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Author Topic: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics  (Read 81462 times)

haganes

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #135 on: June 10, 2007, 06:06:56 AM »
sorry, one more point on palm oil.

according to the us state department, 80% of the indonesian production of palm oil goes for food.  they also say in part:

"Pointing to heightened concern around the world over trans-fatty acids (TFA) and the January 2006 U.S. Food and Drug Administration requirement that food labels include information about TFA, they argue that palm oil will begin to replace partially hydrogenated oils in American processed foods, thus increasing exports to the U.S."

you can read the entire text which talks about biofuels at:
                              http://www.usembassyjakarta.org/econ/Sumatera_palm_oil_dec05.html

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phaedrus

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #136 on: August 02, 2007, 05:32:44 AM »
article in asiatimes:  http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Global_Economy/IH01Dj01.html  "the great biofuel fraud"

sorry to say that I think he's right, pity.
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biobill

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #137 on: August 02, 2007, 12:46:27 PM »
  I've always felt that the ethanol program was a sham. But as an outlet for "surplus" grains I thought it would benefit the farmers. I'm thinking family type farms, not the corporate giants. Hadn't considered the global implications of corporate and misguided government involvement. Great article, thanks for opening my eyes
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Doug

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #138 on: August 03, 2007, 03:54:31 AM »
The family farm is under attack by the factory farm.

Time to elect a goverment that will put a stop to the madness and help the little guy keep the family farm running in a sustainable manner.

Burning food a crime!!!!
Ever been hungry?
Realy hungry....

I have, and F*** *** to any corperation that thinks profits come before empty bellies. Worst year of my life spent looking for quarters in the snow around parking meters.
The humilations of begging for any kind of work.
Getting thin....
Soup kitchen....
Food bank...
I am out of step now, but when enough money has been spent foolishly and enough bellies growl there will be another October revolution.

Not one step back....
I'll pick up bricks,a  tools, pointy sticks and what ever it takes to make sure my wife and son never live to know hunger and dispare.

But thats not enough because I know some place out there some other father is tearing himself up over empty stomachs. He might be a black fellow or Asian man, not that it matters money transcends colour.

A tank full of food makes me sick!!!!!!

Doug
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Andre Blanchard

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #139 on: August 06, 2007, 10:49:00 PM »

A tank full of food makes me sick!!!!!!

Doug

What is the difference between growing beans for fuel and growing trees for fuel and lumber?
There is a lot of land in the US and Canada that is now growing trees that could just as well be growing food crops.

It is just an allocation of resources problem.

The real crime is how much food is allowed to rot while some guy on Wall Street is waiting for the price to go up.  I would guess that it is more then enough to feed the hungry in North America.

As far as other countries I stopped feeling sorry for them a long time ago, it is their choice to allow the population to exceed the carrying capacity of the land in which they live.  I have talked to more then one peace core volunteer who has returned after 20 or 30 years to the village where they helped setup school or library, only to find that the people destroyed the buildings shortly after the volunteers left.
You can't help people who will not help themselves, especially when there is some religion involved.
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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #140 on: August 07, 2007, 01:08:17 AM »

Quote

You can't help people who will not help themselves, especially when there is some religion involved.


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phaedrus

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #141 on: August 07, 2007, 03:46:56 AM »
An injury to one is an injury to all. "What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground."

We all in this situation together. Notions of being in competition with one another are mere propaganda that rich and greedy people spew towards us for their own ends. It's the old "divide and conquer" routine.

And there's a practical aspect too. Does anyone honestly expect millions of starving people to just sit quietly to die? The old, the very young, perhaps, but the lean men of action, having been wronged by selfish dupes, will seek food and vengence. Wanna bet they won't? Paybacks are a bitch.
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phaedrus

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #142 on: August 08, 2007, 08:15:49 PM »
http://www.spiegel.de/international/0,1518,498805,00.html

ethanol-corn driving land prices to levels that squeeze out small farmers...
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biobill

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #143 on: August 09, 2007, 03:12:58 AM »
  Wonder what happens if nobody buys the stuff?  I've seen one station in the neighboring town selling E-85, about $.50/ gal cheaper for a savings in the neighborhood of 17% per gallon, but probably more expensive per mile.  It's been my experience that very few consumers will pay extra for environmentally friendly products. (willingly, Federal subsidies are something else)  Might there be some good deals in the future on surplus ethanol by the drum?
   Big stink a few years back over the Federal subsidies of "high fructose corn syrup". Seems the latest corn$ version might do even more damage.
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Doug

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #144 on: August 09, 2007, 03:58:45 AM »
I read some place when you factor inflation in the subsities on things like corn, wheat and beef have actualy decreased the net cost we pay for it today. However fruits and vegitables have increased in costs since they generaly do not get the same level of suport.

This is kind of sad when you think about the fact that so much of this food is wasted ( wheat dairy beef corn ect... ) and the healthier choices we should be making cost more. If you ask me this make no sence.

I used to plant a little garden because I like a fresh tomato in my lunch. Then I began to believe after the Port Colburn soil survey that here in the Nickle city ( where the ore that contaminated the other city ) might be worse. A century of industrial emissions, and the local survey that for some reason keeps getting put back for further study made me rethink my vegies.
A trip to Toronto and I see farm land turned into burbs because the land is worth more than it grows.

All these things bother me, Food wasted, Food spolied, land wasted instead of being used to grow food and all the time people are hungery not just in some african vilage but right here in Canada.
I watch a comercial today for habbitat for humanity that 1 million Canadians haver to chose between eating well and having a roof over head.

A tank full of food still makes me ill when you consider the amount of biomass that could be converted to energy from places you can't grow food, like right here.....

Doug
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phaedrus

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #145 on: August 21, 2007, 03:35:49 PM »
Hey Doug - This paper caught my eye and I throught that you might be interested in reading it, even though it's off topic just a bit...

http://www.ararcommission.ca/eng/2007-08-08-addendum.pdf
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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #146 on: August 21, 2007, 11:53:57 PM »
Thats just one more thing that makes my heart sink.
I can't tell whats going on and I know I can't believe everything I read.
I didn't read the transcript you posted. Skimmed it for a few minnuts and sunk back a little deaper in my seat.

I work with this nice Dutch fellow:
He came here as a kid...
Back in Holand after the war there was a lot of warm a fuzzy about Canada. Those nice people from across the pond who who fought threw the flooded dikes and brought all that food in........

Ed and his family came to Canada because is his words " this was a place to be " ....
Now Ed tells me this is not the place he came too, too many foolish rules ( like gun laws he hates ) foolish politicians and general crazyness he came here to avoid. He's not a Dutchman now, as Canadian as I am, but he has a perspective that I am beginning to get a flash of insight from ever now and then and in truth I am having a hard time finding my Canada sometimes now too...
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phaedrus

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #147 on: August 22, 2007, 10:47:37 PM »
Me too. Whither my country? Was I just a dupe? Was I imagining things the way they were? Is this America? (Is that Canada?) We used to joke about the nazis - about them demanding "your papers! Snell!". About political proscutions, and about the camps. Now it's us.

In highschool I took latin, the teacher, an Austrian lady, would tell us stories about living through the war there, and make us translate them into latin and write them down. Hard stories to hear. Writing them in latin burned them into the brain. That, of course, was her purpose.

The result? I know, and wish I didn't, what going on. And there's nothing I can do, nothing anybody can do. Just like it was for her, it is for us.
if ya don't ask permission they can't deny it...

Doug

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #148 on: August 23, 2007, 02:15:04 AM »
Tossing a dead dog in creek for a couple of days then pull up the carcuss and fresh eeles for dinner.

Shot threw the hand whilst pissing from the turret of tank....

Laying in a bed, in a bunker deaf and blind for days after the tank was hit by a shell.

Pin monkey, first job in Canada....

I had fellow who told me a select few stories too. Miss that fellow, he also taught and spoke better english
than me ( and Lattin if memmory serves ).....

We still have it good here, but something is slipping away
It's a Good Life, If You Don't Weaken

rpg52

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Re: Tyson- Conoco/Phillips Biodiesel politics
« Reply #149 on: August 23, 2007, 02:36:48 AM »
I still grow much of my own food, even though I know it is in the same soil where they grew Bartlett pears in the '50's, the DDT is certainly still there, I wonder occasionally when I eat a carrot.  Mercury in the creeks from gold mining 100 years ago.  I don't eat that much fish, ocean fish may be even worse, who knows?  The ozone blows in from the urban sprawl down the hill, what are you going to do?  This is in the one of the wealthiest states in the wealthiest nation on earth, how are those in third world situations doing?  I try to count my blessings, keep stress at a minimum.  Only one thing is certain, you aren't going to get out of here alive.   :P
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