Show Posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.


Messages - Yellownev

Pages: [1]
1
Listeroid Engines / Re: Big end wear or damage
« on: June 12, 2022, 09:44:50 PM »
Hi, to complete the original call for help, which was answered admirably, thank you - the engine is now back up and running.

I was able to polish out some light scoring of the journal and replaced the bearings using plastigauge to check the clearance which was 3 thou with 6 thou shims fitted both sides.

I torqued up the nuts to 90nm which was what I calculated was their setting when I removed them. I needed an extra small movement to get the holes lined up for the split pins.

The whitworth spanners ( wrenches) and sockets i brought were very useful.

I was able to double check the oil dip stick settings and it was good just at the bottom of the caps with the dippers totally immersed.

The whole sump was cleaned out as was the strainer and the magnet at the end of it ( nothing on it ) I primed the oil pump and checked it operation on running

The biggest challenge was knowledge, confidence and confined space.... the latter manageable despite being in the small engine room on my canal boat.

I now have the confidence to clean out the sump at the required hours ( albeit necessitated draining 10 litres of coolant, removing the starter, alternator and water pump. All no doubt meat and drink to you engineers out there but for this novice a challenge of recording everything and taking a lot of time to double check everything.

Pleasingly the engine fired first turn of the key and settled with not noise to its normal tick over which I let run for the first hour. We then did a small cruise keeping the revs to tick over most of the time.

A huge thanks to all who gave concise common sense advice and guidance and have stayed with me over my ( extended) learning for this work. I feel I know so much more about my engine thanks to your support and encouragement. Sincere thanks, virtual pints all around - sorry warm brown English beer I'm afraid !!

2
Listeroid Engines / Re: Big end wear or damage
« on: April 23, 2022, 01:05:09 PM »
Hugh, while you are correct for a single with two sumps the India twins have one sump. The mains get oil from the pump and the rods, and cam are oiled via splash from the dippers. Thus the  sump level is critical for proper oiling. The India twins suffer for thus when used in a portable application as a small amount of tilt means one rod cap is submerged and the other dipper is out of the oil. The crankcase webbing prevents much crossover oiling from side to side. I suspect that the OPs crank bearing woes could be traced back to this. I have seen it twice in engines through my shop.

My engine is in a canal boat so subject to the risks cited above of a portable install. Iíll certainly be more aware of the oil level as Iíll be able to precisely see what amount is needed and to what level on the dip stick when I refill. Iím not clear on why itís a bad thing for the rod cap itself ( and therefore the bearing) to be in the oilÖ. Thanks again for your advice and experience it is very valuable to me

3
Listeroid Engines / Re: Big end wear or damage
« on: April 22, 2022, 09:32:58 PM »
The India engines as shipped usually have one shim each side. The shims are usually .003" Your situation is different as the crank has been ground since it left India and could have been sized with or without shims.
 There are sticky assembly lubes around and any of them do a good job but they are not necessary on a CS.  A bit of oil works while you are asssembling and prior to starting you simply remove the crankcase door and give the rods and mains a squirt of oil.  A problem with India twins, and singles is miss marked dip sticks. Be sure to confirm proper oil level on the rod dippers and remark the dip stick if needed.

Hi thanks for the reply and further advice. When I removed the cap it had .003 shims on the crankcase door side and .00145 on the other side? I suspect as you say the dipstick was marked very conservatively. When I refill it I'll re mark it - what level should i fill to with respect to the rod dippers?

Kind regards

 

4
Listeroid Engines / Re: Big end wear or damage
« on: April 20, 2022, 12:27:05 AM »
Hi,

Iíve not forgotten youÖ. But been poorly had the Covid and some other med changes meant I wasnít in the right place to be at the boat.

Couple of weeks ago I did get over and got the cap off and old bearings out. Some superficial scratches to the journal that Iíve just about polished out. Now the buggerÖ. I ordered standard size  shells in ignorance and on inspecting what came out they were already over size no doubt to compensate for some turning of the crankshaft before the engine was marinised. So Iím now waiting for a set of the same ( as they were the largest I can fit ) my hope is as they were shimmed so I can reduce or remove the shims to get the required fit and clearance. I think this point was made earlier in the thread.

One question would you normally lube the new bearings with engine assembly lube or just the same oil that goes in the engine ?

As and when the new shells arrive and I am able Iíll update again. Thanks for all the advice so far.

As a ps rightly or wrongly I used my torque wrench to undo the nuts and it needed to be at 90nm to get them off ?

Take care and thanks again

5
Listeroid Engines / Re: Big end wear or damage
« on: March 01, 2022, 05:02:48 PM »
First off many thanks Mr Cujet for taking the time to go and take the picture and add the explanation - priceless for me to work with. Then thanks to all the other contributors to date. I'll let you know how I get on in the next  week or so. Again a great group of helpful friendly people, take care.

Nev 

6
Listeroid Engines / Re: Big end wear or damage
« on: February 26, 2022, 09:49:30 PM »
Thatís a great amount of helpful information I really do appreciate it. Iíll digest it and if you are able to get a photo to further explain it even better. Many thanks for taking the time to reply in such a comprehensive way. Take care.

7
Listeroid Engines / Re: Big end wear or damage
« on: February 25, 2022, 10:25:11 PM »
Nev,

I just found a source to reweld and regrind DIESEL crankshafts.  Key words: Diesel crankshaft.  Nobody in MY area will touch a regrind, let alone a reweld on a diesel crankshaft. 

Hillcrestcamshaft.com

Hi,

I know of a place in the UK who can/will regrind the journals but I'm hoping not to have to have that level of intrusion, thanks for the comment.

8
Listeroid Engines / Re: Big end wear or damage
« on: February 22, 2022, 09:23:52 PM »
Well it looks like Iíll be having a go as the engineer put me off Ö..

Iíve a question before ĎI go iní what will be the nut size that Iíll need to removeÖ.. I ask as Iím unsure if the nuts are imperial or whitworthÖ. Iíve read around and my understanding  is whitworth were Ď imperialí in measurement but a spanner/socket  size up on imperial as the size is the bolt not the nut so 3/8 whitworth would need a 1/2 inch socket ? I do hope Iím not over thinking this ?

One other thought what is the torque setting if there is one for the cap nuts ?

I did say at the off Iím on a learning curve so please stick with me if you can !

Nev

9
Listeroid Engines / Re: Big end wear or damage
« on: February 13, 2022, 09:45:41 PM »
Hi all,

Not sorted yet as an engineer I contacted got in touch and is visiting a week on Tuesday to have a look ( and a feel) so for now Iíve deferred until an expert gets a look. I am looking to source gaskets for the crankcase door and the water elbows from the cylinders Ö Iíve dropped a message to Stationary engine parts in the hope they can sell me them or source them.

Sorry itís not a progressive update and thanks for  engagement so far.

Iíll update when the engineer has had a look !

Thanks again

Nev

10
Listeroid Engines / Re: Big end wear or damage
« on: January 18, 2022, 08:32:08 AM »
Hi Cujet et al,

Nothing to report sadly as the cold weather and a few health issues have kept me away from the boat and the engine.

Thank you for the advice re the shims and the option of removal to possibly account for wear. I presume the Plastiguard tolerance check would be the guide to correct clearance along with a micrometer measurement. I have asked a boat engineer to come take a look but they are very busy as canal boats seem to have attracted a lot of purchase interest over the last couple of years as people stay local or realise their dreams sooner than planned.

If he does not show up soon it will be me and my spannerís ( wrenches) and your guidance. Itís a race of the engineer or the warmer weather !

Thanks for following up on my initial ask for guidance.

Take care

Nev

11
Listeroid Engines / Re: Big end wear or damage
« on: December 04, 2021, 10:25:18 PM »
Many thanks Listard for your very helpful and detailed reply picking up the issues I asked question on. I will read through a few times to ensure I understand them fully. The last question on taking Percy back to Paul & Tony Redshaw its location sadly too far away, worst case could be the engine going leaving the boat behind !

I'll update but it may be a while  !

12
Listeroid Engines / Re: Big end wear or damage
« on: December 03, 2021, 03:41:45 PM »

OP, is that a genuine Lister CS 16/2 engine you have in your canal boat?

Or is something more like this (and of Indian origin)?

https://www.stationaryengineparts.com/Publicity.html

Ö.. it is that actual engine ( and boat) in the link. I purchased Tonys boat back in 2012. The engine has run very sweetly with many positive comments until this recent episode.. many thanks for the link as Iíve not read that before.

13
Listeroid Engines / Re: Big end wear or damage
« on: December 03, 2021, 03:39:13 PM »
Adding to the other reply if you did indeed melt the bearing it is imperative that you clean the crankcase. Personally I would also pull the oil pump and check it for debris  and flush the lines. The Lister technical data specs the  clearances with new parts at .0025"- .003" with allowable wear .003". So, clearance could be as large as .006" and be within the spec to run it,  however I would never let one out of the shop with that much clearance.

Many thanks for the extra I formation and adviceÖ. All very useful. Thank you for taking the time to post.

14
Listeroid Engines / Re: Big end wear or damage
« on: December 02, 2021, 08:39:36 PM »
Hi, Thanks for taking the time to respond to my question - I've sent a PM

Regards

Nev

15
Listeroid Engines / Big end wear or damage
« on: November 27, 2021, 08:52:40 PM »
Please excuse my terminology and somewhat blunt approach to asking for help but here goes.

I've a 16/2 in my canal boat that was marinised for the boat and it had run very sweet for the last 10 years ( about 2000 hours on it) Recently cruising along the canal I noted smoke coming from the crankcase breather and a distinct 'knock' - never heard before. On advice from the people who put the engine in the boat i got access to the engine via the crankcase 'door' and under one cylinder these were pieces of metal, small  - on showing this to the installer they suggested it was the big end shell bearing.

On that side I can introduce same 'knock' by grabbing the bottom of the conrod and feeling some movement which i assume means the big end 'shell bearing' has failed. i suspect the smoke was the bearing heating up during its failure. I may be to blame for this as I had not completely filled the engine to the top mark on the dipstck   -I assume therefore the bearing has run dry and hot hence the smoke and bearing failure ?

The same engineer suggested unbolting the conrod and checking for wear/damage with a view to replacing the bearing. Now I have seen there are different thicknesses of replacement bearings shells to ( I assume) account for wear such as I may have. He suggested this should be an easy thing to do and check... he's experienced I am not

My questions to the enlightened is ..... is is a relatively simple thing to unbolt the conrod via the open side of the crankcase. Then is it a matter of checking the surface as well as measurements of the shaft the conrod bearing clamps to. If there is not real wear replace the shell bearing with like for like .... if there is wear replacing the shell bearing with one to compensate for the wear?

Obviously if the crankshaft surface is damaged too badly i expect that it is the crankshaft out to have it build up and turned back to spec?

Sorry if my questions are basic and contain incorrect assumptions and or terminology. I'm struggling to get anyone to take the work on and I may have to get my own spanners out .... hence the questions ?

Any observations/experience or feedback gratefully received

Nev



Pages: [1]