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Messages - M61hops

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256
Listeroid Engines / Re: Flywheel balance update
« on: July 29, 2007, 08:23:29 AM »
Funny thing happened to me today.  When I quit thinking about what I was doing and tried moving the weights by trial and error I had great sucess in just 6 tries and my 6/1 Metro is a completely different machine!  The chalk marks weren't making much sense to me for a few different reasons but it turns out they did identify the heavy spots correctly.  I can spin my motor both directions with a golf cart motor so that cancels out the lag but I was thrown off by the quality of the surface of the paint on the flywheel.  At first there were pits and drips and chips so I sanded the paint off and repainted.  The new paint grabbed the chalk and made it equally difficult to make consistant markings.  Simple trial and error came to the rescue!  I ended up with about 1.5 pounds of weight about 90 degrees from the cast counterweights.  I'm going to use a dial indicator to see if I can improve the balance but it is very close right now just from trial & error.  To start with the balance was out so far that I couldn't use an indicator because it would have gone around 2 or three times so fast I couldn't see the needle!  I made some weights out of retangular box tubing cut in half to make U shaped channel iron and they look a bit crude.  When I get the weight as good as I can I'd like to make something that looks better.   Maybe if I have them chromed...     
Anyway, the fun continues.       Leland



257
Engines / Re: engine balance - how to
« on: July 28, 2007, 06:50:34 PM »
Hi Rick, yes the counterweights are 180 from the crank throw.  The new paint I put on my flywheels seems to grab the chalk when I make the marks so that may be introducing some error into my proceedure.  The flywheels are correct for this motor and it seems the keyways are broached in the correct place on both, though the inner face of the rim on one flywheel has a little runout.  The chalk marks seem to indicate that the heavy spots are about 60 degrees off from where the counterweights are so there might be a density problem like a hollow spoke in the castings?  Nothing obvious to my eye yet.  I will fuss with it untill I'm satasified that I can't get it balanced any better but it is going to take much more time than I figured (what doesn't?).  I plan to set the frame with the engine and generator into a subsancial mass of concrete when I'm done balancing and I will do something to reduce transmission of the power stroke thump to the ground.  I want to end up with a generator/heat pump that I or at least my neighbors can't hear or feel running.  Quite a challenging project but this is the kind of thing I do for fun.  (Yeah, my friends think I'm nuts but they are polite to my face and usually use words like "excentric")  Well it's a beautiful day in the neighborhood so I'm outa here for now...   Leland

258
Listeroid Engines / Re: Replacing an oil control ring
« on: July 27, 2007, 08:21:57 PM »
Put rubber or plastic hose over the rod bolts so as not to ding the crank throw bearing surface!  Or do the rod bolts come out easy?  Sharp edges can ding critical surfaces.  Of corse everyone knows this.... but when you try and rush things....                                         Leland

259
Engines / Re: engine balance - how to
« on: July 26, 2007, 08:13:19 PM »
My Metro 6/1 is driving me crazy trying to get it even somewhat civil as to balance.  There is no reasonable amount of concrete that could hold it still the way it is.  I bought it 3rd hand and I suspect that the last owner got rid of it because it could not be held down.  I laughed like hell when he started it because I never imiagined that a motor could jump so high!  Since I consider myself to be a good mechanic and machinist I figured I could smooth it out but so far I've been somewhat humbled by Indian casting expertise.  At the moment I have the engine mounted on a frame with 4 steel wheels riding in leveled steel U channel and tethered by bungee cords attached to substansial weight so so the assembly is free to wobble a few inches any direction, although it can't drive the channels very far into the ground.  I have a 3HP golf cart motor & speed control set up to spin the motor at speeds from 0 RPM to 800 RPM but I don't exceed 660 out of fear of flywheel damage to me.  At this moment I have 2.5 pounds of weight bolted to the flywheels in the area close to the counterweights and it seems like a little too much.  I had to sand and repaint the flat surface of the flywheels in order to make the chalkmarks somewhat clear.  I can rotate the Metro in either direction and I make marks both ways.  I took out the COV hole plug and leave the compression release holding the exaust valve open.  It seems that the chalkmarks indicate that the counterweights are not heavy enough and also maybe they are a little out of position from where they need to be.  Basically so far I'm having trouble figuring out what the chalkmarks are telling me because adding weight does not change them hardly at all.  I'm wondering if there is something wrong with my method and I'll have to disconnect the camshaft and remove the head and crankcase cover?  I find it hard to believe that the valve springs and minimal air resistance of the piston could have meaningful influence in relation to the mass of the flywheels but there is an interesting thing I observe; at about 190RPM the frame rolls back and forth about 1/2 an inch in perfect time with the lifters rising and falling!  So far I haven't seen any consistancy with where I put weight and where the chalk marks move and I'm puzzled.  Any thoughts out in Listeroid land?  The counterweights appear to be clocked right to the crank throw and the flywheels run true, so I'm surprised at the inconsistancy of the chalk marks even though I try to be careful to hold the chalk up to the flywheels the same every time (minimum light contact at crankshaft centerline on breather side of engine).  The fun never stops in Listeroid land!     Leland

260
Petteroids / Re: A Petteroid that fires once.
« on: July 26, 2007, 07:31:37 AM »
I doubt that the gears could slip, it would always be out of time if that were possible.  I can't help wonder what the fact it fires that one time could mean as a clue (if any)?  Could the pressure of combustion as opposed to compression change something?  I'm thinking that the that one firing stroke pushes air back into the fuel line or jams a check valve?  Thought is worth what you paid me for it?  Good luck!  Leland

261
Other Slow Speed Diesels / Re: Chinese horizontal singles
« on: July 11, 2007, 11:26:12 AM »
It could very well be.  However I think the motor in the vidio is a hit & miss gasoline engine and the valves on my changfa are side by side in a horizontal plane.  The cam in my changfa is under and parallel to the crankshaft.  The breather is a small tube that sticks out the top corner of the rear cover plate and has a reed valve and at least one baffel.  I really like the design of the changfas but my 175A is really noisy to run.  The 6-1 listeroid is the quietest diesel I have ever heard and noise is my most important consideration.       Leland

262
Listeroid Engines / Re: Lovson 20-2
« on: June 01, 2007, 03:28:58 PM »
Hi, thought I'd throw in my 2 cents without re-reading this whole thread so at the risk of being redundent, here goes.  The most interesting thing to me is exaust out the intake!  Either the valves don't seal or your turning the motor the wrong direction?  Have you watched closely to see if the valve, piston and injection events happen in the proper sequence?  A diesel motor only needs 3 things to run--- compression, fuel and timing, what is not there?  Is there some reason your rack can't open all the way?  It can take extra fuel to start a cold engine, I would try heating the injectors or/and filling the cooling jacket with hot water.  Good luck!       Leland

263
Listeroid Engines / Re: update on crank balancing
« on: April 13, 2007, 11:30:19 AM »
Hi Chris.  I was wondering if your counterweights are aluminum or steel/iron painted silver?  I would guess from the photos that they are painted cast iron but if they are aluminum you could make new ones out of a heavier metal.  If they are a ferrous metal you could drill holes in them and stuff carbide or something else denser (Army surplus Depleted Uranium? :o) into them to help the balance %.  I think you can buy dense balancing plugs at speed shops.  Just a thought, keep up the good work!  I enjoy the story, thanks for sharing!                        Leland

264
Listeroid Engines / Re: METRO OWNERS
« on: March 29, 2007, 04:18:17 PM »
Yes that helps me a lot, thanks Steve!  I have a 6HP Metro and a 10HP 3 phase motor I use as a converter to change my grid power to 3 phase to run a 2HP, a 3HP or a 7.5HP 3 phase motors.  I keep looking at the converter, the Metro, and my electric meter spinning... I sometimes wish for bigger Metro?  Thanks again...Leland

265
Listeroid Engines / Re: METRO OWNERS
« on: March 29, 2007, 06:43:40 AM »
I second that request for more info!  I have a little trouble imagineing the wiring diagram of using a 3 phase motor to boost output of an ST head.  Do you run loads off the other 2 leads of the motor?  What is the current draw from the ST head when there is no load on the outputs of the 3 phase motor?  And when the 3 phase is loaded?  I use a 10HP 3 phase motor as a converter in my home shop and I've always wanted to try driving the motor shaft with an engine to see what would happen.  My setup draws 17A single phase idle current and I'd hope that to drop to almost nothing if I was driving the converter with a motor.  Any info would be much apprecieated.  Thanks...Leland

266
Listeroid Engines / Re: fuel economy question
« on: February 23, 2007, 08:10:38 AM »
My opinion is that IF you dial it in for the job, all engines will be within a few % of each other for fuel effiecency. Conventional wisdom has it that a diesel will be the most efficient and last the longest if run at about 80% of its max rated power.  The Dihatsu and Perkins clone would probably be under loaded and/or out of their most efficient loading.  For me it would be pretty much a toss up between trying to dial in the Dihatsu which would be a little iffy or adding a starter and a water pump to a Lister(oid).  If you could get some free fuel like WMO or WVO that would tip the choice heavily towards a Lister(oid).

267
Waste Motor Oil / Re: Synthetic Oil
« on: February 20, 2007, 11:01:24 PM »
Just my 2 cents... over the last 3 years I've bought 1 peteroid powered Metro 7.5KW genset and 2 Metro 6/1 listeroids from Sam Crosby and I think I'v been treated fair and that he's an O/K guy to deal with.  I'm a little concerned about the quality of the castings of the Listeroid flywheels because my flywheels that have micro V grooves machined in are poor quality.  It's like the Indian producer of them chose the crappy castings to cut the grooves into to try and clean up ugly castings because the smooth flywheels look good on the belt surfaces and the grooved ones have a lot of flaws where the groovs are, maybe the casting sand was too wet in that part of the mold. The belt surface would look really bad if the grooves were not there and there are a few big voids in the grooves on one of my flywheels; I asked Sam for a replacement for that one and he declined.  I'm not too worried about it after reading up on cast iron but I might put heavy guards over the wheels just in case.  Sam did tell me that he knows of two Metro flywheels that have broken at the hubs and that it seemed that was mostly caused by someone hammering the gib keys in way too hard.  It was just good luck that nobody was hurt buy the breaking flywheels but low quality castings is part of the reality of the 'oid world.  Operators of these engines need to pay attention 

268
Other Slow Speed Diesels / Re: how to sifon cool a changfa zs1115g
« on: February 13, 2007, 09:46:30 PM »
I've only seen photos of the 1115g but I think that they might have put that pump there to prevent hot spots inside the engine so I'd be carefull about getting rid of it.  Maybe use the hole for it as a return port?  Just a thought...            Leland

269
Generators / Re: 50 hz gen to 60 hz
« on: February 13, 2007, 09:27:15 PM »
Hi guys, I'm new here but thought I'd throw in my two cents worth; just remember you get what you pay for!  First off, what kind/brand gen head is this?  I don't think it's practical to reduce the field current back that much so as to get 110V out of a 220V machine, you should use a transformer if you can't center tap the output windings.  If there is a regulator for the battery charge voltage it will probably take care of itself, if not either disconnect the charge circut with a timer or adapt an older automotive regulator to protect the battery from overcharge.  It's very hard (impossible??) to give good advice without seeing the machine and a wiring diagram.  Having said that, I would probably get out my volt and amp meters and either a tachometer or Hz. meter and give it a few more revs and see what it does.     Leland

270
Listeroid Engines / Re: Engine Size Poll
« on: February 12, 2007, 05:24:37 AM »
Hi guys, I'm in the 6/1 & 5KW ST club.  My Metro IDI is a real jumper that I will dynamic balance before serious use.  Leland

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