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Author Topic: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics  (Read 81459 times)

Doug

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #150 on: August 23, 2007, 02:45:43 AM »
And you know what the solution is, we all do....

We need to live like people did in the 40's and learn to be practical about stuff.
Not waste and plan ahead.

I read some place once that the diet people ate durring the war here actualy was healthier because of less fried food and meat and more vegitable from victory gardens and such.

People walked and took busses more so they were more fit and used less fuel.

If I could ride a tram to work instyead of drive I know I would save a lot of money.
If I had a garden I know I would spend more time weeding and eating straight from the plant.

But as you say we may have ruined a lot of soil and poluted a lot of water already and no one wants to give up the conviniece of the car for a tram....

Doug
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rmchambers

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #151 on: August 23, 2007, 04:18:40 AM »
Well people would if there was a half decent public transportation system available.  I work 35 miles from the house and I take a 3 mile drive to the train station and a 3 mile shuttle from the far end station to the office and reverse the procedure to come home.

Hardly seems worth it to take a train for a short distance, but the highways I'd have to use are so choked up with traffic that going home would take at least 1 hour (35 miles) and has taken twice that!  At least on the train I can snooze, listen to music and it takes me an hour no matter what.

I also work out of the house 1 day a week which helps too, I've got a setup here that lets me do just about anything I can do in the office from the house (except upset people face to face  :D   ).

I really don't know how bad it's going to get here but I think we are seeing the tip of the iceberg at the moment.  Those that can take care of themselves will fare better than the people that want everything done for them.

RC

CD in BC

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #152 on: November 09, 2007, 06:49:50 AM »
Another shinning example of corporate America's values.

 http://nbb.grassroots.com/EPA_AskTheAdministrator_Details/?lk=5253840-5253840-0-26468-j7-Ia3j3/ugoRq4rf3J/jr9-fu94F1zI

                                         Bill

You've got it all wrong. This process is a God-send.  Where would you rather have the 4.5 million tons of car shred waste generated every year, or the hospital wastes, or the BSE contaminated offal, sewage residues, old tires, unusable biomass etc. etc.?  Landfills is where they go now, or else they are incinerated at vast cost and no benefit.

I've posted links to the Discovery mag articles on this process before.  The response was underwhelming, just like the medias' response to the whole idea.  Now big oil has seen the chance and is going to run with it.  Well surprise, surprise.  If the governmental bodies of NA were too lazy, stupid or short-sighted to do so, I guess that's what happens.

We get the government we deserve they say.

As for the Biodiesel Council, much as I like biodiesel, they are just another industry body complaining about their competitors IMO.  Biodiesel is an industry like any other.  Their raw material is an agricultural product, not toxic waste that is otherwise unusable.

With all the spinning going on these days it's no wonder a lot of people are a bit dizzy.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2007, 06:53:49 AM by CD in BC »

listerboy

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #153 on: January 02, 2008, 07:32:45 PM »
Interesting article about bio-fuels causing the price of food to go up.

 http://www.csmonitor.com/2007/1231/p13s01-wogi.html

Reno Speedster

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #154 on: July 03, 2008, 06:36:35 AM »
Wow, I missed out on this one when it came out.  I have not read all the posts (11 pages at the moment) but the first few pages were full of an attitude that just drives me nuts.  The whole "companies owe it to their stock holders to maximize profit" argument is a shining example of exactly what is wrong with this country.  Not only is it the corporate equivalent to "I was just following orders," a phrase which removed all personal responsibility for a generation of tyrants and their lackeys, but it shows just how screwed up our priorities have become.  The individual has been replaced by the corporation (and profit) in America's political and economic calculations. 

Now I am not saying that profit is bad, only that profit made from the destruction of the American economy, environment and citizenry is incredibly short sighted.  Our economy became great because workers made a wage large enough to buy American products.  With the rise of international corporations and the quest for profit above all else, the American economy is being mined for profits by closing American production, laying off workers and importing goods made over-seas.  Eventually, American's will no longer have any money to buy these goods anymore, then what will we do?  This is not a problem for international corporations, when Americans can no longer afford to buy foreign goods and the American economy is in the dumper, they will set up cheap manufacturing plants here to make goods to sell to the Chinese (or who ever else has all the money at that point). 

Personally, I don't see why anyone would be willing participate in this system.  It’s stealing from yourself for the sake of a relatively small profit (assuming that you are actually in the stock market).  Where are you going to live with all the money you make in the stock market when the American economy is in the dumper, when you cant drink the water or breathe the air?  WHo do you think is going to employ you?  What are you going to do when the middle class disappears and the newly poor majority actually get pissed and politically involved (or worse, abandon politics for more direct action).

What we need is the realization that maximizing profits alone is not a company’s sole duty.  They have a duty to their workers and to the communities they work in.  We need to stop thinking that companies have the same rights as people.  People are far more important than companies.  For example, why on god's green earth do we actually give tax breaks to companies who move American jobs and production overseas?  Under what possible logic is taking away American jobs and loosing the tax base a good idea for anyone but international corporations?  Why are we actually paying oil companies millions tax dollars when they are making record profits?    Do you actually think that they need your money to get along?  Yeah gads!   We need to start using a little enlightened self-interest here and make sure that we are voting and acting in our own interest, not acting as the ignorant lackeys of someone else’s profits.

Is profit the highest good?  If you think they are, you have some pretty screwed up priorities....or you work for Exxon or the like.

Rant over.
« Last Edit: July 03, 2008, 06:45:41 AM by Reno Speedster »

biobill

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #155 on: July 11, 2008, 03:18:53 PM »
Quote from: Reno Speedster
why on god's green earth do we actually give tax breaks to companies who move American jobs and production overseas?  Under what possible logic is taking away American jobs and loosing the tax base a good idea for anyone but international corporations?  Why are we actually paying oil companies millions tax dollars when they are making record profits?
Yea, why would we?  "We", being citizens and voters, wouldn't. But with the corporate control of  the Republican and Democratic parties, they simply give it to themselves. And with the corporate control of the mainstream media, third (fourth, fifth?) party candidates are simply invisible.  Sure would be nice to see Ralph Nader, Ron Paul and others on the debate platform with B.O. and J.M.  Perhaps the discussion might turn to things that really matter.
          Bill
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Doug

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #156 on: July 11, 2008, 03:52:38 PM »
Someday things will change when you the American people are realy mad ( and I think that day is near ).

All you nice American people need t do is finaly Vote for that Nader or Paul fellow on mass and the winds will blow and foundations and networks will crack and the entire political landscape will change forever.

The ball is entirely in your court
It's a Good Life, If You Don't Weaken

rmchambers

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #157 on: July 11, 2008, 05:28:29 PM »
I'd have thought that the general populace would have been mad by now but while Rome burns all that the general public cares about is American Idol.

The desecration of the 4th amendment got passed yesterday with nary a whimper.  What will it take to make everyone mad enough to do something?  I really don't know but it had better happen soon while there's still something left.

It is in our court, but the problem is everyone is at the mall.

mkdutchman

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #158 on: July 11, 2008, 06:02:42 PM »
The desecration of the 4th amendment got passed yesterday with nary a whimper.  What will it take to make everyone mad enough to do something?  I really don't know but it had better happen soon while there's still something left

what bill is that? I was googling all over for it......

biobill

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #159 on: July 11, 2008, 06:49:01 PM »
Off grid since 1990
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mkdutchman

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #160 on: July 11, 2008, 08:44:08 PM »
Someday things will change when you the American people are realy mad ( and I think that day is near ).

All you nice American people need t do is finaly Vote for that Nader or Paul fellow on mass and the winds will blow and foundations and networks will crack and the entire political landscape will change forever.

The ball is entirely in your court

I suspect that'll happen once bo gets in.......people will realize then how good they had it now

biobill

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #161 on: July 14, 2008, 05:57:21 AM »
Quote from: mkdutchman
I suspect that'll happen once bo gets in.......people will realize then how good they had it now
Can't imagine remembering the last 8 yrs as the Good Old Days no matter who gets elected, but I don't blame that entirely on the Bush/Cheney regime. With very few individual exceptions, congress has been totally complicit. More likely I'll think back to the days when the Bill of Rights was intact, when the budget was balanced, when we weren't fighting wars for fabricated reasons, when torture was beneath us, and when we could count on the investigations of the press/media to keep the politicians somewhat honest.
Off grid since 1990
6/1 Metro DI living in basement, cogen
6/1 Metro IDI running barn & biodiesel processer
VW 1.6 diesels all over the place
Isuzu Boxtruck, Ford Backhoe, all running on biodiesel
Needs diesel lawnmower & chainsaw

mkdutchman

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #162 on: July 15, 2008, 11:57:12 AM »
No, I can't remember the last 8 years being the "good ol days" either,  :) I meant more along the lines of "it'll get worse before it gets better"...............politics are depressing just now, but then again nothing last forever

mobile_bob

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #163 on: July 15, 2008, 06:52:03 PM »
the good old days?

well some folks don't think of the last 8 as the good old days,
i remember the 8 years of the clintons as not being the good old days (at least to me)
the 4 years of bush one, wasn't without some issues of course
the 8 years of reagan (i will comment on that later)
jimmy carter? give me a break!

nixon, johnson, ?  i wouldn't put that block of time in the "good old days" catagory either.

so for the last 40 or 50 years, we only had reagans time in office as the good old days,
and yes they were good times indeed!

just remember folks, GW might not be perfect,, but things can be a hell of a lot worse
and probably will be in the next 4 years.

probably a good time to plant a bigger garden and put a few more holes in the old belt?

things are not going to be the same no matter what happens or who gets in office, this correction
is going to have deep and long repercussions that will last for the next several generations.

bob g
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MacGyver

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #164 on: July 15, 2008, 06:58:40 PM »

probably a good time to plant a bigger garden and put a few more holes in the old belt?

Yes,  think a belt with more holes in it sounds appropriate.

Something like this....

http://www.cabelas.com/hprod-1/0031435.shtml
Steve

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