Lister Engine Forum
Slow Speed Diesel Engines => Other Slow Speed Diesels => Topic started by: sirpedrosa on August 14, 2020, 01:00:05 PM
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Hi Gentles
Recently I've been told that an old olive oil plant could still have his stationary engine, but all roof of plant fall down and bush fire pass thru there, so no big hope on the site.
Nevertheless, a look on the site and wild bushes doesnt allowed to have a clue, and sun was outshine, as you can see on the pic.
But the shadow show something inside, and a slight curved line ressembled me to something familiar.
Grabbed a long scaffold lock tube to tap, and could identify a rectangular shape upside, and a narrower shape to downside (something like a chess tower), tapped harder down and definitely could hear a sound like does a fly rim.
That was all for that day.
Let see next episode.
BR
VP
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Hi Gentles
New episode...
From top side bushes doesnt let to scrutinize what was down, and from near room door neither.
After almost an hour cutting bushes, finally the iron show itself.
What a nice piece - seized of course.
It's been seated for 65+ years. Its a SD4
The easy part is done, now the most difficult part will be negotiating with 15 heirs.
Let see if it comes with me.
BR
VP
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Good luck dealing with Family who will view it as a gold mine and worth a million dollars. Hope that sanity can prevail and they let it go to a restorer who will save it.
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Very nice treasure. Good Luck.
What were you doing on their private property anyway. I hope you know what I mean?
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Hi Casey
Ive been there with one of the heirs!
I hope he convinces others. Fingers crossed!!!
Cheers
VP
PS: take a look of the site.
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Is that the remnants of some line shafting?
What was the place originally, when it was working? <-- should have read the first line of the first post!!
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Hi Adev
Yes it is. But it only turned the olives crusher, and one press. Other press was hand fasten.
Cheers
VP
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Have you got it yet?
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HI BW
Nope. One of the heirs (50% share) want to sell all scrap in a pack, so Im waiting to see if I can get the engine for me.
Hope scrap man give him a low offer.
Fingers cross.
Cheers
VP
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Hi VP, glad to see you are still hunting down valuable old relics to restore. I know where there is a beautiful Southern Cross engine and pump, sat next to a dry creek and overgrown with weeds. I want it but the owner doesn`t want to part with it. I guess it will still be there ten years from now.
Good luck with getting your hands on the engine,
Bob
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Hi Gentles
Unfortunately the 50% heir selled to a scrap buyer all bulk iron (6 tons@ 0,18€/kg ~ 1100€), dragging the other 7 to the deal.
Lets see if the scrapper wants to sell it at reasonable price, otherwise its the 2nd (1st the Lister CD) lost this year (and 1L WD40). Thamn!
Cheers
VP
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Hi Gentles
Another sad day!
The heir forgot to tell me the day scrap man got there to load all scrap, AND THE ENGINE GONE TO MELT.
THAMN!
Hope next year will be better.
Stay safe, and have a happy new year.
VP
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Sorry to hear that VP
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Hi Gentles
At least my friend kept a souvenir for me. He brought me the crank and the fuel cock.
Sorry for the tear drop!
Cheers
VP
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Gentles
Nothing like to have a nice souvenir.
Cheers
VP
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Gentles
Another day making a tour after stationary engines.
This time got lucky and spooted another Bamford, and this one is a beast.
Take a look at pics and identify it, because I couldnt find plate. It turns!
Cheers
VP
PS: its for sale! ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Very nice find but I have no idea of the model. Hope it followed you home for a rebuild.
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Cobba, Gentles
Butch confirmed, its a Z8.... and very rare.
I'll try to sneak it out to my place. Another twin... Jesus, at 600kg!
Lets see!
Cheers
VP
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Gentles,
Today was able to get crank serial number.
pic to joy.
Cheers
VP
PS: Owner want to much mouney, and it turns but no compression (maybe valves stuck)
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Hi VP, if the owner wants too much money thank him for his time and wish him well in selling the engine during these very tight times economy wise and that with the engine in that condition it is an unknown problem and might be a stuck valve or a big hole in a piston even just stuck rings. You could make him an offer at the very top end of what you would pay and if refused walk away. When any engine is in a condition that you do not know for absolute certainty then it is priced as a spare parts engine or worse scrap value. That is what I do and always will. By doing that I know what I have bought and at a price I was happy to pay not buy something that is no good at the price of a complete and running engine of the same.
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Cobba, Gentles
Already walked away!
This guy wons a "expensive" dinner near that old olive press and had sell some other bits. I mean he doesnt need to sell anything.
There is no spars market here for this engines. Only scrap business. As you saw that SD4 ended at scrap @ 0,15€/kg, rather to sell it to me.
Thats life-
Cheers
VP
PS: spooted another 12/2 running in other olive plant. see here: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1162711577093789/posts/5707170145981220/
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Hi Gentles
This saturday went to a ride with #1 to look after stacionary engines at old inactiveted olive press plants, in one county.
Most of them converted to other purpose, as houses or wharehouses, others just fell down with the weight of the years.
Found a realy good restored olive plant powered by water wheel.
And just found one engine (in bad shape), that was complementary to water wheel. (A Deutz MAH 914, and I'll fight for it)
A few pics to joy.
Cheers
VP
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Gentles,
Now the Deutz
Cheers
VP
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more pics...
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Have you bought this or just found it?
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Hi Cobba, Gentles
No, just found it.... but I'll ask the owner if he intends to sell it.
Of couse if he asks anything more than scrap price it will continue to be seated. I think if it worth maybe a long time ago it has gone.
Let see!
Cheers
VP
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Gentles
First talk is done. Not bad, I say! Let's see if the 3 girls follow my gray hair and my white beard, and my lucky charm. ;D ;D ;D
Cheers
VP
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Gentles
With my expectations high to put my teeth in this old rusty german cast iron, already made my application to Deutz forum. Here: https://www.deutzforum.de/threads/deutz-mah-914-1952-to-be-restored.63951/#post-603766
Cheers
VP
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Hi VP, it`s been a while! I do hope you get your hands on the Deutz, I`m looking forward to lots of pictures and questions.
Good hunting,
Bob
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Gentles
Another saturday morning visiting an inactive (for years) olive oil plant, the all building is for sale, but owner still have some reserves to let go the old rusty iron.
It has a 16/2 Lister of 1961. It turns and I think it is in good condition.
some pics to joy.
Cheers
VP
PS: Just for search engines: Olive oil plants (lagar ou lagares de azeite) used to have 2 manufacturers: TRAMAGAL also known as METALÚRGICA DUARTE FERREIRA and the FUNDIÇÃO DO ROSSIO DE ABRANTES. Two competing companies, with only a few differences in the castings, but today it makes all the difference in restoration.
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Hi Gentles
Another saturday and went for a ride with #1 searching for stationary engines at old inactivated olive press plants, in other county.
The first was electric and no joy, so movig on.
Before dinner I met with owners (sisters) of the Deutz, at place.
After a good chat about things of life - I WAS GIVEN THE DEUTZ, FREE OF CHARGE!
Toked a look at it with more "eyes", and could se it turns, not completely because valves are solid rusted and stuck, and a bent push rod (someone maybe tried to give it a full turn).
Will be a courious project.
two pics of the day to joy.
Cheers
VP
PS: New thread will be started soon with the Deutz.
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Congratulations VP! I am looking forward to seeing you work your magic on it. Lots of pics, questions and information please.
Bob
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Hi VP, good to hear that your perseverance has finally paid off, and a free engine to boot. Also looking forward to pictures and your normal detailed write up. Looks like being a policeman in Portugal is a good life ;D
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Gentles, Dax
You dont want to be policeman in PT. Low wage, no scheduled duty shift, half civilian rights seized by law.
But it can be a good life if you prepare you preretirement, after 30 years of career, 25 months prior to that date to have a good hobby, and not bothering the #1.
this week (vacations) I hope to put it on the hilux, and enjoy several months of rust, torch, ATFCetone, hammer, etc...
Cheers
VP
PS: I can feel from here your elbow pain. ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Tell me more about your Hilux. I too have a Hilux, 1990 model. In Europe they were branded as a VW Taro. A few weeks ago I suspected a blown head gasket, so took it apart last weekend to have a look. Blown between # 3 & 4 cylinders, so head is now with the engineers' Hopefully by next week it'll be up and running again. Not bad for a 32 year old van.
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Dax, Gentles
My Hilux is 1992, 3rd hand, it got 282.000km. And here the brand Toyota came to stay. We got the factory that produces the late model Land cruiser 70, exclusibly to export to Arabias, South Africa and Australia.
Mine has patato assisted stearing! ;D ;D ;D ;D
A carefull maintanence and they last.
Cheers
VP
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Interesting. So what engine do you have, 2.2 or 2.4 petrol, or 2.4 diesel? Very good forum for everything Hilux is www.hilux4x4.co.za
Mine is a 4Y (2.2 petrol) with 340K Kms. Agree, with maintenance they last forever. In South Africa they call them "kan nie dood nie" which translates to "cannot kill". Even Jeremy Clarkson couldn't kill one after pushing it off a 5 or 6 story building.
Sorry to hijack your Bamford thread.
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Dax, Gentles
Mine is 2.4L diesel, with 2L engine (no turbo, otherwise would be 2LT).
And yes we can always start a topic to discuss our utes, but a break it's not harmful to no one.
Stay tuned...
Cheers
VP
PS: Restored by me, except some body dents and paint job.
PS 2: 5 seats.... and a hull wood box of 1,6m*1,6m.
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Gentles
Another ride, last Sunday, with #1 searching for stationary engines at old inactivated olive press plants, in 3 spots not seen other week.
1st as a Lister 12/2 seen from window, and wating for more pics of owner.
2nd clearly water wheel (need to contact owner).
3rd was electric.
Now we getting somewhere, pics loaded
Cheers
VP
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Gentles
Another Saturday digging in old and inactive olive oil plants.
3 of them were electric (pic of remnants of one);
1 would be water wheel and was empty of machinery (scrapped for shure);
AND ONE... HAS A BAMFORD SD3. And Ill try to put my theeth in it.
A few pics for the show.
Cheers
VP
PS: Sys let put pics in this reply, but not in previous.
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Hi VP. What a beauty! Go get it tiger!
Bob
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Hi SP
Do you have an ex police dog that has retrained to sniff out old diesel and engine oil?
Another great find, good effort.
Cheers
Stef
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Hi stef, and Gentles
Things are going. Made a worksheet with the most ancient lanes of production of olive oil, and made contact with of civil parishes to ask for inactive olive oil presses.
Therefore Im making satarday tours to see those sites.
Im preparing my pre Retirement (25 months left) and I need to be occupied! ;D ;D ;D ;D
As you can see there will be some engines that can be traded by LEF members (Peter and Rita Forbes, made a load at Algarve, years ago).
No need the dog, just a open heart to people - because they are very suspicious about strange people around.
Just keep an eye in the thread... I think good stuff will come around.
Cheers
VP
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Hi VP, you are a very lucky man to live in such a target rich environment, I wish we had some of that in Tasmania!
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Take a visit to Pearns World, there is a heap of toys to choose from, just not for sale.
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Gentles
Could get info from UK, and that SD3 is dated from August 1935.
Cheers
VP
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Gentles
Another Saturday tour to olive oil plants, or remnants of them.
One of those I thought electric after all it got a BLACKSTONE JP 16HP (A BEAST);T);
Other one has a cannibalized Lister CD.
A few pics for the show.
Cheers
VP
PS: Blackstone has no heirs, but woner is a bit wird (Taxi driver in Paris for 42 years, and his lovely son died 20 years ago, of bike accidente) [Got no expectations there!]
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Hi VP, good luck, I hope you can get the Blackstone. I`ve always wanted one.
Bob
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Gentles
At the 1st parish site only remnants of a very old olive oil plant, and by its look it was fully manual.
At the same site a very old well with water chain bucket to be run by cattle.
And a beautiful medieval water way.
A few pics for the show... and it goes on!
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2nd parish, had 6 sites to see but only one was wide open - and vandalized - it has a 12/2 of 1953, but someone cut main shaft to take one fly.
See the disgrace!
3rd parish, had 3 sites to see, but one was dismantled, other was water wheel and dismantled, and the other demolished to bild a home.
4rd parish, had just one site, and it was wrecked, and dont know if there is something inside.
Found another in same street ant it has a 12/2 rusty but I think fair condition.
After that it was time to dinner (16h30), and nothing than a delicacy and a beer. After that heading home... and 450 km done.
Cheers
VP
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Hi VP, very sorry to see the the condition of that 12/2 but it does not look like it was cut off, perhaps it sheared off due to metal fatigue or the governor allowed it to over rev. I hope nobody was near it when it did. If you ever go back, have a look for the missing flywheel about half a kilometer away in a paddock! If you can get permission from the owner, there might be some usable spares to be salvaged, I would certainly be salvaging that long run fuel tank.
I forget what a beautiful country Portugal is, haven`t been there for 30+ years but the color of that sky brings back memories.
Lets hope your next expedition is more productive.
Bob
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Bob, Gentles
That fly was cut off for sure. Stress only occurs (I think, otherwise is a metal fail) at pulley side.
And metal stress shearing doesn't have scratches of the saw teeth on it!
And yes this blue sky still here, AND SO IS THE DROUGHT!
And yes, I know Where is a set of 2 flys with crank. and I could fix it, BUT now I'm after rarities. Already have my 12/2.
As I said before, they are spotted, and if any member wants to make a tour to take one, half of work is done! Capisci?
Cheers
VP
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Hi VP, I am amazed that someone was determined enough to cut through the crankshaft with a hacksaw, must have taken them forever.
I heard that most of Europe was in a drought, China to, while we in Australia have had the worst flooding in history. Climate change I guess. That said, recycling and repurposing is a lot better for the environment than throwing stuff away and buying new.
I would love to own a 12/2 but the shipping costs would be huge and there are plenty in Australia already.
Bob
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Gentles,
Could save a afternoon to make my ride deep in mountain.
2 sites (almost 3) visited. first all closed, and appeared to be electric.
2nd was inside village and roof plaster and roof structure partially down, and at engine room all roof down and big trees growing inside.
It has a Lister CS 8/1 of 1965, seized by rust, and pepper pot all roted.
3rd spot owner was making his grape harvest, and said didn't had time at this moment to show olive oil plant (electric, but still have stationary engine).
And of course a beautiful landscape (2 dams above and 1 below stream).
Some pics for the show.
Cheers
VP
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Gentles,
This time was something to save to pictures album. 3 day ride with #1.
~1000km road,
40km Bus,
68km train AND
107km by boat (10am/5pm) and 3 dam locks to upstream.
But 1st things 1st.
1st day spoted a olive oil plant (with roof down) ask for owner and he gave a tour inside. engine room still have roof. Its electric powered but still have its diesel in place. It doesnt turn and have sump dry. Owner want to make museum with all machinery but working and ask me if I can put engine back alive.
2 pics for the engine, after a few more of the river journey.
Cheers
VP
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A few postards!
Enjoy!
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A FEW MORE!
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LAST 2
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Nice pictures there. What part of the world are they and is it the Rhine River?
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Cobba, Gentles
No Cobba. You have to get out a few days of that southern rock! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Just take a look on the ship's flag! CAPISCI?
Its the DOURO river where I was working till last Jan!
Cheers
VP
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Okies, flags don't mean much to me sorry but discovered the River Douro in Portugal.
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Gentles,
Well... the only engine was the one hand chain saw (wrist is screaming).
8 days cropping olives - 1008kg to the press, and a few buckets to all team members.
Final result, 125 liters of Extra Virgin Olive Oil.
Pics by order:
1 - The work horse to clip the olive tree.
2 - The team - relatives and neighbours.
3 - Chain came out of the sword - happens to the best!
4 - Clipped tree to prepare it to next year.
5 - Cleaning olives with blower (leaves, sticks, saw dust and other garbage).
6 - weighing with 30kg per bag.
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7 - stack up bags till the end of croping.
8 - hulling olives to the olive press facility.
9 - conveiing olives into plant (and Mom policing operations ;D ;D).
10 - washing olives of any debris, and going into crusher. (Can you see the old line shaft by the ceiling?)
11 - plant crew filling press car with mats of olive paste. (crew is from India)
12 - five presses working to extract olive oil.
13 - presses's high pressure pumps.
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14 - 5 presses extranting the gold.
15 - Hut taking the liquid gold to home. 125 liters.
Lets see next year crop!
Cheers
VP
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That is very interesting VP, I have not seen inside an olive pressing plant before.
Now can I ask a stupid question please. What if anything can be done with the pulp of the fruit once pressed?
I do like a good olive and we use olive oil in our cooking and dressings but not until I saw the pulp did I think of it.
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Cobba, Gentles
There is no such thing of stupid questions, only stupid answers - those does not answer the question made!
Once pressed bagasse can be given to feed animals, like hogs or to fertilize soil.
or sent to another facility to extract bagasse oil - its a chemical procedure.
After extrat bagasse oil, dry bagasse is used as fuel to heat the boiler.
Satisfied?
Cheers
VP
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Cheers, thanks for the reply, very interesting
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Thanks for this VP, got me thinking about how many olive trees I would need If I wanted to run my diesel ute on vegetable oil. Assuming that I use 100 liters per week that adds up to 5,200 liters per year. 1000kg of olives produced 125 L of oil so I would need to grow and process around 42 tons of olives every year! Recycling waste vegetable oil looks like a lot less work! :laugh:
Bob
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Plus the press to squeeze out the juices too Bob. Would be cheaper to buy the fuel I think.
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Gentles,
Things are at idler. Parts are at machinist shop, items from germany are overdue.
So... restored another souvenir from the SD4. The fuel tank tap.
After clean, lapped the tapered opening, put adapted spring and new split pin.
1 pic to joy.
Cheers
VP
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It is good to do a straight forward job. You can actually do it without having to think too much and get a good result.
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Gentles,
I've been dealing with some health problems, but we'll see if this gets better, and that's why I didn't have time to post another raid looking at old olive oil mills.
This time it was in a mountain county, and I concluded that in mountain areas they were all moust powered by water. Found one powered by grid, and remnants of one once upon water wheel with engine a long gone stand.
I found a very old one that was powered by an animal and the press was manual.
The mountain has wonderful landscapes, with villages lost among the rocks.
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A few pics of the manual press with animal powered mill.
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Nice landscapes.
The Deutz in done... got to find another project soon!
Cheers
VP
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come and sort my CD Lister for me if you want. After re-ringing it it has more compression than before and my bung shoulders wont let me start it up again.
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Cobba, Gentles
Doesnt your CD have the decompressor lever? Its the only issue?
Cheers
VP
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Yes it does VP both high and low compression. My big problem is my shoulders, both of them. Had operationjs on them in the past one is not bad theother is a total mess. Right now I am organising an MRI scan to try and discover what has gone so wrong now. So I am unable to get those last one or two swings on the crank to get it to start.
The other problem is the total weight of the engine and transporter, well over 500kgs and again I can no longer manovoure it about or load it to take to a rally. So it will be put up for sale and I will continue along with my smaller engines.