House Burning Down

[Ironworks]

I see some members have, unfortunately, lost their houses to fire.  Are these generator related?  Is the ST head a concern?

[ZackaryMac]

I don't know who's house has burnt down, but I am curious...how many people have engines set up in their basements?

[Stan]

I don't know but during a recent power outage in New Westminster BC a couple died from CO after installing a generator in their basement.  Evidently they thought the exhaust was satisfactorily vented to the outside, but wasn't.  You won't catch me with any fossil fuel motor in my house.
Stan

[biobill]

I'm with Stan. Veg oil or biodiesel for indoor work. Much nicer stuff to spill           Bill

[ZackaryMac]

I'm amazed at how many stories I've heard about people dying from running their portable genset in the basement/garage during magor power outages, because they are afraid to run them outside because someone might steal it....ummm, should they be more afraid of DEATH??!?

I guess they figure a little motor doesn't put out much poison, or they just didn't figure. Realize CO poisoning is a painless way to go, however the idea is not to "go".

Don't misunderstand me, I'm not comparing you guys to them. I know your engines are set up for inside running. My first post was out of curiosity about how much noise they make in the house.

[biobill]

 Zack,
   My set up is pretty civilized. Vibration and exhaust noise are gone. I hear a bit of mechanical noise, gov. weights and cam drive mostly.
If the house is silent you can hear it but conversation(talking to myself) or a low radio covers it up.        Bill

[Jim Mc]

...Veg oil or biodiesel for indoor work. Much nicer stuff to spill ...

No doubt the fuel itself is nicer.  But what about the exhaust - Any CO in it ?  Do you run a CO alarm?

[Stan]

My understanding is the guy in New Westminster had set it up to run his exhaust outside but some tiny little crack or hole (maybe he used flex tube) let the odourless CO out and over the night, it was too much.  And WVO would contain CO as well.  Any Hydrogen + Carbon fuel will produce CO in an oxygen starved (in a cylinder) environment.

Stan

[rmchambers]

All the more reason to run synthetic oil in the engine.  The viscosity of these oils doesn't change much even way down in the low digits.  It's not going to turn into STP oil treatment like dino oil does.

My car runs 5W30 oil, parked outside overnight lately (8F, 10F) and it doesn't labor during cranking.  Granted the battery is less efficient and giving up the amps but the engine itself doesn't labor with tar-like oil in the sump.

Robert

[bobkrack]

I guess they figure a little motor doesn't put out much poison, or they just didn't figure. Realize CO poisoning is a painless way to go, however the idea is not to "go".

That's what I heard..  Both my maternal grandparents died of CO poisoning.  Leaking natural gas heater flue pipe.

He on the couch and her in bed.  Two toy dogs on the floor survived.

The only thing I think I know is that while CO2 is heaverier than air, CO seems not to be. 

Internal combustion engine indoors would scare the ship out ot me!

Bob

[adhall]

Here is a interesting link that investigates how carbon monoxide tends to distribute itself in the air:

     http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/chem03/chem03364.htm

Apparently carbon monoxide is slightly lighter than normal air, but not enough so that this is the determining factor in how it is distributed.

Best regards,
Andy Hall

[biobill]

Jim Mc
   The exhaust smells better but still has CO in it. Just like oil burners and propane and natural gas furnaces. Can't hear a leak on them though. And yes, there is a CO detector mounted directly over the engine. I've got a bit over 350 hrs in it's present configuration and it's been pretty much trouble free. Really cut my firewood use too
                                              Bill

[dkwflight]

Hi
I shudder to think about running an engine in an enclosed space, like a basement.

I would have at least a blower sucking fumes out of the house, or blowing fresh air in.

Much better to have the things in an out building. Open the door and air it out before spending any time inside with the engine.

If there is a fire you only loose the outbuilding and contents.
Dennis

[Jim Mc]

... Just like oil burners and propane and natural gas furnaces....

From a CO standpoint, I'd argue that an internal combustion engine is more dangerous for two reasons.  First, a properly set-up propane/natural gas burner doesn't generate significant CO.  I/C engines do.  Second, the entire combustion system from heat exchanger through the flue operates at negative pressure, so if there's a leak, it generally leaks in, instead of combustion products leaking out.

People do die from CO poisoning from their furnaces, but akaik, two things have to go wrong.  The burner has to be mis-adjusted, and there has to be a bad flue system. (although a old co-worker and his family almost woke up dead from CO, and their flue was OK -  they had a Lennox 'pulse' gas furnace, which operates at positive  pressure.   Darn close call for all of them)

[adhall]

I put a CO detector in the bedroom on the first floor of our house. We have the wood stove in the basement which supplies most of our heat. At any rate, the only time I ever set the CO detector off was when I was running a log splitter in ther driveway about 10 feet in front of the garage door. Apparently the wind blew the exhaust gasses into the house through the garage door (the garage stall is in the basement). The door was down, but it doesn't seal very well (obviously).

So at least I know these things work.

Best regards,
Andy Hall