EPA compliant

[bandmiller2]

Could the listeroid type engines be made compliant without messing up their function.??Is it strictly an emission thing or are their outher factors. Frank C.

[dieselgman]

Certification is possible but generally deemed impractical due to initial and ongoing costs... this is not simply a matter of getting the exhaust clean but of proving it through the bureaucracy, paying all the fees and testing and samples etc. and of repeating the process every year. Also proving it will remain clean throughout the lifecycle of the machinery. Maybe 100k$ would do it... maybe even 50k$, but who has the incentive to do this? The deck is heavily stacked against us. You could spend all the money and still fail to clear all the hoops even with technically good clean engines. 

dieselgman

[bandmiller2]

Thanks Gary kinda what I figured,wish common sense prevailed in our government,but thats like eggs in your beer all the time. Frank C.

[LowGear]

The government guidelines are all written for the big billfold people.  They often write the guidelines for the government.  And we know who feels the pinch the hardest.

I'm not broke and about to lose my house so it's easy for me to say "Trading jobs now for long term health considerations is the only smart way to go."  It's like clean coal electric plants.  Incidentally, what is the name and/or location of those clean ones?  Is 2 or 3 cents a KW going to break anyone so that the coal plants can make their energy cleanly and still eek out a small profit for the stockholders?  If you lose your house due to medical bills what difference does not having a job make?

If the government would evaluate engines by "miles per gallon" rather than just per "gallon" we'd see far more diesels in this country.  I doubt that we'll move towards a power source that can be manufactured by operations that require less than a million dollars to get started.  The corporate state runs the planet.  Invest now and become part of the ruling elite.

Casey

[mobile_bob]

as stated the epa hurdles would require in excess of 50k dollars, however
it likely would take a half million bucks to do the alternations to a lister to make it have a chance at passing the first time... and that is one engine!

if i recall you must submit 3 or more such test engines to the epa for testing.

there is a reason the big boys are injecting urea, use special catalytic converters, particulate filters, computer controls, all on engine's that were light years more advanced than a lister to start with.

basically it ain't never going to happen.

anyone tells you different, better hide your wallet!

bob g

[fabricator]

I'd dare to bet my 8/1 running on clean dry veg oil beats any current emissions standards, I can run it against a piece of white paper for a week and it just turns it a little off white.

[LowGear]

To paraphrase Long John Silver just a bit:

"It's what they don't see what kills the lucky ones."

I happen to agree with your assessment just on the basis that if you represent less than 1% of 1% of the population and you're not playing with radioactive stuff - What is the PROBLEM?!

Casey

[mobile_bob]

running against a piece of paper is a good sign of low particulate, but does it
show the levels of nitrogen compounds?

there are all sorts of things that it must pass to meet epa standards,

one of which is a snap throttle test, granted we don't snap a throttle with a genset
however we do vary the load from no load to full load, and my bet is there is no
lister or listeroid that is going to be "paper" clean when subjected to this test unless you put in a governor buffer which would make for a severe voltage/hz droop going from no load to full load.

fwiw
bob g

[overbore]

EPA WISDOM?? Two words not allowed in the same sentence as the EPA is being used as a tool to protect vested interests--
VW Passat 78.5 MPG in the UK. Check it out and ask yourself why it is not here? 
The basic question, in matters like this is "Who Benefits"??

Laus Deo
overbore 

[BruceM]

Having the auto emissions tied to emissions per gallon instead of emissions per mile does seem like a serious mistake. The mileage is 65.2 mpg highway in US gallons.  Very impressive, and no hybrid BS. I agree- the public should make a very loud and clear message to correct this nonsense.

[ronmar]

Yep, always been mystified how burning more of something is good for the environment...  Reference mandatory alcohol added to auto fuel...  I drive a company truck(s) perhaps 20 hours a week.  We get fuel thru a cardlock supplier and keep mileage and fuel consumption records.  Our supplier held out in adding alcohol as long as they could , but eventually they had to shift to 10% ethanol additive.  That turned a consistent 19 MPG chevy truck into a consistent 17 MPG truck...

IMO, it is just the winter blend year round, as a 1-2 MPG drop in winter was normal...  And of course last year, when the alcohol subsidies were turned off to help pay for this now mandatory alcohol "additive", the price of gas went up the very next day...

[LowGear]

Gas prices are based on what "The Chumps Will Pay At The Pump".  Anything else is just extraneous malarkey (BS) to justify yesterday's decisions and behaviors.  I believe this dance is called Marketing.  My theory is that the pump price on New Years day 2013 is already written down.

Get PV, Wind, Hydro or something else you can produce yourself and buy an electric car in two years when new and improved ones come out making these current robber-baron models neo-obsolete.  If you can produce oil - buy a diesel.

Casey