, along with wind & solar, for what little solar is available here in December. Wind's a better catch for us in December, right now I'm makingbetween 9 & 20 amps off of the Jacobs; so it's carrying the house entirely. My house uses typically between 10 & 20 amps @ 48VDC at basic idle, when the TV's go off, it goes down to 8-12 amps, when people are up & about/tv's on etc, it can be as high as 30-40 amps.
Well pump draws around 50 amps, runs for 20-30 minutes a day, pumps water 500 feet vertically to a 3,000 gallon cistern.
Waste oil burner draws about 21 amps, but runs for between 3 & 5 hours a say, typically.
The tv's, they take too much power, and I have to have surround sound...;-)

I can get my draw down a LOT if I burn wood & be a little more careful w power draw.

I'll report back how much fuel & so on it'll take in December to run this house. The house is 3200 SF, at about 3100 feet in elevation.
Chris

[ronmar]

Can you elaborate on your battery guys reasoning behind the once a month deep discharge?  It has always been my uinderstanding that any time spent below about 30% charge isn't healthy for the plates in a lead acid battery as the sulphur is concentrating on the surface and possibly forming hard deposits...

[Incredilion]

Ronmar, I really don't know much about the technical aspect of it, he told me it was good for them to "turn them over", I think his words were. Kevin, my battery guy, is kown here in the PAcific NW as one of the best batt guys around. He's in Spokane, and really has no competition because if he tells you a battery is a 90% battery, you can bet on it.
I just do what he tells me, and my batts never get sick....sorry!
Chris

[BruceM]

What's a 90% battery?

I've looked long and hard at my old Johnson Controls literature, Trojan and specifically at Crown industrial batteries for information on recommended maintenance. There's nothing about deep discharging as part of regular lead acid battery maintenance.  Just saying it's sure not something I've seen anywhere. 

[ronmar]

It may be so that it creates the need for a good long bulk charge, and more time for the incomming high current to agitate the electrolyte.  I havn't studied large bank maintenance as indepth as some here have, but I also do not recall reading anything about this either...

[Incredilion]

Bruce-
Large batteries are measured by their precentage of amp hours taht can still be delivered successfully; a 90% battery can still deliver 90% of it's rated AH's. You can buy used batteries, large forklift batts especially, based on precentages. My 875AH set, that I bought a long time ago, were at 95% when I bought them, and they're still close to that now. The 1105 set I have was at 100% when I bought it, and I think it's still there, or close to it.

On the deep discharging, on a forklift battery, it generally gets discharged deeply every day; when someone's driving the forklift. That being the case, the electrolyte gets moved around, up & down, plenty, every day. Kevin has told me that it's a god thing to agittate it good with a deep discharge once a month, he's the battery guru, so like I said, I just follow blindly ;-)

[BruceM]

Interesting monsters, these forklift batteries!

[Incredilion]

They really are interesting, I like them because basically it's hard ot kill them. If you do get a bad cell, you can replace it for about $200.
That being said, the prices on used ones have skyrocketed, I paid $750 for my first set, abotu 7 or 8 years ago, and last year paid $4400 for the next one....the old one didn't go bad or anything, just part of my Preps, I ALWAYS want redundancy...or triple/quadruple....

Also, getting your hands on used ones is MUCH harder now, because of people dying to get them for their scrap value. You gotta be quick or know somebody like Kevin.

[Incredilion]

Hey I have a question for you guys....
My head gasket is leaking pretty good, I gotta replace it. That being said, I seriously doubt if I'm going to find anyone that can sell me a GM-90 16/1 head gasket, especially now that Montieth is unavailable.
 I looked at teh original head gasket that was on it, when I got it, (it's in pretty bad shape). That one is copper, has a ring around the cylinder & is pretty beefy. The one I have on it now is just some kind of gasket material.
Now, I can take the one I have to a gasket manufacturer, and I'm SURE for some ungodly obscene amount of money they'll make me a new gasket. Do I need to do this; or can I use something else & still get it done, right?

Thanks friends-
Chris

[dieselgman]

Please post an image with measurements... if it is close to a standard Lister configuration, we can replace with copper or composition materials at nominal cost.

dieselgman

[mobile_bob]

if dieselgman doesn't have a gskt to fit your animal
get ahold of "gaskets to go"

that dude can either come up with a gskt, or make them for you at an extremely reasonable price.

bob g

[Incredilion]

Bob, thanks, I appreciate it, and may end up taking you up on it. I did get pricing from Sensitive Industries in India for the gasket & a few other parts; it it doens't work out I'm on it with you.

Again, thanks-
Chris

[mobile_bob]

fwiw
the gaskets to go guy sourced me a replacement gskt for my s195 that was clearly much higher grade than the original

the oem gskt's would fail in testing when i would push the unit to 8kwe output, everytime the fire ring would split radially at the fold and that was it, leaking to the point of no restart.

the new gskts (i order a half dozen iirc) would not only take the 8kwe but also do so when i forgot to engage the electric water pump  and the temperature went up to 260F.  i thought sure that would kill the gskt if not the liner packing.   neither failed, and i have continued to use the same replacement since in testing.

having said that, i did not a tiny little weep at the top of the cylinder this fall when i drained the water and added antifreeze to the unit for winter... it was just a tiny shiny spot, but went away with a wipe and never returned... so it might have been something else, i can't say for sure.

point being if you have a tough to seal engine, the gasket guy can either source a higher grade replacement or make one to any spec you want.

if we can we really need to support his efforts, without him i have no idea how we could source some of these solutions.

bob g

[Tom]

I'm extremely happy with his 6/1 gasket too. Gary perhaps you could stock these to save the shipping time.