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Messages - rbodell

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16
Waste Motor Oil / Re: Wmo
« on: February 03, 2011, 02:29:30 AM »
Does not seem to be many posts in general but there is no posting in waste motor oils.
Am I the only person using it to generate electric ever day?
People say they are using it and then they go very quiet.
A lot people talk about generating there own power but 2 years on they are still talking about it.
If your using wmo as a main fuel every day in a generator lets hear about it. 
Cheers
Matthew

I bought my Listeroid with the intention of testing the WMO theory because there was not much on the internet about it. I did track down several people who have been running 75% or more WMO in diesel engines for over 25 years. I was prepared to rebuild the engine if it did hurt it, but so far, it hasn't even gotten broken in yet.

I have been running 100% WMO for several years. Well over 2,000 hours. the engine runs cleaner and with more power on WMO than on diesel fuel. I can turn an automobile alternator at 30 amps at 300 rpm on the engine before it starts to smoke. On WMO, I can run it up to 35 amps before it starts to smoke. Under normal full load it has only a slight bit of smoke visible on diesel. Absolutely no smoke on WMO.

As for that hilarious post about WMO damaging an engine, I suppose it would if you did not filter it or bring the PH down to neutral. That would ruin any engine. I find it pretty odd that anybody could be that ill informed about engines that they would do that though. I would classify that with the rest of the "INTERNET RUMORS".

I use a basic biodiesel processor to process the WMO with a Dieselcraft centrifuge filter that brings it down to 2 microns. I now have 2000+ hours on the original goldenrod 10 micron fuel filter. My fuel does not have a pump, it is gravity feed so if there was any obstruction, my engine would not run. I have no plans to change it till it starts to affect the running of the engine just to test it out.

 

17
General Discussion / Re: CMD 45HP 'oid 3 cylinder
« on: October 03, 2008, 11:46:35 PM »
HI
I'm suppose to be packing for anniversary holiday--not posting. Two quick things:
By all
SteveU

I se where your priorities are.

18
Lister Based Generators / Re: She's A-L-I-V-E !!!!
« on: October 01, 2008, 09:05:29 PM »

The bad:
My intention to put a steady load on the engine with a grid tie inverter is, at least for now, not achievable. This means the engine will only be used as an emergency power backup system and it will not be usable for house heating as I had hoped.  I do not wish to turn off the hydro feed but even if I did, the steady state power consumption here is between 1000W and 1500W for the majority of the day and that is (IMHO) insufficient for a load for the engine.  My average daily consumption based on the utility bill is between 40 and 50 kwh. There are also the occasions when using the kitchen or washer/dryer where power requirements exceed generating capacity. To run off grid would require a setup that contains a fair sized battery bank and an inverter that assists the generator when needed. This of course is achievable with the proper injection of cash into the project but I don't feel it will be satisfactory as compared to being hooked up to the grid all the time.

The result:
I will finish the odds and ends that still need doing but the project is, for all practical purposes, finished until I can figure out how to put a continuous load on the engine that does not involve talking to the utility company or the electrical inspector. At the moment I can't see any solution short of somebody offering me a truckload of slightly used deep cycle batteries for the cost of providing them a good home. I could put a resistive load (heater) on the engine but that just seems wrong.

There are a lot of other projects around the house that have been neglected and it is time to catch up on those.

Jens

It sounds like your engine might be a little big for the load on it. Just a thought, since most of my load is charging batteries and a battery charger automatically shuts down as they charge up, I use a rheostat on an automotive alternator to set the charge at a rate that suits the load on the engine at a constant rate. That way you could set a constant load that coincides with the minimum load. Is that clear as mud?

If the electrical load from the house should go up to the point that you need the full power from the generator, maybe you could put in a relay to cut out the alternator all together. Then when the load from the house drops, the alternator would cut back in. Somebody should be able to come up with some type of sensor that would sense a drop in voltage to activate the relay and turn off the alternator. Of course you could also shut off the alternator manually when you know the load will be big.

I have 6 golf cart batteries and charge about 30 to 35 amps without a regulator. These are enough that the batteries do not overcharge or even heat up. I only add water about every 5 or 6 months.



19
Lister Based Generators / Re: She's A-L-I-V-E !!!!
« on: September 23, 2008, 11:20:34 PM »
Where did you get that nice looking fuel filter/water trap that's on it?

That is a Racor isn't it?

20
General Discussion / Re: Our grid is collapsing - hows yours?
« on: September 15, 2008, 03:29:18 AM »
Had 3 power outages yesterday - 2 today with the last one lasting over four hours.

The local utility just raised the rates to over 40 cents per KW - 37cents  plus another 3 cents additional fuel surcharge.

Diesel is almost 6 bucks a gal (US gal.) - people with generators (mostly chinese screamin' banchees in a box) are beginning to scream bloody murder at the cost of running their genny's during these frequent outages.

Lots of people have been cut off from the utility cuz they can't even the pay the  price for power to run a fridge and some lights, let alone a TV.

The local situation is totally due to mismanagement - deferred maintenance and repairs etc. I wonder whats goin' on in other places?

Bad news - outrageous prices for unreliable power - Good news - the roid is runnin' just fine, thank you, and thats all of you, very much!  ;)

Hope everyone's local "grid" is in better shape  than ours.   ;D

Cheers, Fred


The only time I hear about an outage is when it has been off long enough that my neighbor comes through the back gate with his coffee pot in his hand.

21
General Discussion / Re: Gen-Set Earning Her Keep
« on: September 15, 2008, 03:25:00 AM »
Glad your all okay.  And your hobby has found new favour with the wife :)

Are they giving you estimates on getting the grid back up?  Hows the diesel supply holding out?


It could be from 2 day's to 2 weeks :(
I have ~25 gal of fuel and ~20 gal of used motor oil. I have been mixing 3 qts of fuel to 1 qt of "coffee filtered" motor oil. I know the oil is a bad thing but one must do what he must. I will just have to deal with the injectors & carbon later. Where else will burning the oil cause a problem barring EPA?

I am running 7 gallons of WMO to 3 gallons of diesel and after 500 hours there wasn't enough coking to even bother with. Can't even see the exhaust. I do run it through a Dieselcraft filter and treat the PH to bring it down to neutral. I am still running the original goldenrod 10 micron fuel filter in the fuel line. It is gravity feed and it works fin in temperatures down to 10 degrees F with no problem. This makes me think about trying it in the summer without any diesel fuel if 10 degrees doesn't make ti thicken enough to hurt anything in the summer. I have my doubts about running 100% WMO in the winter though.


22
Everything else / Re: Sound insulation
« on: September 14, 2008, 07:15:15 AM »
I can rule out exhaust noise totally so all that is left is the valve and engine noise. My engine sets 10 feet from my living room wall and I can't even tell if it is running.. There is a plywood shed around the engine but no insulation. The only insulation is in the fiberglass insulation in the house.  As long as you get rid of the exhaust noise, normal insulation should take care of the valve and engine noise easily.

23
Everything else / Re: Running an electric water heater with a 6/1
« on: September 14, 2008, 06:41:32 AM »
I did a little experiment last winter. I put a 30 gallon water heater tank (uninsulated) in the house and used that instead of the cooling tank on my listeroid. I usually run my engine about 6 hours a day to produce my electricity, so I split that up to 3 in the morning and 3 in the evening and that kept the tank warm (100 to 170F). That in turn kept the hose warm enough. Don't get too excited there, my house is 180 sq feet and well insulated. I was seriously considering adding some coils inside the tank for the shower water but never got around to it and I still would have needed an water heater for the summer too.

I was surprised at how long the uninsulated tank held heat. I also had a heating element in the tank but never used it. I eventually took it out for a wood stove, but it really opened my eyes at just how much heat can be collected from the cooling system. You wouldn't want to take all the heat away from the exhaust, but you can still take some. Granted, it wouldn't do a whole lot (comparatively) on the average home, but it would make a noticeable difference.

A gas water heater is probably the best deal but even so, you only need to heat the water when you are going to use it and most water heaters heat up in 20 minutes and then you can shut them off.

24
Listeroid Engines / Re: Made a propane tank muffler today
« on: September 05, 2008, 03:23:53 AM »
Tom -
  I snapped a few.  This one is approaching the engine.  Twenty plus years ago the unit had a tin roof, now it sits in the weather.  It was a dreary rainy day all across Texas, hard to get any color.

OH MAN, just imagine that out front by the road running ... as a mailbox stand.

25
Lister Based Generators / Re: Is anyone using a PMG
« on: September 05, 2008, 03:14:01 AM »
I'm sceptical.

The best PM DC motors on the market suffer from poles demagnitizing overtime when subjected to DC drives or high inrush starting currents and I don't see any reason to believe the Chinese have cracked this problem.

As for the voltage regulation no PM generator will ever match a conventional Syncronous Alternator with a proper AVR.
There is no such thing as self regualtion on a machine with no field control.
Thats like calling brick on your accelerator cruise control.
127 to 108 volts NL to FL is outside the 10% limit that most electrical equipment is designed to run at and is nothing to boast about.

Show me some proof from an objective source and I will eat crow.



I kind of have my doubts that they would demagnatize all that fast or that much. You would probably have to have some pretty sensative equipment to see it over a couple of years.   I have a military surplus 1/3 HP 192 RPM PMDC motor I have had hooked up to numerous drives and used as a DC generator. Mostly it runs about 20 to 25 amps but I have had it up to 35 amps and hot enough to burn the paint off of it a couple of times but it hasn't lost anything you could notice without test equipment over the last 15 years. Being military surplus it is probably better quality than most, but then magnets are magnets are magnets and these have been mistreated at best.

27
Generators / Re: Capacitor
« on: July 18, 2008, 04:59:57 AM »
Screw driver to be sure, resistor across the cap at all times is the modern way to dump the charge.

I remember in shop class once the teacher was talking about capacitors and how they hold a charge. He had laid one in front of everybody and said "don't touch it until I tell you to".He said do exactly as I do. First you pick it up by one wire like this .. and he picked it up. Then you do like this .. and he stuck the other wire (almost) to his tung. OK now on three you do exactly as I did ... one, two and three ....

Now then for those of you who weren't paying attention, I didn't touch my tung. However that is not important at the moment. The important thing is that you will NEVER pick up another capacitor without remembering to discharge it.

He was rite too. I never did forget to discharge them.

Now days he would have been fired. back then it was a valuable lesson every one of us remembered.

28
General Discussion / Re: Incredible Elbow Engine
« on: July 16, 2008, 02:57:30 AM »
It kind of reminds me of a hydraulic pump.

Ya know, I bet at one time somebody said it couldn't be done.

29
Listeroid Engines / Re: Made a propane tank muffler today
« on: July 12, 2008, 02:44:33 PM »
What do you need to prepare the propane tank for welding(to clean out of fumes etc..)

I filled mine with water.

I don't know if there is any truth to it or not But I have heard thaat the metal cam absorb the propane too that means it can still explode after you empty out the water. Just to be on the safe side I left it full of water rite up to where I was going to be cutting. That way if ti was true, there wouldn't be much of a fire and only a pop. I never had either but that doesn't mean it won't happen. Cutting and welding on propane tanks is something you do at your own risk.

30
Waste Vegetable Oil / Re: WVO processor update
« on: July 12, 2008, 01:51:41 PM »
That all sounds VERY energy intensive...

Assuming 40 kWh per gallon of wvo/diesel, your running a 3.7 kW electric motor, a 3 Kw heater, etc etc, this is non trivial, and you haven't given numbers with a kill-a-watt meter so let's just assume you use 20 kWh of power to run the batch.

Assuming 30% conversion efficiency from fuel to electric that's 60 kWh, or 1.5 gallons of product, to process a 30-40 gallon batch, OK, you come out ahead, but you're still using up 5% of the product to process the product, which seems very energy intensive.

Now, a system that worked all day every day with no user intervention, just fill the top hopper and let gravity and sunlight do the work, that I can see working, a dripping tap will fill a bath quicker than you'd think and all that.

EROI basically.

I have a similar setup I use to process WMO. Since people pay me a dollar a gallon to drop it off here, the more I burn, the more I make. Granted, at a dollar a gallon, it barely covers oil changes and filters etc. but still, when you are paying nothing for the fuel, 5% of nutten  is still nutten. Lets face it, nutten is free, everything else costs now days. It either costs money, energy or time. If time is more important to you, then you have to look at it from that perspective. Now me, I am retired and I get board easy so I have lots of time available to me and my projects. I can sit and watch a barrel of WMO settle for a year with no problem. By the time I get around to processing it, I don't have to pre filter it, just run it through the dieselcraft. Yeah I got to clean it once and a while and occasionally the jets get plugged and need to be cleaned, but If I wanted turn key I wouldn't have this engine.

The same goes for money. I like to look at the long term. Price-wise filters are a lot cheaper than a dieselcraft or simple centrifuge, but at some point you are going to get to the point where you start thinking, damn, if I had thought ahead, I could be filtering this for free by now if ....

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