New owner CS12/2 incl. Boat

[Tijmen]

Hi Guys

I am a proud new owner of a Lister CS 12/2 which is placed in an old original Dutch towing boat.
In the up comming months I will try to restore the boat and engine as good as possible.
I don't have much experience with engines, nor restoration of boats. I am 22 now (young of age  ) but I take this as a challenge.

Hope you like the photo's, I also wonder when the engine is build (serialn: 508102R5). Since I am confused about the new 'date system' from lister. Where I think the Lister is build after 1951?
Most serial numbers I came across on the forum are different then the one from my engine. Can somebody also state if the engine is in a good condition (compared to what you guys haveseen)? The engine runs, sound good (no weird sounds), and doesnt smoke alot. Engine was started at 2 degrees, only took 20 sec to start with a startengine mounted on the flyweel. After running for 1 min there was almost no smoke to see, so I think the ignition is good.

I couldnt make a test run with the boat in the water since it is stored in a warehouse. But I am optimistic that it will peform oke.
Below are some pictures.

Boat front
Engine overall
Engine top
Starterengine
Serial number
Compression valve
Clutch

[biobill]

Tijmen,
  Looks like a great project. Steel hull? I'm wondering about the center of gravity (right term for marine use?) as the engine appears to be mounted quite high. Does the craft have a history of successful operation? I'll bet that pilot house is a noisy place to be. Good Luck.

[rbodell]

Tijmen,
  Looks like a great project. Steel hull? I'm wondering about the center of gravity (right term for marine use?) as the engine appears to be mounted quite high. Does the craft have a history of successful operation? I'll bet that pilot house is a noisy place to be. Good Luck.

They were built that way and have a long history of service

[rcavictim]

Hi Guys

I am a proud new owner of a Lister CS 12/2 which is placed in an old original Dutch towing boat.
In the up comming months I will try to restore the boat and engine as good as possible.
I don't have much experience with engines, nor restoration of boats. I am 22 now (young of age  ) but I take this as a challenge.

Hope you like the photo's, I also wonder when the engine is build (serialn: 508102R5). Since I am confused about the new 'date system' from lister. Where I think the Lister is build after 1951?
Most serial numbers I came across on the forum are different then the one from my engine. Can somebody also state if the engine is in a good condition (compared to what you guys haveseen)? The engine runs, sound good (no weird sounds), and doesnt smoke alot. Engine was started at 2 degrees, only took 20 sec to start with a startengine mounted on the flyweel. After running for 1 min there was almost no smoke to see, so I think the ignition is good.

I couldnt make a test run with the boat in the water since it is stored in a warehouse. But I am optimistic that it will peform oke.
Below are some pictures.

Engine overall

Kool!  I have never seen a ship`s steering wheel used as a compression changeover valve knob! 

Seriously, you have a terrific project there.  I`ll bet your friends with their so pedestrian Ricer Civics with exhaust tips larger than the wheels will all be jealous.

With the global weather going nuts and all the devastating floods that are occuring,  owning some floating real estate is probably a good idea!

[Tijmen]

Tijmen,
  Looks like a great project. Steel hull? I'm wondering about the center of gravity (right term for marine use?) as the engine appears to be mounted quite high. Does the craft have a history of successful operation? I'll bet that pilot house is a noisy place to be. Good Luck.

Yes its a steel hull which is hot bolted together, kind of stitching. So the hull could be 70 or 80 years old, but I don't have any dates or information about the history of the boat.
The boat is an orginal Dutch type called "opduwer" (pusher), they where used between 1900 and 1940 to power sailingboats or other small freightships. Because placing an engine inside a boat was to expensive.
About the center of gravity, I think you can better call it just the turning point. Where the boat gets unstable and turns over. But I don't expect a problem.

Well the steering house maby noisy but thats what its all about!  The sound of the engine! If you hear this trough the exhaust with a slow rpm you get the real "baf baf baf" sound.
Thats a real 'head turner' in Holland when you are on the canal like in Amsterdam or Utrecht.
But I am going to place a seperation between the engine and the steeringhouse.

Kool! I have never seen a ship`s steering wheel used as a compression changeover valve knob!

Seriously, you have a terrific project there. I`ll bet your friends with their so pedestrian Ricer Civics with exhaust tips larger than the wheels will all be jealous.

With the global weather going nuts and all the devastating floods that are occuring, owning some floating real estate is probably a good idea!

Haha that would be easy to close the compression valve then! Just use a large wheel  .. haha no, got a steeringwheel and rudderstick attached to the same rudder.
Well I am going to place the steeringwheel more to the right and like i said above place a separation between engine and the rest.
Hopfully I would never have to use the boat in case of flooding. But yep I live under sea level 

Also can somebody tell me the build date of the engine? (serialn: 508102R5).
Do you guys have this back in the US/UK?
And btw, didnt know in the beginning that I can even buy new lister parts for my engine! So cool! Lot easier to restorate.

[listerdiesel]

"Also can somebody tell me the build date of the engine? (serialn: 508102R5) "

508 is the serial number

102 is a 10/2 engine (or 12/2 at 650rpm)

R is Radiator cooled

5 is the year of manufacture, added to 1950 = 1955

see:

http://www.oldengine.org/members/diesel/EngineDating/Techdata.htm

or

http://www.stationary-engine.co.uk/EngineDating/Techdata.htm

Peter

[LowGear]

What a lucky Sea Dog you are!

From Listerdiesel's chart reference this looks like a 1935 unit.  Am I reading it right?   That would mean this boat could have been used during WWII and still be in what looks like really great condition.  With all the postings asking about boat applications for the Lister diesel this should be of great interest to many members. 

I am really curious how you came to have it? How come it's in such great shape after all of these years?  And to please do some very serious investigation about it's historic value before you customize it.  How many were built?  How many are still remaining?  There seems to be something just very special about your wonderful boat.

Best Wishes and Good Luck on your adventure.

LowGear

[rbodell]

What a lucky Sea Dog you are!

From Listerdiesel's chart reference this looks like a 1935 unit.  Am I reading it right?   That would mean this boat could have been used during WWII and still be in what looks like really great condition.  With all the postings asking about boat applications for the Lister diesel this should be of great interest to many members. 

I am really curious how you came to have it? How come it's in such great shape after all of these years?  And to please do some very serious investigation about it's historic value before you customize it.  How many were built?  How many are still remaining?  There seems to be something just very special about your wonderful boat.

Best Wishes and Good Luck on your adventure.

LowGear

Yeah it could be very valuable if kept original.

[listerdiesel]

What a lucky Sea Dog you are!
From Listerdiesel's chart reference this looks like a 1935 unit.  Am I reading it right?

No, the last digit(s) has/have to be added to 1950 to give the year of manufacture.

Peter

[listerdiesel]

Re the engine serial numbering:

Up to 1950, Listers used a straight number which only gives the date of manufacture, the rest of the detail on the spec plate giving the mechanical build, and then you'd need the Changed Numbers List to make sense of that.

The chart for pre-1950 engines is at:

http://www.oldengine.org/members/diesel/EngineDating/Dating.htm

After 1950, the new numbering system included all the mechanical build detail, and the engine type can be read from the number as well, such as the one which I have replied to here.

The chart for post-1950 engines is at:

http://www.oldengine.org/members/diesel/EngineDating/Dating5.htm

Then, there is another, later listing that goes further, and this one has the year of manufacture as the first digits, where they were filled in.

Sample plate is at:

http://www.oldengine.org/members/diesel/EngineDating/Dating6.htm

Armed with that lot, you should be able to date almost any Lister engine.

Note that the pre-1950 listing is for ALL engines, and you need to select the model before looking up the serial number. The diesel engines are on the right hand side of the chart, with separate columns for the different models.

All of the above are mirrored on http://www.stationary-engine.co.uk

Peter

[Tijmen]

Thanks for the explanation about the engine dating!

What a lucky Sea Dog you are!

That would mean this boat could have been used during WWII and still be in what looks like really great condition.  With all the postings asking about boat applications for the Lister diesel this should be of great interest to many members. 

Well the boats where not used for war purpose, below some explanation where they came from:

An opduwer (pusher) or opdrukker is a small push and tugboat. Its a tipical Dutch product because of the small canals.
Such boats became in use especially in the first half of the twentieth century.  In that time, the combustionengine found its way to inland canals, but it was often to much work to replace a steam engine in an old large Tugboat with a diesel or petrol one. As a solution to this problem they just simply build a small boat (compared to a standard auto) and put an engine in. First they where build from wood and later models where build from steel on a real shipwharf. They used cheap and easy to replace engines like an A-ford engine used in a car.

The "opduwer" was used for pushing or towing large barges or sailingships when they went on a canal. Giving them assisting
They didnt entered large open waters because of the small size.
The "opduwer" replaced boats who used muscle power (like horsers) to have them pulled.

Here is an old picture with an opduwer:

I am really curious how you came to have it? How come it's in such great shape after all of these years?  And to please do some very serious investigation about it's historic value before you customize it.  How many were built?  How many are still remaining?  There seems to be something just very special about your wonderful boat.

I found the boat on the internet, just a dutch marketplace like ebay.

Today there are a couple of hundred of them left in Holland and there is a healthy community which restores the opduwer and there engines.
At the following website you can see a large collection of opduwers: http://opduwers.nl/ingezond10.htm
I know 5 different other opduwers who also have a lister CS 6/1 or 12/2 as engine.

http://opduwers.nl/motoren.htm Shows some engines used in the opduwers.
http://opduwers.nl/sleepbootfotos.htm Shows the larger real tugboats used on large water or rivers.

[Doug]

I'm in lust and now must go to Holland

[LowGear]

Amen to Holland, Brother.

So the answer to the year of manufacture is?

LG

[listerdiesel]

Amen to Holland, Brother.

So the answer to the year of manufacture is?

LG

See my post above (the first of the two)

"5 is the year of manufacture, added to 1950 = 1955"

Peter

[LowGear]

You guys that can read.  What an unfair advantage. 

Thanks for your patient expertiise.

LowGear