Which Lister Engine should I buy!

[Zagato]

Hi I am new to stationary engines but love old engineering.  I use a 1962 Land Rover for daily use, and my toys are a Jaguar XK120,  a 1947 BSA M20, a Drascombe Longboat and I am building another Land Rover from scratch but my mechanical skills are limited - so I am learning fast! 

I would like a Lister for interest and to rig up to a saw bench to cut small logs.  The reason I have decided on a Lister is that they seem to be common, good spares back-up and cheaper compared to other makes.  I have followed a few A's and D's on E-bay to gauge prices but I think a CS 5-1 would be my first choice (they don't seem to come up to often).  The trouble is I have a narrow passageway and would have to knock down the back of the garage to get a CS into the back garden whereas I believe a Lister D is narrower.  So finally the questions.....

Would a Lister D be suitable to rig up to a saw bench and capable of chopping small logs e.g 10" thickness.   

I would really like a Lister CS 5-1 but my passageway is 34" wide MAX can I take anything off the engine to make it narrower.  Looking at some technical drawings they seem to be 37" wide i

Cheers Chris

[Tijean]

Turn the engine the other way! Max dimension is then the flywheel diameter and less yet if you take them off.

[compig]

The D would handle your log chores, and of course an A would too. As  Tijean suggests you could turn a CS around so that the widest dimension is the flywheel which is defo less than 34". The main benefit of a CS is no ignition system to worry about and you can run it on red diesel, heating oil, veg oil etc.
CS's appear quite often on ebay, and you only need a standard flywheel unit which are more common. Even a 3/1 would be more than adequate.

[Zagato]

That's great news  , thanks folks, a CS it will be then.  I am shying away from 3-1 as the parts are more difficult to get hold of apparently. No ignition system is definitely a bonus for me also, I had not thought of that.

Apart from frost damage is there anything else I should look out for.  How do you tell if it's any good or not.  Anyone know of one for sale.

Thanks again, need to start scraping the pennies together - again 

Chris

[compig]

Don't be in a rush to buy one, wait for an example that has not been stored badly. Then you won't have to sort rusted bores, valves, water ways, pitted bearing surfaces etc. Make sure all the governor linkages are intact. Preferably go for one that has been running or recently running. Despite ebay they still appear in Stationary Engine magazine so you could look there also. They are tough engines though, so will survive alot of abuse. Good luck and happy hunting.

[compig]

Here's a nice one,
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Lister-CS-3-1-diesel-engine-working-order-Oxfordshire-/300437209589?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_BOI_FarmingEquipment_RL&hash=item45f37401f5

3/1 though, but still nice

[Zagato]

Yes I noticed this one Compig (and thanks for all your help by the way, I havn't got a clue!) but discounted it because it is a £3-1.  Do you know if getting parts are really a problem, and isn't the 3-1 more complicated engineering wise. I suppose it would be cheaper than a 5-1, does it sound/look OK to you from the video - difficult to judge I know....

A nice looking show model 'A' went for £320 a couple of days ago, so I suppose this could be around the same price and perhaps a CS around £400 does that sound about right.

I like the fact it has a seperate rad.....less for frost damage perhaps.

Is this a diesel and would it be a real Lister not a Listeroid, are those the hit and miss governors on the outside......Sorry for all the questions! 

[Joe K]

Sorry for all the questions

Those who don't ask questions are destined to be told all the answers.   

Joe

[compig]

Yes I noticed this one Compig (and thanks for all your help by the way, I havn't got a clue!) but discounted it because it is a £3-1.  Do you know if getting parts are really a problem, and isn't the 3-1 more complicated engineering wise. I suppose it would be cheaper than a 5-1, does it sound/look OK to you from the video - difficult to judge I know....

A nice looking show model 'A' went for £320 a couple of days ago, so I suppose this could be around the same price and perhaps a CS around £400 does that sound about right.

I like the fact it has a seperate rad.....less for frost damage perhaps.

Is this a diesel and would it be a real Lister not a Listeroid, are those the hit and miss governors on the outside......Sorry for all the questions!

The A is a petrol engine. The 3/1 is a CS Diesel.  Listeroids are Indian made copies of the original Lister CS.
Non are hit and miss engines. Hit & miss only applies to early petrol engines and was a method used to govern engine speed.
Frost damage can occur just as easily in a rad cooled engine as tank cooled. The advantage of the rad cooled version is less coolant volume so anti-freeze can be added without it costing a fortune. Tank cooled engines have about 70 gallon capacity, which with a 50% anti-freeze to water mix would obviously cost alot !
Spares for the 3/1 aren't that difficult and practically speaking you shouldn't need any, well not due to wear anyway.
If you really would prefer a 5/1 though you only need to wait until one pops up, for that matter a 6/1 or 8/1 also.

[mike90045]

And if you wanted smaller footprint, the GM-90  @  6/1  750RPM could be an option
  check out

http://www.energymachines.ca    The mini-lister looks identical to a 6/1 but is 30% smaller and lighter

more info at this thread http://www.microcogen.info/index.php?topic=1039.0

[Zagato]

Thanks again for the replies.  The idea of getting an engine which could actually be useful in the future apart from just sawing wood is a great idea, however I am in a built up area with close neighbours so running an engine for long periods would not be an option   

So it comes back to the like for old machinery foremost and if I can use it for other uses this would be secondary.  Need to read up more about running the engines on Bio/veg oil etc and see if an old 5-1 will power 240 volts.  Think I have read it is doubtful for both!!

Time for some forum searches.................

[compig]

The CS Lister will run on a multitude of fuels, including BioD, WVO , WMO etc.
With power generation Watts are the important issue. You need a 6/1 to generate 2.5 KW. If you are seriously considering power generation go for a Lister CS Start-O-Matic. These are automatic generator sets ready to go, 2.5KW all day long. Have a look at the pix of mine on the Lister Engine Gallery link above.

[Zagato]

Thanks again 'compig' I thought I read on here one of the alternative fuels wasn't a good idea - perhaps long term damage, can't find the thread again but if you say they are OK on different juice that will do me.

The startomatics are 1k plus I think which is too rich for me so I will wait for a 5 or 6/1.  Hopefully I may be able to find a nice one, owned by somebody that knows about them.   So anyway we were talking about your 6/1 Compig, you know the one that is cluttering up your garage 

PS whats the difference between a 5 and 6/1 are parts availability the same?

[compig]

Sorry to say but my 'additional' CS SOM (Start-O-Matic) is already spoken for.
Difference between the the 5/1 and 6/1 is operating speed, 5/1 is 600 RPM at which it produces 5 HP, and the 6/1 is 650 RPM and 6 HP. Parts availability is more or less the same for both.
The CS is definitely ok on alternative fuels. The only issues that can arise are carbon build up on the injector and damage to the pump if the fuel used has not been filtered thoroughly. The latter only tends to be an issue with waste motor oil for obvious reasons. Injector fouling is easily resolved by periodic cleaning as required.
If you only intend to use the engine for saw bench work then fuel cost is not a factor, so diesel is the best option. Where alternative fuels are the major factor is in CHP work where the engine runs virtually 24/7, obviously in that application using pump diesel would be cost prohibitive.
I'll scan through the latest issue of SE mag to see if there are any CS's for sale.

[Zagato]

Thanks, all is clear now.  I still havn't managed to find a copy of SE so that would be much aprreciated.