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Messages - mikenash

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796
Are these a viable thing to use on a daily basis? I know nothing about them, but they all seem capable to run on kerosene, and modern diesel seems pretty close to kero. They are likely more greedy on fuel with pumping losses,  but maybe they are an option? Quieter mechanically too  than a diesel......

There was one at a Central HB show a while back which was almost silent.  Most impressive

797
Yeah, I saw that one

I'd only really buy another 5 or 6 HP I think - there's a local guy here with a paddock-full of old ("D" maybe?) petrol ones he's going to have trouble giving away . . . .

Did you see this:

https://www.trademe.co.nz/business-farming-industry/industrial/engines-motors/petrol/auction-1421072338.htm

I'd like a diesel one of them

Cheers

799
Lister Based Generators / Re: Rocketboy and Cujet Hurricane Irma commentary
« on: September 11, 2017, 07:53:14 AM »
I wish I could read that long.  What was the second half about?
[/quote


nothing

Your comment reminds me:  Down here at the Bottom of the World in the Island nearest to Australia we have two cultures, Maori and European (universally referred to as Pakeha).  Pomposity & pointless verbosity isn't limited to Pakeha politicians

A while back I attended a function on a Marae  (traditional Maori venue) where there was a fair bit of speechifying to-and-fro

One young Maori man stood up on the paepae (the speaking area) and spoke at considerable length.

It was clear that in his own mind he cut an impressive figure with his tattoos, his suit, his XXXXL whalebone pendant, his ornately carved walking stick and his extroverted style of oratory.

He strode manfully back and forth across the paepae, speaking in Maori, waving his stick, shaking his fine head of hair  and punctuating his speech with fierce facial expressions.

Eventually he sat down.

A little girl, aged maybe six, who had sat listening politely but uncomprehendingly to this lengthy oration turned to her grandmother, a dignified older Maori lady with a genuine tattooed chin - we would call her, respectfully, a Kuia.

The little girl asked "What did the man say, Grandma?"

"Nothing" she replied . . . .

800
Original Lister Cs Engines / Re: guess what
« on: August 26, 2017, 09:23:35 PM »
A point to note....

My 6/1 stared life as a hopper cooled 3.5/1 according to the ID plate. I acquired it with a larger cylinder and head, in perfect non running condition.

I rebuilt it, with a few Indian spares, just to see what I was missing, and it leaped about all over the place.

I did the balancing thing, it seemed to need a lot of extra weight, can't remember how much now, so I sent for an alloy 8/1 piston, it's really smooth now, at around 600 / 650 rpm, with no extra weights.I'm sure you've all been glued top my Youtube vid. with the can of oil balancing on the rocker cover ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=js3zz6CECqY&feature=youtu.be  for those who missed it)

Anyway I'm sure there's a difference between 3.5 and 6hp flywheels, when you consider the extra metal in the larger piston there must be.

So be aware if you decide to 'Big Up' you spare bottom end, Mike!

Cheers Stef

G'day Stef

Yep, that smooth-running video is impressive

I bought the 3.5/1 wearing a truck piston which had allegedly been machined at the top to get the squish right and which came with 15 years worth of rainwater in the cylinder.  A mate took the head as a spare for his project and I just hung onto the bottom end thinking the crank might serve someone one day

I have two "project" 6/1s and a work-in-progress property out in the sticks where I have just been building a concrete-and-steel base for one of them, around which I will need to build an engine room.

One of the Dursley 6/1s has an Indian head and seems to run quite happily like that.  I'm planning on sticking with the 6/1s as there are spares available.  I had a 12/2 but sold it in the end, liking the simplicity of the singles more

There is a 5kVa ST-type head, a 28VDC generator, a couple of big 12VDC Leece Neville truck alternators and a 24VDC alternator all sitting in the barn waiting for me to find ways to drive some of them off the CS

No shortage of stuff to do when i get a weekend . . .

Thanks, Guys


801
Original Lister Cs Engines / Re: guess what
« on: August 26, 2017, 08:30:41 AM »

The brass plaque in the last photo warns of using "residual" fuels rather than distillate..... techy way of saying no waste oil i guess. I will polish it up prior to ignoring it.

Well done that man.  FWIW I have a complete bottom end for one of these in my yard

No idea of condition or if you need bits . . .

Cheers, mike

802
Original Lister Cs Engines / Re: CS thermosiphon
« on: August 15, 2017, 09:58:21 AM »
Would it be practical to use a tank with a coil 'the other way round'?

By which I mean use an unlagged, unpressurised, copper tank as the 'radiator' and then either circulate or run the incoming cold water feed to the heating system's domestic water through the heat exchange coil to pre heat the supply.

There would still be the frost issue, antifreeze or drain down in winter conditions for the cooling water, and if you anticipated cold weather and were not planning on running the CS, a bypass with a drain down valve on the coil would protect the domestic feed.

If one went down the pre heat route the cooling system would work as per normal, and the cold water feed to the hot water tank would require no pumps etc. resulting a simple system for the sake of a couple of hours plumbing and lagging.

Not that any of this is my intent, well, not at the moment.............

Cheers Stef

And, of course, as soon as you build anything like this which is effectively a heat-exchanger, you can run 50% antifreeze I guess, too

Good thinking, cheers

803
Original Lister Cs Engines / Re: CS thermosiphon
« on: August 14, 2017, 09:09:30 PM »
Thanks for the insights on that, guys.  It seems as if pressurising the CS head is potentially asking for trouble.

The smart thing for me to do is probably just to fit the cylinder, give it a wee ballcock-filled tank at the right level to keep it topped up, and leave it at atmospheric pressure.

Once I have a handle on how much - or how little - heat is generated, and the volume of cooling water required, then I can have a play with pressurising it.

Really, I was just attracted to the copper cylinder because it won't rust

I was away from site for a month or so recently and the winter frosts burst a small fitting between the gas hot-water califont and a "hot" tap.  Water began to flow through the califont which obligingly switched itself on and ran for however long it could before emptying a 9kg tank of propane . . . . there was only a small fire; but there was a substantial flood.  I can now add "replace flooring" to the to-do list

Clearly I'm going to have to consider frost-protection for the CS.  Probably simply draining the water when not in use will be easiest

Where I live we get lots of grey, crappy, winter days but no real hard frosts.  However, my new site, where the CS is, has a different climate

No-one to blame but myself for that one . . . .

Thanks for the thoughts on thermosiphons

804
Original Lister Cs Engines / CS thermosiphon
« on: August 14, 2017, 08:38:18 AM »
Hi guys

I'd be interested in tapping into someone's experience here, as I know several of you folks use the heat from the Lister cooling water for things like heating houses, or for domestic hot water . . .

I have just poured a concrete pad and bolted down a base for my CS and genset.  It will see the base of the CS bolted down on top of the steel base about 400mm (16 inches?) above the top of the concrete pad.  The plan is to then pour the floor at a level about 100mm (4 inches) above this pad, so that the feet and lower section of the steel base are encased in the floor of the shed as a vibration-damping device.

Local Councils here don't care about a shed if it's less than 10 square metres; so I guess this one will end up being maybe 3.3 metres on a side (say ten feet-ish)

The other things that need to go into the shed (diesel tank, cooling water tank, battery bank etc etc ) will determine whether the CS sits central, off to one side, or sort of up against a wall.  I favour "central" for ease of access at this stage of planning; but we'll see

Now, every house I have ever built or modified has had a woodstove with a wetback, so I'm comfortable with thermosiphon processes . . .

I have been thinking of using a 135-litre (30-gallon-ish) copper hot water cylinder as a cooling tank for the CS; and using the "in" and "out" plumbing and the internal riser on the "in" of the hot water cylinder as they would be laid out for use with any other thermosiphon system, so that I can have a low-pressure feed of water to the hot water cylinder at about half or maybe two-thirds of a bar (think, say, seven metres or twenty feet of head)

That would mean I need to mount the cylinder so that the base of it is a little above the "top hose" point of the Lister's cooling system, so that the hot water feed pipe is level or slightly rising between the head of the CS and the base of the cylinder, but actually terminates  about 800mm (two and a half feet-ish) above that, at the open top of the riser inside the cylinder.

I'm just kicking this around as where the cylinder sits has some bearing on the shed layout, see . . . .

Basically, I'd like to be able to have a "hot tap" pipe coming off the top of the hot water cylinder once the CS has put some heat into it

If there's half a bar or so of pressure in the cylinder (no different to a radiator with, say, a ten-pound pressure cap) do you think the thermosiphon will still work OK?  It works fine under identical circumstances when the heat source is a wetback . . .

Or maybe that bit of pressure is asking for trouble with the CS's water jacket?

I'd be interested in any thoughts or experience

Thanks, Mike

805
Generators / VAWT turbine rotor sections
« on: August 01, 2017, 09:44:05 PM »
This doesn't belong in "Lister", it belongs in Microgen but I'm not a mamber.  I'm aware there's a lot of overlap, membership-wise?

Some chap here in NZ spent a few thousand $$ profile cutting these beautiful rotor pairs out of 10MM plate (3/8" I guess)

if you look at his adverts it's self-explanatory . . .

Potentially a bargain for someone . . .

http://www.trademe.co.nz/business-farming-industry/industrial/generators-power-supply/wind/auction-1381180179.htm

http://www.trademe.co.nz/business-farming-industry/industrial/generators-power-supply/wind/auction-1381181031.htm

just thought I would mention them

806
that's more like the commentary I was expecting! thanks Mike :)

The question is does the wheel follow the cam or does it get slapped by the cam? That could change my thinking...

The bearing I've chosen are precision bearings and a bit on the tight side at 5 microns clearance, so designed for more slow speed radial force, which is what I'm expecting this environment is.  They are rated at 180kg, but that force won't be in the same place every time, because the bearing will spin with contact on the cam. Given the precision, top and bottom ball bearings will share the radial loading.

Contact area (ball bearing surface) is smaller than original, however friction should be lower....  I'm in two minds about following the advice on seals... maybe drilling some lubrication holes, the concern is these are low oil areas, which is why the units I have seized in the first place. 

If it doesn't work I'll pull them out and go with the Indian copies.... they're not that hard to get to.

Just got the crank out, so not far from the point I start putting it all back together...

Samo

Good on you, Samo.  You have obviously thought it through carefully

I will watch with interest

Right or wrong, we will all learn something :)

807
FWIW I reckon the bearing will fail.  Have you ever cut one up or smashed one & seen the hardness/brittleness of the steel of the races?  This isn't what bearings do - their strength is in using an oil film & close tolerances to distribute loads; not in repeated impacts at one spot

Why wouldn't you buy an off-the-shelf Indian part?  If you are concerned for their longevity, buy three of them.  They're cheap & available . . .

Just my $0.02

810
It's a fascinating question - hoarding/collecting/accumulating

That sort of hard-to-justify behaviour is part of what makes us human beings instead of just drones in the workforce

Speaking just for myself (although I suspect many on this forum might echo this thought) there's a race on between the useful years of life I have left (however many they be), how much money I need to earn so I don't "retire" in penury, and trying to find the time to get stuff done in those intervening years when I'm spending all my time earning the $$ I'm going to need in retirement, when I hope to enjoy playing with my toys . . . which toys I may not have prepared properly because I was too busy working . . .

My grandkids can inherit the mess lol

Ten or twelve years ago I sold the two-acre property with the big Macrocapa hedges.  It took me weeks of work and many trips to the dump and the use of the biggest skip bin that could be delivered on a truck to clean up 15 years' accumulation of what was mostly junk.  I said "never again" and moved to a smaller place with less space for "treasures"

But I sold that place a couple of years back and am now in a 3-acre property, right next to the two-acre one I sold twelve years ago - with big Macrocapa hedges around three sides and the odd Lister popping up here and there (not to mention the pile of generator components in the shed . .

Worse, I have just bought 11 acres with a big old barn on the property as my "retirement" project - so I can sit in the sun when I'm an old fart . . .

I'll need a couple of CSs there to help with electricity as it's in the middle of nowhere.  But I'm trying to keep it down to a bare minimum  . . .

There aren't any Macrocapas but, looking at the way the Manuka and blackberry grow along the fencelines, there will be plenty of buried treasures for my grandkids to unearth once I am gone  . . .

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