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Messages - DocDiesel

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2
Generators / Re: Lister Bruston Plant #2242
« on: May 23, 2013, 11:29:47 PM »
This worked well for me to post pictures here:  http://listerengine.com/smf/index.php?topic=4936.0
Doc

3
Waste Vegetable Oil / Re: Been Makin Bio Diesel
« on: May 03, 2013, 08:30:32 PM »
I removed all rubber hoses on all fuel lines and replaced with Viton.  it's way expensive, but doesn't weep, soften or dissolve.  If you look around, there are some kits out there for some vehicles.  I found a kit for my Mercedes 300 CD.  It was less than $100.  I've had no problems with any of my vehicles using biodiesel.  They all seem to like it.  I irrigate an alfalfa field and was using an old MM propane unit.  This year, I've taken an engine out of an old JD combine that is going to power my pump.  It certainly will be cheaper to irrigate with bio than it was with propane. Doc.

4
Waste Vegetable Oil / Re: Been Makin Bio Diesel
« on: May 02, 2013, 02:15:35 AM »
I've made biodiesel for 10 years.  I only screen my fryer oil and collect in a 55 gallon drum.  I drain water and gook from a bottom drain and suck oil out of a standpipe into the processor.  I have nearly 200, 000 miles on the Ford diesel.  I burn it in a Dodge diesel, the Ford, my 83 Mercedes C, my Kubota, shop oil heater and my two Listeroids.  My only complaints are, it eats all rubber and it gels below freezing and where I live it freezes a lot.  There are a few months a year I burn dino diesel, Doc.

5
Listeroid Engines / Re: which is front, back, left and right sides
« on: April 13, 2013, 04:25:05 AM »
I too find the driver's side (IP/fuel filter side) an easy way to remember.  Driver's side being where all the action is, like crankin, compression release and IP fuel shut off.  Then left of driver, right and across from.  Doc.

6
I would think my money would be better spent purchasing that sharp NEW 12/2 Listeroid for $600 more, rather than a 6/1 put together from parts...  Doc.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-12-2-Listeroid-Diesel-Jkson-with-many-upgrades-spare-parts-Lister-Engine-/330902843881?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4d0b58b1e9

7
Listeroid Engines / Re: What I've learned about my Listeroid
« on: March 15, 2013, 06:37:40 PM »
Solved my cooling problems!!  I installed a Taco pump coming out of the bottom of the radiator before going back into the bottom of the cylinder, filled with antifreeze and fired it up.  Idling along at gen head rpm with the pump on, I didn't see the temp rise above 120 F with no fan.  Loading with 1500 watts temp went to 160 without the fan on yet.  Loaded the unit to 3kw and temp rose to 190 F plus, so I turned the fan on and temp dropped back to 155 F.  No problem cooling now.
Does anyone know why the temp at the plug where the Change Over Valve could be, is higher than the head or the output of the upper radiator pipe?? 
When my input temp to the radiator is 160 F, I noticed that the plug temp is about 30 degrees hotter than the radiator input is.  There must be a pocket there that doesn't allow flow through it and it's made of aluminum?
Now, I think I'll incorporate two PID's to control the fan and pump control.  It will be pretty simple to attach high temp shut down to the rack and shut down for low oil.  The displays will give me something else to watch  as well.  Doc.

8
Listeroid Engines / Re: What I've learned about my Listeroid
« on: March 13, 2013, 09:31:57 PM »
Doc,

In the second picture you posted, is that kink in the lower hose?  Or just an artifact of the picture?  I don't think a kink would help any...

You guys don't miss a thing.  The hose was a little long when I installed it.  It developed a bend or slight kink.  I checked above and below the bend and noticed not temp difference and I could see little bits of crud circulating past the kink, so I didn't think it a problem.  I suppose all little things add up.  I think I have a slack day tomorrow and it's supposed to be warmer.  I think I will lift it outside and re-plumb with the Tako pump I have.  They are a great little circ pump and last forever.  I have installed many of them and replaced very few.  Doc.

9
Listeroid Engines / Re: What I've learned about my Listeroid
« on: March 13, 2013, 04:29:04 PM »
I also think that a bubble could have been the problem as well as the radiator would perform much more efficiently if it were higher.  I have a circulation pump, that might be a simple fix, Doc.

10
Listeroid Engines / Re: What I've learned about my Listeroid
« on: March 13, 2013, 12:12:52 AM »
Here are a couple of pics of the radiator.  I just snapped a couple between service calls.
Be nice, I don't claim to be a fabricator by trade...
The bungy cords are just for test.  I was trying different fans and haven't built a bracket yet..  Doc.




11
Listeroid Engines / Re: What I've learned about my Listeroid
« on: March 12, 2013, 04:59:02 PM »
Doc,
I used a Geo Metro Radiator that is about the same size as yours and it is only a 2 core I think. It is imperative that the upper tank has an abundant water supply. The following sketch describes how to accomplish this. The modern day radiator is not designed like the old thermosiphoned radiator of past. Water pumps are sometimes necessary but also can fail when you least expect it.




Has never gotton hot.



That's a nice looking robust genset you have there.  I thought of constructing a cage for mine but lifting it inside my low hanging doors with my Kubota bucket, I thought would cause headroom problems and my Little Kubota 2910 doesn't want to lift much more weight, I'm afraid.
I have one question about your system.  Does the flow from the engine have to go to your expansion tank or can it go directly into the input to the radiator?  I drilled my radiator cap so I could inject coolant at the cap from my expansion tank.  My cap is on tight but allows coolant to flow in and out of the expansion tank.  I thought of installing a "T" at the input of the radiator for the expansion tank injection   I could be getting an air bubble at the input of the radiator, stopping thermosiphon.  If the radiator was higher in the air, I also think it would work fine, except that would make the system too tall.  Using PIDs for fan and pump control is in the works as well as auto shut down for low oil and high temp.  My business has kept me pretty busy lately, not much time to play... Doc

12
Listeroid Engines / Re: What I've learned about my Listeroid
« on: March 12, 2013, 04:31:09 PM »
I think somebody on these forums successfully used the exhaust flow to pull air through the radiator.

I find it hard to believe that radiator is too small. It's only an 8HP engine, and that radiator is bigger than the one on my 120HP motorcycle. I suspect water flow issues, or airflow issues.

I have read about exhaust flow cooling, it doesn't seem suitable for portable use though.  If I remember right, that method has been around for a long time.  If I could get a small version of exhaust cooling to work, that would be a consideration.  I think you are right about size.  It appears I have flow problems.  The circ pump should be the remedy.  Thanks for your input, Doc

13
Listeroid Engines / Re: What I've learned about my Listeroid
« on: March 12, 2013, 04:21:46 PM »
The fuel shut off valve came from Maine Diesel, it's less than $10 but it leaked.  I called them and the only guy that knows about Listeroids was out to lunch.  I left a message, but he didn't reply.  I'll try again this week.  They use straight threads from valve to tank using a gasket and that seems prone to leak.  I haven't tried using tapered pipe into the bottom of the tank and adapting that to the rest of the line.
I've looked at a lot of cooling plumbing systems on this forum.  Do you remember specifically the ultimate one you refer to?  Thanks, Doc.
[/quotDoc, here is the basic system:
 Can you tell us more about your setup, such as what heatex you are using and some more exact dimensions of the runs to/from it?  The reason I ask is that vapor in the tank and sudden changes in tank level indicate to me that there may be boiling occuring somewhere in the system.  This could be caused by a flow problem.  If there is boiling, the pressure changes this causes would push coolant out no matter where the expansion tank was attached to the system...  As mentioned it really needs to be at the top to expell gas.  Very little energy in thermosiphon, so any air at the top will kill the flow...

I am running a 10 plate 600 sq/in flat plate heat exchanger.  Transfers heat great, but because it contains so little coolant, I had to place it really high above my engine to get it to thermosiphon well enough to transfer the heat at full load.  My expansion tank is right at the top at the heatex inlet, and the coolant level only ever changes slowly(raises 1/2" from cold to full warm).  I have had a problem with secondary flow where I overheated and that is when I got rapid changes in the tank and vapor as the engine reverted to hopper cooling mode and released the heat in little gulps of steam...  My Avitar is a scale diagram of my system, here is a larger view.   

Doc, how about a bleed/bypass hole in your thermostat; got One??  My cold water side is a 55gallon epoxy lined drum , the lines from the engine to and from the heat ex are ss hoses to stop vibes from failing the hoses.

overbore

Hi Overbore, I was trying to keep this unit dimensionally small so it can fit into my smaller shops.  My small shops have 6.5" doors, not a lot of headroom.  The thermosiphon wasn't working real well.  When I pushed the engine with 3kw of load it appears that the thermosiphon couldn't keep up.  I think that elevating the radiator would cure the problem but cause a headroom problem getting in and out of the shops.  I have a circulation pump that I will install and I think I will regulate the temp with a PID for control of the pump and radiator fan, I just haven't got it done.  I am not yet running a thermostat.  I was definitely getting some hopper cooling mode, since I too saw a couple of gulps of steam and shut it down.  I use an infrared temp sensor to check temps on engine and radiator.  I hung an expansion tank above the radiator for test.  I haven't made a permanent bracket for it yet.  Hopefully I'll have it back up and testing by the weekend.  Maybe the weather will warm a little, Doc. 

14
Everything else / Re: Waterloo JD
« on: March 10, 2013, 05:55:39 PM »
Most old Jonny Poppers were thermosiphon cooling if I remember right as well.   There are a lot of them still popping around, a few working, but mostly dressed up for show.  An employee of mine still used his "60" to move snow.  Doc.

15
Listeroid Engines / Re: What I've learned about my Listeroid
« on: March 09, 2013, 06:40:56 PM »
The fuel shut off valve came from Maine Diesel, it's less than $10 but it leaked.  I called them and the only guy that knows about Listeroids was out to lunch.  I left a message, but he didn't reply.  I'll try again this week.  They use straight threads from valve to tank using a gasket and that seems prone to leak.  I haven't tried using tapered pipe into the bottom of the tank and adapting that to the rest of the line.
I've looked at a lot of cooling plumbing systems on this forum.  Do you remember specifically the ultimate one you refer to?  Thanks, Doc.

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