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Messages - rpg52

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346
Listeroid Engines / Re: LUBRICATION RELATED
« on: December 18, 2005, 12:11:06 AM »
Quinn, you won me over to your way of thinking.  One question is now, where is a source of cheap and available small electric pumps, and, what to use for filters?  I'm thinking cujet is on the right track with the Motorguard filter.  Check this out:  http://www.bypassfilter.com/product.htm
$130 for the filter housing seems a bit steep, but the price of a roll of tp for a filter change seems pretty reasonable.  They (Motorguard) say they are the answer for fuel filters too. 
Ray

347
Listeroid Engines / Re: LUBRICATION RELATED
« on: December 17, 2005, 11:15:40 PM »
Hmm, interesting topic.  Here's my $0.02.  It would seem to me the best filtration system for a listeroid with an oil pump would be a by-pass, like the first oil filters.  My antique (1946) diesel engine has a by-pass that passively accepts oil under very low (or no)  pressure that drains from the the valve train, into the filter canister, through the filter and back into the sump.  Subsequently developed full flow filters take all of the oil, under pressure, and do require a bypass valve so that if they clogged, the oil flow would bypass the filter altogether on its way to lubricate the engine.  The advantage to a old-style by-pass filter (according to some opinions at least) is that since the filtration is passive and relatively slow, the oil is filtered more throughly.  A clogged by-pass would just stop filtering, and would not affect the oil delivery to any of the bearings.  The full flow filters supposedly have to much coarser filtration since the oil has to move through it under pressure.  All this discussion is purely theoretical in my case, and since I won't have a listeroid to practice it on for another week or so, I'm not yet sure how I will connect a filter.  I do plan to install a by-pass though, once I figure out the best way to do it.  More insightful opinions please!
Ray

348
Listeroid Engines / Re: COLD start---
« on: December 15, 2005, 05:27:57 PM »
Rory,
Your fuel filter looks like the way to go.  Do you have a model number?  Cost?  Are the replacement filters widely available?  Thanks,
Ray

349
Listeroid Engines / Re: COLD start---
« on: December 15, 2005, 04:52:31 PM »
Gerry,
That makes sense, making sure there is fuel before mixing in ether.  My Detroit has a hydraulic govenor, which requires a manual overide of the rack before it starts injecting fuel.  I usually crank until it starts pumping white smoke, then give it a little shot of ether.  Initially it barely starts popping, then gradually starts firing well as it warms.  If I had electricity nearby, I'd try a block heater, but that isn't available.  It seems like the glow plug option would be a useful addition for listeroids in really cold areas, but my climate just isn't that cold usually.  Likely I'll rely on a tad of ether if needed.  Incidentially, George B shipped a listeroid for me yesterday, should get it next week, and have a bit more to discuss.
Ray

350
Listeroid Engines / Re: SATYAJEET" SLOW SPEED GM-90 SERIES ENGINES.
« on: December 13, 2005, 05:42:17 PM »
I'm certainly no expert, but I understand that these engines run at a higher rpm (= higher wear rate), and contain a number of "non-standard" parts, so replacement parts may only be obtained from the manufacturer.  The aluminum pistons are a particular concern.  Having said that, I've heard that they run well and seem to have fewer quality problems than some others.  Your call, it depends on their use I suppose.
Ray

351
I believe George B's Lister Longevity CD mentions the microcrack chrome plating on the cylinders.  I think he said the polarity is reversed temporarily which induces the cracks, which enhances oil holding properties.
Ray

352
Listeroid Engines / Re: COLD start---
« on: December 12, 2005, 03:12:46 AM »
My elderly Detroit Diesel engine has an air heater for cold starting.  It is no longer functional, but would ignite a spray of diesel that would be drawn into the cylinders.  I'm not sure why they stopped using it (parts are no longer available, it stopped being installed in the '50's).  It seems like it would have been challenging to use, pumping the diesel in as you cranked the engine.  Kind of like rubbing your stomach and patting your head at the same time.  It seems like the biggest issue with ether is not using an excessive amount.  Others have suggested injecting propane gas or even WD-40.  I tried the propane without luck, but it is now standard issue on some industrial equipment, with an injection button in the cab.  I hear tell of people using a gasoline soaked rag over the intake - Don't try this at home!  Void where prohibited!  I use a tad of ether on my Detroit when it is below 50 degrees.  In really cold situations I'd be tempted to try the propane on a listeroid, with or without lighting it.  They say it is a much softer ignition than ether.  I haven't had any luck with the WD-40, they say it used to use propane as propellant but may have changed the formulation.  Is it scary to blow the lit propane torch into the intake?  I guess it would be alright, I have a residual paranoia about flames and intakes, probably left over from gasoline engines.
Ray

353
Listeroid Engines / Re: Reducing Noise Levels
« on: December 10, 2005, 11:19:29 PM »
Regarding the Detroit Diesels, the forum guys talk endlessly about all the permutations.  GM invented them in the '30's, the first ones (-71 series) came out in ~'38.  The 1-71's were very rare, used for marine gen sets.  The 2-71's were used extensively for gen sets for the railroad reefer cars, many still available as surplus, recently on ebay.  3-71, 4-71, 6-71 used in boats, trucks, standby generators, (I have a '52 GMC 2-1/2 ton where the 3-71 was an option) as well as landing craft, pumps, etc.  The V-8 series started in the '50's, they added turbos to them somewhere in this time.  The -53 series in 3,4 & v-6 cylinder also came out in the '50's.  In the '70's, 80's and '90's there were refinements and different series such as the -92 and -149's which were used in huge earth movers and quarry equipment.  The -71 series was made from '38 to '95 or so, one of the longest production runs for any engine.  Lots of changes, but the basic design wasn't changed much.  My 1946 version really is an antique, but people say they last for a very long time if maintained, and the initial price was reasonable which was the attraction for me.  It is a beast though, I've thought several times if I ever got caught in the spinning shaft, I'd be a broken, bleeding lump and the engine would never notice.  The muffler does seem to tame the exhaust, unless you are right next to it.  Most people who have worked with them love the sound of the exhaust, and it is distinctive, but the tone is much higher pitched than the listeroids, hence my interest in using both of them.  I plan to mount the listeroid on the same frame as the Detroit, it is on a truck frame, mounted on two concrete retaining walls, with some old tire sections between the metal and the concrete.  It will be interesting to see the difference between the two when I get the liseroid assembled.
Ray

354
Listeroid Engines / Re: Reducing Noise Levels
« on: December 10, 2005, 03:10:24 AM »
Yeah, even though the exhaust has been quieted pretty well with the muffler, with the whine of the blower, fan, etc., it's still pretty noisy.  I'll be enclosing it partially and insulating it which should help, but a sawmill isn't going to be quiet regardless.  I got the idea of the water from a guy with a diesel truck, he knows a mechanic who works on diesels who attaches a flexible line from the exhaust of each truck and runs it into a drum of water while he is working on it.  He says it cuts the noise dramatically, I was just taking his word for it, I haven't seen it myself.  Regarding the Detroits, there is a forum of Detroit Diesel enthusiasts who discuss them endlessly.  GM made a 1,2,3,4,& 6 cylinder versions of the 71 series, but only the 2,3,4,&6 were ever common.  They even made multiples of 6 cylinders (2 and 4 engine versions were fairly common) for drilling rigs, ships and locomotives.  A bit much for me, I just wanted a ~75 hp. engine, and it was by far the cheapest available.  They were used in lots of trucks and buses, which is why a lot of the guys on the forum like them so much.  Looking foreward to working on the Listeroid, at least it will seem quiet compared to the Detroit.
Ray

355
Listeroid Engines / Re: Reducing Noise Levels
« on: December 10, 2005, 12:11:39 AM »
Hi,
Don't have a listeroid yet, (likely in a couple weeks) but thought I pass on my experience with another diesel engine.  I have a Detroit Diesel 3-71 (about 1946 model) that came with a straight pipe.  I had heard that running the exhaust into a drum of water quieted diesels down a lot, so put in a 90 degree bend, then a 3 1/2" dia. truck muffler I got off ebay, then another 90 into the cut-out top of an old galvanized water tank (maybe 16" in diameter, 5' tall).  Put a 5' section of heavy pipe and cut lots of holes in it.  First time I started the engine with water in the tank, there was a minor blast and a shower of oily water.  Neglected to calculate that the 2 cycle Detroit engine runs with a blower, and moves about 2x as much air/exhaust as a 4 cycle engine.  I still have the tank in place (empty) and will likely leave it so.  Not sure if it makes it quieter or not, think the muffler does as much as anything.  The Detroits are notoriously (sp?) noisy though, running at 1800 rpm, they have twice the pulses of a 4 cycle.  It is tolerable now, but am placing the Listeroid adjacent to it to generate (quieter)  power when I don't need the Detroit (It's main job will be to turn a sawmill).  I still think running the exhaust through water will quiet it alot, but you need some surface area to disperse the exhaust gasses.  I'll be experimenting more after I get the Listeroid up and running.
Ray

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