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Author Topic: Starting from scratch. A journey to becoming a gear head.  (Read 15915 times)

mobile_bob

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Re: Starting from scratch. A journey to becoming a gear head.
« Reply #15 on: November 22, 2006, 05:44:33 PM »
Jack's comment on not working against momma nature but with her is spot on.

it can be bloody expensive and down right miserable over the long run should you decide to site you house without regard to nature.

and probably the difference in being able to attain any real level of self sufficiency.

bob g
otherpower.com, microcogen.info, practicalmachinist.com
(useful forums), utterpower.com for all sorts of diy info

hoffman

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Re: Starting from scratch. A journey to becoming a gear head.
« Reply #16 on: November 22, 2006, 07:54:53 PM »
If you don't have a welder you'll wonder how you made it so far without one once you start sticking metal together!   A small MIG isn't that expensive and is really easy to run. You may want to look into it.  Just be careful or you may end up like me with a MIG, TIG, plasma cutter etc...

Jim Mc

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Re: Starting from scratch. A journey to becoming a gear head.
« Reply #17 on: November 22, 2006, 10:13:14 PM »
...and the listeroid engine offers so much toward achieving the dream of quiet reliable power....



Quiet?  Well, yes a Listeroid can be made quiet.  Mount it solidly, put it away from living quarters, and fit it with a decent muffler.  Not too bad.

Warning, unpopular outlook to follow...

But reliable?  That may be a dream.  Do a little searching on this site.  Be objective.  Compare actual factual statements about reliability to other sources of power. 

Do the math.  How much does it cost to connect to the grid?  How much will it cost to generate your own power?  Consider all costs involved.

Not trying to dissuade you from the 'off grid' ideas, just make sure you truly understand all the costs and tradeoffs...

Having a Listeroid set around for backup power makes perfect sense.  Especially if you enjoy the tinkering bit.  But thinking a Listeroid can't be beat for economic reasons, or represents the epitome of a 'reliable' power source is a bit of a stretch.

biobill

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Re: Starting from scratch. A journey to becoming a gear head.
« Reply #18 on: November 23, 2006, 02:08:26 AM »
  Solar with Lister backup is how God intended it to be.   So sayeth the prophet biobill
Off grid since 1990
6/1 Metro DI living in basement, cogen
6/1 Metro IDI running barn & biodiesel processer
VW 1.6 diesels all over the place
Isuzu Boxtruck, Ford Backhoe, all running on biodiesel
Needs diesel lawnmower & chainsaw

snail

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Re: Starting from scratch. A journey to becoming a gear head.
« Reply #19 on: November 23, 2006, 02:19:13 AM »
Quote
Solar with Lister backup is how God intended it to be.   So sayeth the prophet biobill

I'd agree with the prophet. May not be the cheapest,but sure is easy to live with.

We could run into theological problems here. Is the prophet descended from the true messiah of Dursley? :D

Cheers,

Brian

listerengine2006

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Re: Starting from scratch. A journey to becoming a gear head.
« Reply #20 on: November 23, 2006, 03:26:34 AM »
Quiet?  Well, yes a Listeroid can be made quiet.  Mount it solidly, put it away from living quarters, and fit it with a decent muffler.  Not too bad.
Warning, unpopular outlook to follow...
But reliable?  That may be a dream. 
... thinking a Listeroid can't be beat for economic reasons, or represents the epitome of a 'reliable' power source is a bit of a stretch.

Jim Mc sounds like a man who knows what he is talking about.  Listers may not be for everyone, but my hope is that it is simple enough to repair when things do go wrong.  I have never taken on any project that went completely according to plan.  The keys to my success on projects in the past, have been to be adaptable to the unforseen wrinkles that always happen at the worst times. 

Reduncancy is the only way to mitigate service interruptions.  If you can't afford service interruptions, then plan for outages by having options available when outages occur.  Thats why we have 2 vehicles, because one is going to quit when you need it most.  Often in the winter, the truck will start, but the bosses van can be stubborn.  So I start the truck first, then she tries the van, and we boost it if required. 

Solar, wind, a second lister, battery banks, can all be part of the plan if you are relying on yourself.   What the heck, keep a gas generator around for those times with everything else craps out.  Things are going to break.   As dad used to say, " its not what happens, its how you handle it that matters".

My thinking is, listers may not be the best choice, but if its going to break, get the one thats easiest to fix.  If you can fix one of these engines with basic tools and some baling twine, then this may be the biggest advantage to listers over other prime movers.  If I could use nothing but solar and batteries, then that would be great, but who can afford the solar array big enough to run the compressor?

Another lesson learned.  Stop looking at the lister as a cheap, reliable power.   Start looking at a lister as a maintainable prime mover.
Point taken Jim MC, I still have lots of homework to do.  Fortunately, iI have some time to invest in the planning. 

Mark

Listeroid 6/1 5KW

Tom

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Re: Starting from scratch. A journey to becoming a gear head.
« Reply #21 on: November 23, 2006, 03:59:22 AM »
  Solar with Lister backup is how God intended it to be.   So sayeth the prophet biobill

Amen, BB!
Tom
2004 Ashwamegh 6/1 #217 - ST5 just over 3k hours.

hotater

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Re: Starting from scratch. A journey to becoming a gear head.
« Reply #22 on: November 23, 2006, 04:15:54 AM »
At the old 'facility' where I live which is more than $300K from grid power, the place was built for maximum realiabillity and ignored EVERY thing else.  It had to have 24/7 power and a lot of it.

It's much harder to try to compensate for idiotic decisions than to make informed choices to start with.

Onan diesel power for maximum reliability used 2,000 gallons of diesel fuel a month and when one (of a matched pair) broke down or needed service it was a $500 service call, plus parts and time.

Listeroid power takes me an average of 15 hours a month in repairs and maintenence and burns ninety gallons.  Parts are the price of packing peanuts compared to ONAN.

I vote Lister and hydro...the sun don't shine much down in this crack in a giant lava flow.   ;)

LE'06--  I think you've picked the BEST engine to earn your black fingernails with.  It's simple enough even for ME!!!

If you want the best engine at the best price with the most learning potential, get a 'kit'.  Mine will be cranked the first time tomorrow.  They are a HOOT!

 There's a dealer 'near' you.....Canada, anyhow.   :P
7200 hrs on 6-1/5Kw, FuKing Listeroid,
Currently running PS-Kit 6-1/5Kw...and some MPs and Chanfas and diesel snowplows and trucks and stuff.

dieselman

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Re: Starting from scratch. A journey to becoming a gear head.
« Reply #23 on: March 01, 2007, 07:54:32 PM »
Tools.... one of my favorite subjects! Speaking from experience, don't buy a tool just because you think you MIGHT need it. I have some tools I used only a couple of times and unfortunately a couple that I never used(bought in atticipation of a project that I never did or did something different that did not require the tool). Basic hand tools you will always use, but big ticket items like a welder or a band saw are nice but how much will you use them. Try borrowing or renting a welder if you need one. You will need practice to achieve good results and learning from someone will save you a lot of mistakes....some of wihich could exceed the cost of paying an experienced person to do it for you. Good Luck. I am looking forward to moving to my farm in Texas to do the same thing.

Jim
1995 F350 7.3L Diesel
8.3 ISC Cummins
14/1 Lovson (in progress)

wirenutrob

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Re: Starting from scratch. A journey to becoming a gear head.
« Reply #24 on: March 04, 2007, 04:12:11 AM »
Evening all,

I have been reading this thread for the past few minutes and everything that has been said here is true and has one common thread. Planning!.... Try to plan for every possible different way things can work out. Also keep a journal of your events and plans, you will be happy that you did when you have to go back and revisit an event on a certain day. Get a didital camera and start a photo library of your projects. Down load to a CD or lap top computer for future reference.
Take photos of your engine as you take it apart, this helps too.
Good luck,
Rob