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Messages - listeroil

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Original Lister Cs Engines / Re: Electric starter
« on: May 18, 2020, 12:39:07 AM »
eBay item number:163833444864 Might be what you need

Original Lister Cs Engines / Re: Electric starter
« on: April 30, 2020, 06:23:35 PM »
I believe from what I've read (on here!) that the Startomatics had a blanking plug in place of the change over valve and thicker gaskets (or maybe a spacer) under the cylinder to achieve a compression ratio somewhere between high and low, If anyone can point me in the right direction I'd be grateful.=

The 6/1 has the changeover and changes the compression ratio from 19 to 1 high comp to 16 to 1 low comp.
The 8/1 has no changeover valve and compression ratio is 17.5 to 1.
With the changeover valve fully screwed in it is the same as the plug in the 8/1.  Therefore if you change the piston to head clearance from the 6/1 setting of 0.045 to 0.050 to the 8/1 setting of 0.075 to 0.080  you will be fine.  The 8/1 comes with a 0.020 steel spacer but you can make up the difference with a corn flakes packet gasket.

Generators / Re: 4.5kva output
« on: April 11, 2020, 01:37:41 PM »
I said I had this brochure a year ago.  I have scanned it and cleaned it up a bit.  It shows how the engines were built to BS 649/1958 and alternators to BS 2613/1957 Both of them capable of being run continuously and 10% overloaded for up to an hour in 12 hours. So theoretically the Lister 4.5Kw alternator is capable of producing 4.94 Kw absolute max for an hour.

Straight Vegetable Oil / Re: injector
« on: April 07, 2020, 11:46:52 PM »

Check this out its a serious university report on running a lister 6/1 on vegoil with 3 simple modifications.  Personally I think it is flawed.  They make a preheater out of the CS bung to increase the fuel temperature to 90 degC just before it enters the injector.  I dont believe this is of any benefit at all.  They have a thermostat on the engine and they do all their testing when the engine is up to 90 deg C. Not once do they ever do a test without preheating the fuel even when they don't use their fancy preheater they use electric heating on the injector pipe.  How can they know if it makes any difference when they haven't tested it with no preheating?

In their report they increase the injector pressure and adjust the timing. They recommend 15Mpa injector pressure which is 148 atmospheres. This is nearly the same as the injector pressure for the 16/2 engines see excerpt from 1971 Lister manual. They also advance the injection to 25 deg BTDC which again is similar to the 16/1 setting.


Listeroid Engines / Re: What are you guys using for fuel tanks?
« on: April 05, 2020, 10:47:02 PM »
Vegoil tank

Red diesel tank

Original Lister Cs Engines / Re: Unpainted Flywheels
« on: April 05, 2020, 09:48:37 PM »
All painted green. Original 1974 startomatic in original uncleaned condition.


Original Lister Cs Engines / Re: cracked piston
« on: March 30, 2020, 10:16:16 PM »
Pistons got to be the problem. The barrel looks like an Indian one I bet the piston is as well.  Get the seller to replace it.

Engines / Re: Kohlor 8.5 kw with Lister SR2
« on: March 14, 2020, 03:55:15 PM »
I can confirm that it is legal to use 2500 litres WVO or biodiesel tax free in the UK.

From Wikipedia
The changes came into effect on June 30, 2007. There is no longer a requirement to register to pay duty on vegetable oil used as road fuel for those who "produce" or use less than 2,500 litres per year.

Original Lister Cs Engines / Re: Water or steam injection
« on: February 22, 2020, 01:40:12 AM »

If the link doesnt work just type in   HC-12

It is funny but I forgot about extending the range on the wifi because years ago i made a cantana which was basically a pringles can with a little ariel it worked great.

Original Lister Cs Engines / Re: Water or steam injection
« on: February 21, 2020, 05:49:46 PM »
Regarding your fuel pump, I'm not sure how the Cs pump handles pressure.
I dont think the pump will be a problem with the injection pump.  The electric fuel pump is 3 to 5 psi and the only place the fuel can go is into the barrel of the IP and that is precision machined to pump the fuel to the injector at a lot higher pressure  Here is what it says in CAV injection pump manual.

Regarding water injection rates how does 16 seconds on and 64 seconds off sound?


Original Lister Cs Engines / Re: Water or steam injection
« on: February 21, 2020, 02:51:25 PM »
Thats very interesting about the wifi circuit board but I dont think it will have the range the genny shed is at least 100ft from the router.  However I will talk to my son and see what we can do as it might be nice to see the information on the computer.  Unfortunately I do not do the Arduino stuff myself.  My son tells me what to buy I buy it he connects it up writes the program and if we are lucky it works. Below is the transmitting module that I bought last week because my son connected the last one the wrong way round and all the magic smoke disappeared.  That  one did work with enough range to start and stop and was being rebuilt to do the monitoring.

Ebay item no 372740389720
● Power supply voltage : 3.2 V -- 5.5 V.(if the modules working long hours in emission state, suggested that when the power supply voltage is greater than 4.5 V , you need concatenating a 1N4007 diode to avoid module built-in LDO got fever)
● Default communication distance : about 600 m (communication distance is adjustable up to 1000 m, air baud rate 5000 BPS).
● Default idle current: 16 ma (modules in different working mode of different current).
● Module size: 27.8mm*14.4mm*4mm.
● Operating frequency range (433.4 473.0 MHz, as many as 100 communication channel) maximum 100 mw fired power (can be set)
● Module supporting software upgrades.
● Default factory Settings: working mode FU3, baud rate 9600 BPS, communication channel CH001 (433.4 M)
433Mhz HC-12 SI4463 Wireless Serial Port Module 1000m Replace Bluetooth TE296


Original Lister Cs Engines / Re: Water or steam injection
« on: February 18, 2020, 11:56:44 PM »
I've been running lister cs engines for 19 years now the first couple of years only on red diesel.  Then I found out about running them on vegoil and started using that.  At the time it was cheaper than red so I ran on new vegoil from tesco's.  Then for some unbeknown reason the price rocketed up to more than red diesel price.  Thats when I started collecting WVO from various sources.  This was not clean and what I did was leave it to stand for at least a month then decant the runny stuff off the top.  I have never dried the oil just used the runny stuff as is the only filtering was a jcloth wrapped round a 5 micron filter in the water filter assembly and the filter close to the engine.  The jcloth works great catches all the sediment before it gets to the 5 micron polypropylene water filter.  When it blocks I just change the jcloth and use the old one to start the fire.  However I now get my oil from just one supplier a firm that make crisps It is lovely and clean no whites.  I get it in an IBC 1000 litres at a time for 200 which is better than the 30p per litre I was paying before for dirty oil and  a lot easier to collect, they load it into my trailer with a forklift.  I will test this oil for water content.

It is not the piston ring thats corroded its the piston itself the area above the top ring. When the carbon is cleaned off the side of the piston above the top ring quite a lot of aluminium is missing scored doesn't happen when running on red.

My reason for using the Arduino is to have a wireless controlled start and stop. I suffer from COPD and have only 24% lung capacity and the generator is about 100ft away and its just to far to walk to switch it on or off I am virtually housebound.  Even though its a startomatic I dont like that function and have dispensed with it.  The plan is to have a wireless camera in the genny shed check there's nobody there and start it with a press of the button in my cabin.  Using the Arduino as an engine starter has some advantages.  First I can spin the engine over decompressed for a few seconds then drop the decompressor for a less stress start.  Second monitor the voltage and switch on the output contactor when the voltage reaches say 200 volts.  Also when switching off switch the output contactor off before actually switching off the engine.  Its not a good idea to have loads connected when the engine runs down.  Also got a current sensor as well as the voltage and water temperature sensor.  All these details can be transmitted back to the handset and be displayed on screen.  I should point out that my son is the one who knows how to program and build the Arduino.  Not me I just do the mechanicals.

I am in the process of setting up a pair of generators that way I can run one until it needs its oil changed.  Then swap over to the other generator until that needs an oil change.  This will give me an instant back up if either one fails.  Ive been on a hunt for years to get 2 good 8/1 engined Startomatics and now have a nice pair.  The second one has a 1981 engine that appears to be in good condition.  Just the gen head needs some attention new anti vibration rubbers new brushes and top box rewiring to push button start.

Regarding the water injection my pump delivers 6.5 litres per hour this equates to 108ml per minute I've calculated that the genny on full load will use 2.25 litres fuel per hour.  So if I run the pump for 2 minutes on and 8 minutes off this will give me 1.296 litres per hour.

I think I am going to do the twin tank system on one of the gennys because I have all the bits to do it and its been a long ongoing plan which is nearly there.  I think I can achieve quite a quick changeover see enclosed picture of system I intend to use.

This is a picture of the charge switch off a 4.5 kw Startomatic top box.

Have you located a control box choke yet as I have a spare one that I dont need.


Original Lister Cs Engines / Water or steam injection
« on: February 16, 2020, 08:03:06 PM »
I would like some advice about water injection please.  I will explain my situation I live off grid in the UK have been doing so for the last 19 years.  For most of that time I have been running old Lister 8/1 engined Startomatics on WVO. No preheating just a thermostat to get the engine up to temperature quick.  One thing I have noticed is that when I first get an engine thats been run on diesel all its life it starts first compression.  However when starting on WVO it takes progressively more turning over to start on cold WVO.  Not a big problem because its electric start.  But not ideal also when doing a decoke I find a lot of erosion occurring above the top piston ring. So I fit a new piston and away we go again.

I have managed to acquire an almost brand new 1974 8/1 Startomatic.  It was bought in 1974 when we had 3 months of power cuts to provide power for a Mansion house in Oxfordshire.  It looks brand new no wear on anything.  Probably done about 300 hours in total.  With this bit of kit I want to set it up right.  I've cast a concrete base and bolted it to that.  It runs so smooth on red diesel at the moment.

I intend to start on red and after 15 mins when the engine is warm changeover to WVO run on that until shut down then change over to red for long enough to start on red diesel next start.  This will be controlled by an Arduino.  Before I run on WVO I intend to fit water injection again controlled by the Arduino.  The Arduino will be used to control a mains operated peristaltic pump this way I can control exactly the amount of water injected per given load.  The 8/1 uses about 500ml fuel per Kwh. 

So the question is how much water to inject the same amount as fuel or less?
Another thought would steam injection be better?  Because I am using a peristaltic pump I could wrap 3/16 copper brake pipe round the exhaust and inject steam in to the inlet manifold.

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