Author Topic: Air Intake noise?  (Read 17255 times)

hotater

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Re: Air Intake noise?
« Reply #15 on: August 14, 2007, 03:13:17 PM »
This is a subject that was settled a LONG time ago by a Lister runner in Alabama....

Solberg FS-19P-150    with the 19P element.

http://www.solbergmfg.com/ListProductLines.aspx#filter-silencers

It's all steel, screws right into an exhaust flange bolted to the intake side, and quietens my Jkson 6-1 by about 70% over the OEM air cleaner.

Since the fires of early July, most every afternoon is so filled with dust and ashes that it cuts visibility to less than a mile, but the Solberg filter seems to be working very well.  I have much more confidence in it than I do the oil bath as rendered by the Indians.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2007, 03:17:34 PM by hotater »
7200 hrs on 6-1/5Kw, FuKing Listeroid,
Currently running PS-Kit 6-1/5Kw...and some MPs and Chanfas and diesel snowplows and trucks and stuff.

xyzer

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Re: Air Intake noise?
« Reply #16 on: August 14, 2007, 04:25:05 PM »
Hotator,
Thanks for the been there done that! I knew other folks have addressed this issue and was looking for a proven plug and play remedy.
Thanks again!
Dave
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Doug

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Re: Air Intake noise?
« Reply #17 on: August 14, 2007, 04:26:46 PM »
Jack also opened my eyes to the possibilities of building a better and in light if the ram air thread possibly more efficient intake system using a welder, draw file and elbo grease....

http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=4924460

Now that I know I can make a better intake from free flowing fittings, its just a matter of finding a hose length that flows best and moving the air cleaner/ changing to a type and posiblke location that reduces noise to an acceptable amount.

I don't know if its a Listeroid problem but has anyone noticed if the ports are and intakes are miss matched, off center or just badly made ?
My Petteroid intakes are crap, restrictive, rough and a poor match for toierhwise smooth and nicely cast head runners.

Doug  
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xyzer

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Re: Air Intake noise?
« Reply #18 on: August 14, 2007, 04:57:51 PM »
I bit the bullet and order one from Rodgers in Portland. I'll have $60.00 in it with a spare filter by the time it is delivered. Cheap in my book! I hate trying to re-invent the wheel when it has already been done. I may build a manifold with a ball shut off for an emergency shut down. I don't have any spare exhaust flanges.
Dave
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listerboy

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Re: Air Intake noise?
« Reply #19 on: August 14, 2007, 05:26:28 PM »
I have a 2cyl 1800 rpm chinese diesel genset that does the same pulsating thing. When I first got it the pulsations were bad enough to move your fingers when held two inches from the intake. It has 70 hours on it now and the pulsations have settled down to about 50% of what they were. I think I have the same overlap condition you have but can't explain why the pulsations have been reduced. (see end of paragraph 3)

As for noise, I was experimenting with remote intakes and noticed that when I connected an 8' section of 2" vacuum hose to the intake the noise was reduced by about 30%. I had to scratch that project when the pulsations caused a hole to be worn in the side of the hose where it rubbed a work bench. I'll have to wait till the pulsations settle more before I finish that project.

I also have a problem with excess blow-by. The crankcase is vented through the oil fill cap on top of the valve cover. Under no-load conditions just a wiff of smoke comes through the four holes drilled in the perimeter of the cap. Under load the smoke would fill the shed with a fine smokey/oily mist. I fixed that by installing a 3/8" hose barb in the top of the valve cover and piping it to the air cleaner. Now my dry-type filter has the benifits of an oil bath! Could the fact that there is now a negative pressure in the crankcase have helped with the pulsation problem?

mike90045

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Re: Air Intake noise?
« Reply #20 on: August 14, 2007, 05:37:51 PM »
Quote
This is a subject that was settled a LONG time ago by a Lister runner in Alabama....
Solberg FS-19P-150    with the 19P element.
  I see that as a   http://www.solbergmfg.com/Download.aspx?file=/Upload/Drawings/PDF/FS-19P-150.PDF

rated at 70CFM.   What's the CID of theses 6/1's ?  I see bore & stroke all the time, but what flow rate is needed to let these breathe, and silence at the same time.   

rcavictim

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Re: Air Intake noise?
« Reply #21 on: August 14, 2007, 09:40:02 PM »
Mike, the 6/1 is about 85 cu.in. or 1.4 litres displacement per gulp.  With 325 gulp cycles per minute that is a flow rate of about 85 X 325 = 27625 cu.in./minute or 27625/1728= 16 CFM.

Someone who is not half asleep please correct me if I`m out to lunch on this.
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xyzer

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Re: Air Intake noise?
« Reply #22 on: August 16, 2007, 05:57:59 AM »
The Solberg FS-19P-150 works great! It reducwd the noise a good %.
Dave
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mike90045

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Re: Air Intake noise?
« Reply #23 on: August 16, 2007, 03:00:44 PM »
Mike, the 6/1 is about 85 cu.in. or 1.4 litres displacement per gulp.  With 325 gulp cycles per minute that is a flow rate of about 85 X 325 = 27625 cu.in./minute or 27625/1728= 16 CFM.

Someone who is not half asleep please correct me if I`m out to lunch on this.

Os, since you asked,  the "gulp rate" is 1/4 of 650 RPM (these are 4 cycles, with valves not 2 cycles?) so, you have to gulp
85cid x 162.5=  13812.5  / 1728  =8 CFM   BUT you only have 0.0015 sec (per intake valve cycle) to gulp it in at, so the sustained rate would be {something I'm too foggy to deal with this AM} like 8cfm / 162.5 = 0.049 CFM in 0.0015 sec works to a "sustained" flow of  0.049 * 666.6 = 32.66634 CFM ?  maybe a little more, since the intake valve isn't open an entire revolution. ( dang, is it only open 1/2 revolution of the crank = then it would be 64CFM ?)

xyzer

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Re: Air Intake noise?
« Reply #24 on: August 16, 2007, 07:33:26 PM »
Mike,
There are only 325 intakes / minute @ 650RPM. Yes it is a 4 stroke but two events happen per revolution. I agree about the gulp rate. Not my area in the math department. I didn't feel it try to take it from me when I set it on the intake while it was running.
Dave
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ronmar

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Re: Air Intake noise?
« Reply #25 on: August 16, 2007, 09:29:40 PM »
I didn't feel it try to take it from me when I set it on the intake while it was running.
Dave

And the important practical measurement.  If it was overly restrictive, you would feel the vacume created under those circumstances.

Ron
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xyzer

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Re: Air Intake noise?
« Reply #26 on: August 17, 2007, 08:59:20 PM »
This is a subject that was settled a LONG time ago by a Lister runner in Alabama....

Solberg FS-19P-150    with the 19P element.

http://www.solbergmfg.com/ListProductLines.aspx#filter-silencers

It's all steel, screws right into an exhaust flange bolted to the intake side, and quietens my Jkson 6-1 by about 70% over the OEM air cleaner.

Since the fires of early July, most every afternoon is so filled with dust and ashes that it cuts visibility to less than a mile, but the Solberg filter seems to be working very well.  I have much more confidence in it than I do the oil bath as rendered by the Indians.
If any of you are interested in adding one of these I called Solberg and got the local dealer in my area. They don't list there dealers on there website. It cost me around $62.00 with a spare filter including delivery. If you can get a spare exhaust manifold flange (anybody have a spare?) it is a 5 min add on. If not it still isn't a big deal to adapt it. In my test run it did as Hotator said and reduced the intake noise significantly. Thanks Jack!
Dave
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hotater

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Re: Air Intake noise?
« Reply #27 on: August 17, 2007, 09:15:14 PM »
 ... but, don't thank me, it was the "Alabama Phantom" that did it .....

Far away and supremely thankful looks from the crowd of one and the sound of fading hoofbeats of a Duramax.....fade to shades of swamp water....
7200 hrs on 6-1/5Kw, FuKing Listeroid,
Currently running PS-Kit 6-1/5Kw...and some MPs and Chanfas and diesel snowplows and trucks and stuff.

rjcroc

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Re: Air Intake noise?
« Reply #28 on: August 17, 2007, 09:42:33 PM »

Jack,

Your post makes me remember the Jack Nicholson flick where he is at a remote hotel in the winter,
chopping thru a door, pokes his head in and says "HERE'S JOHNNY"
Perhaps its time to drive into town and visit with people. lol

Rick
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phaedrus

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Re: Air Intake noise?
« Reply #29 on: August 18, 2007, 06:02:14 AM »
the cfm given on the drawing is 100 CFM. see:

 http://www.solbergmfg.com/Download.aspx?file=/Upload/Drawings/PDF/FS-19P-150.PDF

solberg says:  "...However, you can get the FS-19P-150 from any local Grainger store.  Their part # is 4Z682.  They should have some in stock. In terms of buying direct, we have a first order requirement of $100 net.  This unit would be $40.35/ea if purchased directly..."

 
Should be a simple matter to adapt the stock intake to the solberg silencer with a piece of hose and a couple of hoseclamps. Alternativly brazing a pipe coupling to the intake manifold is trivial. One never knows, however, how brass will behave on a diesel - the transients can cause fatigue surprizes!
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