Author Topic: autostart on chinese diesel  (Read 10388 times)

KellyR

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autostart on chinese diesel
« on: December 16, 2008, 05:26:16 PM »
Hello all,

I'm slowly getting my JD R180 back up.  On problem I have is that the key mechanism broke, which I replaced with a push-button start.  What I would really like is to hook the starting mechanisms into an autostart which would then run off of my inverter (Outback).  I've checked into add-on engine controls and the cheapest I've found is over $200.  Does anyone have any experience building an autostart/autoshutdown control unit from scratch?  Does anyone know where i could find schematics for something like this?

Thanks,
Kelly

mjn

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Re: autostart on chinese diesel
« Reply #1 on: December 17, 2008, 11:11:54 PM »
Hi Kelly,

I've built an autostart controller for my Changfa 195.  You can read about it at http://martin.nile.googlepages.com/automaticgeneratorcontroller

Unless you are really handy with a wire-wrap tool and programming, you are probably better off with a $200 commercial product.

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Martin
Changfa 195 7.5 kw ST.  WVO conversion http://martin.nile.googlepages.com/
Metro 6/1 DI Listeroid. Pumping water for fire control.
1933 Stover CT-1 hit and miss
1936 Farmall F-12 -- unrestored, still used to mow the field

KellyR

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Re: autostart on chinese diesel
« Reply #2 on: December 18, 2008, 03:54:11 AM »
Hi Martin,  I've seen your site and was impressed. I was hoping someone had some ideas that were a little less involved and using more off-the-shelf components.  I haven't done any programming since I was taught Fortran in high school.  I have found a control unit sold through a company called MTS.  It's supposed to replace the key start on the Chinese clones while also keeping track of the health of the engine.  It should also interface (with another relay) between my inverter and the engine, autostarting the generator when the voltage on my battery bank drops too low.

rcavictim

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Re: autostart on chinese diesel
« Reply #3 on: December 18, 2008, 09:55:44 AM »
Hi Martin,  I've seen your site and was impressed. I was hoping someone had some ideas that were a little less involved and using more off-the-shelf components.  I haven't done any programming since I was taught Fortran in high school.  I have found a control unit sold through a company called MTS.  It's supposed to replace the key start on the Chinese clones while also keeping track of the health of the engine.  It should also interface (with another relay) between my inverter and the engine, autostarting the generator when the voltage on my battery bank drops too low.

Kelly,

Can you please post a link to where you found the info on the MTS thingy?
-DIY 1.5L NA VW diesel genset - 9 kW 3-phase. Co-gen, dual  fuel
- 1966, Petter PJ-1, 5 kW air cooled diesel standby lighting plant
-DIY JD175A, minimum fuel research genset.
-Changfa 1115
-6 HP Launtop air cooled diesel
-Want Lister 6/1
-Large DIY VAWT nearing completion

mjn

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Re: autostart on chinese diesel
« Reply #4 on: December 18, 2008, 05:10:37 PM »
I have no idea what this costs, but this controller from fw-murphy looks like it will do the job:


You can read about it at:
http://www.fwmurphy.com/products/engine_motor/asm170.htm

--update--
I found a place that sells it for $375 ..
http://shopping.murcal.com/Catalog/Automatic-Engine-Controllers/ASM170-A99069-Auto-Start-Module
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Martin

« Last Edit: December 18, 2008, 05:13:51 PM by mjn »
Changfa 195 7.5 kw ST.  WVO conversion http://martin.nile.googlepages.com/
Metro 6/1 DI Listeroid. Pumping water for fire control.
1933 Stover CT-1 hit and miss
1936 Farmall F-12 -- unrestored, still used to mow the field

KellyR

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Re: autostart on chinese diesel
« Reply #5 on: December 19, 2008, 04:12:05 AM »
Here's the link to the control unit.  MTS has it listed as "Universal Add-on Auto-Start Control For All Manual Key Start Generator Sets."

http://www.mtspowerproducts.com/html/mcp_products/engine_controls/ECU-04.html

I ordered one yesterday for $135.95 with another $13 for shipping here to SW Colorado.  I think all I'll need is a relay I can get at RadioShack to get my inverter to autostart the generator.  Of course, I have to finish putting the engine/generator back together first.

rcavictim

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Re: autostart on chinese diesel
« Reply #6 on: December 19, 2008, 10:56:09 AM »
Hi Kelly,

I've built an autostart controller for my Changfa 195.  You can read about it at http://martin.nile.googlepages.com/automaticgeneratorcontroller

Unless you are really handy with a wire-wrap tool and programming, you are probably better off with a $200 commercial product.

--
Martin



Hi Martin,

I get a 404 , page cannot be found error to your hotlink given above.
-DIY 1.5L NA VW diesel genset - 9 kW 3-phase. Co-gen, dual  fuel
- 1966, Petter PJ-1, 5 kW air cooled diesel standby lighting plant
-DIY JD175A, minimum fuel research genset.
-Changfa 1115
-6 HP Launtop air cooled diesel
-Want Lister 6/1
-Large DIY VAWT nearing completion

wrightkiller

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Re: autostart on chinese diesel
« Reply #7 on: December 19, 2008, 01:48:34 PM »
« Last Edit: December 19, 2008, 01:50:07 PM by wrightkiller »

rcavictim

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Re: autostart on chinese diesel
« Reply #8 on: December 19, 2008, 06:03:05 PM »
rcavictim

Try it now it's working for me   ;D

http://www.mtspowerproducts.com/html/mcp_products/engine_controls/ECU-04.html

I was able to view THAT one. It is Martin's page I cannot access.  Thanx.

Heavy winter snowstorm is blowing through here now in Southern Ontario.  Roads around me will be closed soon if not already.
-DIY 1.5L NA VW diesel genset - 9 kW 3-phase. Co-gen, dual  fuel
- 1966, Petter PJ-1, 5 kW air cooled diesel standby lighting plant
-DIY JD175A, minimum fuel research genset.
-Changfa 1115
-6 HP Launtop air cooled diesel
-Want Lister 6/1
-Large DIY VAWT nearing completion

wrightkiller

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Re: autostart on chinese diesel
« Reply #9 on: December 19, 2008, 06:14:27 PM »
rcavictim    try this one    http://martin.nile.googlepages.com/
« Last Edit: December 19, 2008, 06:16:26 PM by wrightkiller »

rcavictim

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Re: autostart on chinese diesel
« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2008, 04:19:15 PM »
-DIY 1.5L NA VW diesel genset - 9 kW 3-phase. Co-gen, dual  fuel
- 1966, Petter PJ-1, 5 kW air cooled diesel standby lighting plant
-DIY JD175A, minimum fuel research genset.
-Changfa 1115
-6 HP Launtop air cooled diesel
-Want Lister 6/1
-Large DIY VAWT nearing completion

Veggiefuel

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Re: autostart on chinese diesel
« Reply #11 on: December 23, 2008, 04:08:49 AM »
Don't forget that you will need some sort of servo/solenoid to shut off the throttle.
The Changfa's and Launtops rely on the throttle closure to stop the engine.

The engine controller must open the throttle at start-up and release the throttle to the closed position when stopping the engine.

I am also planning an auto start system for my Changfa based on the ECU-05 from MTS Power Products mentioned earlier in this thread.
The controller has a set of contacts that can drive a throttle solenoid.

Anyone know what type of throttle actuator solenoid to buy??

Cheers,
Veggie
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mjn

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Re: autostart on chinese diesel
« Reply #12 on: January 05, 2009, 07:15:34 PM »
...snip...
Anyone know what type of throttle actuator solenoid to buy??


The Murphy RP2307B solenoid is designed to do exactly that.


Murcal has these available for $54 http://shopping.murcal.com/Catalog/Rack-Pullers/RP2307B-Push-Pull-Solenoid


The ECU-05 has an output that can be used to momentarily pull the rack closed to kill the engine.   On my Changfa 195, the best place to install this is directly on the governor fork where it meets the injector pump. 


In this picture, the fuel limiting adjuster has been removed. The green line points to the governor fork.  Pressing in on the fork will close the injector pump and kill the engine.  On my engine, the fuel limiting adjuster is useless, so eliminating it is not a problem.


Changfa 195 7.5 kw ST.  WVO conversion http://martin.nile.googlepages.com/
Metro 6/1 DI Listeroid. Pumping water for fire control.
1933 Stover CT-1 hit and miss
1936 Farmall F-12 -- unrestored, still used to mow the field

Veggiefuel

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Re: autostart on chinese diesel
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2009, 03:52:11 PM »
mnj,

Thanks for the tip on the Murphy RP2307B.
I have been looking all over the place for a solenoid. (Electric car door lock actuators, linear actuators, etc...)
The Murphy unit looks like the ticket.

On the Changfa, I was going to leave the "Red" throttle knob loose and use the Murphy to actuate the throttle lever between off and run positions.
I would make a "stop" to limit the throttle lever at the desired speed of 1800 rpm.
I was not aware of the governor fork behind the fuel limiting adjuster.
Do you think there is an advantage to using the governor fork instead of the throttle lever?

cheers,
Veggie
« Last Edit: January 08, 2009, 02:28:07 AM by Veggiefuel »
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Petersbpus

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Re: autostart on chinese diesel
« Reply #14 on: January 11, 2009, 09:01:20 AM »
Veggie,
here is link to my youtube posting of pre hurricane season test run of my Changfoid 1115 home backup genset,
There is a clear view of the Murphy soleniod setup about the middle of the video.
The linkage has an adjustable center link to set the HZ.
I use a spring clamp to hold the throttle open a little at startup for warming then engage solenoid for 1800 rpm.
the "Hold" coil goes on with the on switch, the pull coil is only monentary with push button
POI-- you are going to want a pull -  hold solenoid not a push pull

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZlTM5Wp9fqQ&feature=channel_page

If you want more detail give a shout.
Bob
Listeroid 6/1 in progress
Alllis Chalmers 60KW 3 ph
Changfaoid 12KW w/  auto shutdowns, modern AVR and panel
2nd Changfaoid 12KW Marine conversion w/ full auto shutdown and remote panel
Changfaoid 7.7 hp driving 5kw alternater /inverter,
other diesel gensets bought fixed and sold