Author Topic: The Redstone Diesel project  (Read 111224 times)

mobile_bob

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Re: The Redstone Diesel project
« Reply #60 on: June 26, 2009, 04:57:35 AM »
i am not sure it hurts or helps, probably a wash

what i do know is if you bring to market a product before it is ready, that will certainly come back to hurt.

what the guys are doing with their redstone product is really no different than GM keeping the wraps on
their new camaro, the keep it in house and flog the crap out of it to perfect it before general release to the public

John and Joel, certainly are not a big as GM (probably thankfully so), so they have to outsource their R&D.

seems perfectly reasonable to me.

besides anyone that is genuinely interested, ready/willing/able to buy a redstone now is likely going to be just
as much so when the general release finally rolls out.

the only way i can see delays hurting them is if there was a competing product ready for market, which clearly there
is not.

so i say, take your time fella's and get it as right as you can, and where you can't document it well so there
are few if any surprises down the road.

bob g
otherpower.com, microcogen.info, practicalmachinist.com
(useful forums), utterpower.com for all sorts of diy info

dieseldave

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Re: The Redstone Diesel project
« Reply #61 on: June 26, 2009, 05:03:15 AM »
   An information vacuum exists for the simple reason that only 20 engines have been imported (that we know about)  Lets suppose that they have sold half of them so far. One of those engines purchased might still be in the crate, some are being set up,a few are up and running,but the customer has not posted anything yet, here or on youtube etc. Very low numbers,when you think about it!

Tijean

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Re: The Redstone Diesel project
« Reply #62 on: June 26, 2009, 01:50:29 PM »
People always clamor for the juicy details but easily remedied problems are better privately rooted out and put into place in production without them ever hitting the tabloids. I have had a bit of experience working with prototype forestry harvesting equipment. Competing brands sales and PR people just love to get hold of every tid bit problem and blow it up. That is as it is.

I agree with mobile bob. Get the silly kinks worked out before you put the product out to your general market. You will get people whining about the delay, but not nearly so damaging as they would be if they had something substantial to latch onto.
Frank

10/1 Jkson, ST5 gen. head

dieseldave

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Re: The Redstone Diesel project
« Reply #63 on: June 26, 2009, 06:06:44 PM »

   With almost everything,some kinks wont show up for a while. eg. The Saturn. The main wire that connects to the Alternator being routed to close to the Exhaust Manifold. This caused a few fires. The media made it into a 'BIG THING' Easy Fix,Just move the wire!

JohnF13

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Re: The Redstone Diesel project
« Reply #64 on: July 01, 2009, 12:40:15 AM »
Well, that was quick - all of my Redstones are gone except for the one I am keeping.  Think I'll order a few more, looks like there is a need for them.
John F
2 x 6/1 JKSON.  1 x 10/1 JKSON, 1 x 27hp Changfa, 1 x 28hp AG295, 1 genuine 1939 SOM, a couple of others in test mode and a Hercules Multu-fuel still in the box.

apogee_man

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Re: The Redstone Diesel project
« Reply #65 on: July 01, 2009, 12:55:15 AM »
Congrats John!

Excellent....

Can't wait to hear more such as fuel usage and how they're doing once in the field.

Regards,

Steve

dieseldave

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Re: The Redstone Diesel project
« Reply #66 on: July 02, 2009, 05:43:57 AM »

   Still need more photos of the finer details!  Top of the water hopper cover would make a good location for the fuel filter for warm fuel.  Compared to a Listeroid, it appears that accessories can be added more easily on this engine.

prof.blink

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Re: The Redstone Diesel project
« Reply #67 on: July 03, 2009, 05:13:39 AM »
good evening all, a former member of this board and i have a mutual friend who has recentlly dismantled a redstone for inspection and corrective work. at first glance, it looked like a turn of the century hit and miss that was unearthed in a sub-way dig. after extensive mecanical scrubing,touch up grinding and trip to the after hours soak tank, things looked quite promising. problems so far was cam cover missing the outboard bushing and no provision for controling cam end thrust. after turning and pressing new bushing into cover,we discovered .030 thou runout at end of camshaft. as it turns out a spacer bushing between the cam gear and the injection cam was not sized and broached to fit over the shaft and 8mm key, but a piece of cored stock that measured 1 .183 was used to go right over the shaft and key and was over tightened . the new spacer was made 1 .023 id 1.500 od and .640 wide (.040) less than oem to allow the inj. pump cam follower to track c/l of cam. also the key that was fit was at least .080 to long and was bottoming out between end of key broaching on cam and washer under retaining nut. i thought it of some import to mic up all parts for width at 120 degrees that make up the cam stack before assy. the inj cam had a nasty burr that had to be corrected on the surface grinder. the washer under the retaining nut was disgarded because of the loss of .040 in stack height exposed the unthreaded portion of the shaft so a stepped washer was made up w/ .100 step to make sure of no false tightening.  will have to adjust some bolt holes in cover after final location and fit 2  3/16  dowel pins to keep it from creeping around. last thing check the gov fork on the shaft. we will re drill and oversize. will have to make new pin because the orig pin is ruined by poor pinning of the fork and lots and lots giggle. all else looks pretty good. too bad you could not get the bare castings so you could let them season then finish them stateside . if you get one of these engs cleaned up and detailed, it WILL go the distance, everything is big,thick and heavy. he should have it together soon . all in all, was much better than earlier anticapated. blink

apogee_man

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Re: The Redstone Diesel project
« Reply #68 on: July 03, 2009, 04:52:51 PM »
Thank you Blink!

Finally, some other real info from the field!

Blink, did you guys document with photos?  It would be nice to see what one of the "bad" ones looked like simply as a worst-case scenario. 

My assumption is Joel and John will resolve the production speed bumps moving forward, but it would be nice to see photos of the issues and the modifications that were made.

Doesn't sound like the things found were too bad.  Bit of hassle that's all...

I'm anxious to hear how it does once it's up and running.  Your buddy's impressions, fuel usage, noise factor, etc....

Thanks for the report.

Regards,

Steve
« Last Edit: July 03, 2009, 04:59:54 PM by apogee_man »

prof.blink

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Re: The Redstone Diesel project
« Reply #69 on: July 03, 2009, 11:55:37 PM »
ap man, pics were taken, but will not be posted because it would show less than the printed word. i think most of these units will end up being opened up and detailed by people who have close affiliations with the trades and are often in and out of shops and will have no trouble finding the help needed. most of the time, those shop visitors bring more to the table than the little bit of help needed on their lump of iron, in this situation, that was the case. as an after thought, the oil p/u screen is relitivly high the sump , and should be left that way at least until a few hundred hrs after break-in. blink

dieseldave

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Re: The Redstone Diesel project
« Reply #70 on: July 04, 2009, 06:24:26 AM »

   Just wondering here.  The Ford 'Model A' engine had a small compression spring to hold the camshaft against the back of the engine block. If this spring got 'weak' the camshaft would ride forward over the gear teeth.The teeth were cut at an angle for quietness. This would create a slight knock as it would cause the tappet to come down to quickly.  Just wondering if something like this would be a 'good fix' for this problem.   Or a spring washer!   NEED PHOTOS!

JohnF13

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Re: The Redstone Diesel project
« Reply #71 on: July 04, 2009, 11:19:54 AM »
I have a bunch of photos taken during a tear-down, I'm busy making them into a CD.  Apart from the sand issue (most important) the camshaft play is the biggest problem we have found.  It would seem that there "should" have been a shim in there to prevent excessive play but it wasn't installed.  It's a pretty easy fix but it should not have been omitted.  I'm talking to the Chinese now about a new order and I will be tightening up the specs as a result of people's findings.
John F
2 x 6/1 JKSON.  1 x 10/1 JKSON, 1 x 27hp Changfa, 1 x 28hp AG295, 1 genuine 1939 SOM, a couple of others in test mode and a Hercules Multu-fuel still in the box.

prof.blink

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Re: The Redstone Diesel project
« Reply #72 on: July 06, 2009, 06:42:27 AM »
jf13, just wondering if any other camshaft assys were inspected between centres or at least indicated in the block for runout at the end bearing surface? were all the other end bushings omitted pointing to the factory knowing there is a problem and an unwillingness and or not  being unable to take viable corrective action? die dave, light srpring and a ball, but there is limited space, we made a stepped washer from bronze .300 thick .005 below morton plug od  with .050 protruding into end bushing .010 less than bushing id. that will be adjusted when end cover goes on w/gasket. there is not much surface on the shaft end but w/ 1000 rpm or less and drive gears being straight cut, i think it will sufifiice. blink

JohnF13

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Re: The Redstone Diesel project
« Reply #73 on: July 06, 2009, 07:20:35 PM »
blink;

No others that I know of have any run out on the camshaft.  As for the end bushing, I'm aware of one other engine that had it omitted.  Several engines are now up and running giving good, stable power, it does seem that there were some problem children in this lot but the majority seem to be OK.
John F
2 x 6/1 JKSON.  1 x 10/1 JKSON, 1 x 27hp Changfa, 1 x 28hp AG295, 1 genuine 1939 SOM, a couple of others in test mode and a Hercules Multu-fuel still in the box.

dieseldave

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Re: The Redstone Diesel project
« Reply #74 on: July 06, 2009, 09:26:30 PM »

  Is that an end bushing on the Gear Cover? And if so, why?