Lister Engine Forum

Alternative fuels => Waste Vegetable Oil => Topic started by: glort on September 23, 2018, 09:51:41 AM

Title: Guide to using Veg oil.
Post by: glort on September 23, 2018, 09:51:41 AM
Buggered if I can find the thread where this started now but as requested, here is my guide to using veg oil.
It flys in the face of about 90% of the info on the net, but it's what I have learned through hands on testing and experience over the last 15 years.

If there are things I have left out people want to know, by all means ask and I'll do my best to address said questions so the info is as valuable to as many people as possible. I have left the files on my site so I can more easily edit and update them as need be as feedback dictates.

It's not short so those with comprehension troubles should not bother but it's not something you can tell someone how to do properly in a single paragraph either.  Shorter to read this than spend years wasting time on useless and incorrect procedures. 

The PDF version is here:

And the word version is here:

Should be easy to print out for those that are interested or good night time reading on screen for those with insomnia to who want to nod right off.
Hope it is of some help to someone though.

Title: Re: Guide to using Veg oil.
Post by: old seagull man on September 23, 2018, 10:52:43 AM
Thank you Heir Professor Glort, lover of questionable German misstress's and whisper of decade  dinosaurs.

A most interesting read and some good advice to keep you on the correct road.
Jokes a side thanks for the massive effort of putting all this together, sharing what you know helps us all.

So Thanks 


Um, I have to pick up Chinese for dinner tonight, her indoors night off. Must check out there oil drum while it wait.  LOL.
Title: Re: Guide to using Veg oil.
Post by: ajaffa1 on September 23, 2018, 12:59:07 PM
Thank you so much Glort for sharing your knowledge with us. I haven`t read it all as it`s past my bedtime and I`ve got to go see the doctor in the morning. I`ll be reading every word tomorrow and encouraging others to do the same, I`ll let you know if I have any questions.

Sweet dreams to you all,

Title: Re: Guide to using Veg oil.
Post by: dieselspanner on September 23, 2018, 01:03:28 PM
Thanks Glort

Well worth the read.

Whilst on the subject, is 15ml a minuet go for the WI on a 2.5 TDI Landy?, I intend to follow the advice and fit an interrupter so it only pumps on higher revs.

Cheers Stef
Title: Re: Guide to using Veg oil.
Post by: glort on September 23, 2018, 01:37:36 PM

My guess would be that there would be more water in the air the engine pulled though on a wet day than 15ml min. Not sure that would do anything much except improve the air density a bit.

If you meant to say 150 Ml minute, then that would be fine.  Probably a bit conservative for initial cleaning but OK once you have the main crap out. Really depends on the Kick in point. If it is a turbo, you can get pressure ( Hobbs) switches that you can set the pressure the water kicks in at. I set mine around 4 PSI.  That's enough for the thing to be making power and digest the water easily and also low enough that you still get a decent water shot when trundling round town.

If it's non Turbo you can set the thing to full throttle as in my experience you use that a lot on an NA diesel Or you can make up a spring loaded switch to trigger it earlier.

Load is probably a better trigger than RPM.  You probably wouldn't have half to 3/4 Throttle cruising on the highway ( would you?)  but you could be using 5 Lb of boost. My truck will do 5 LB on the flat at highway speeds and climbs through 20 Pretty quick from there. It's well dialed up though so would depend on each vehicle. Again, testing your vehicle and conditions is the key.

Another way of using the engine load to trigger the WI would be to use exhaust gas pressure.  Most vehicles with standard exhaust systems make surprising back pressure and with a Bit of copper line tapped in to the exhaust where it turns to go under the vehicle below the manifold and run up to dissipate the heat, a pressure switch could be used which would work on the power the engine was producing rather than revs. One would have to rig up a pressure gauge to get an idea of the back pressure they were getting but I remember from way back it was not unusual to see 8-12 PSI on petrol cars.

Even if the pressure was minimal with a free flow exhaust, You could use a washing machine water level sensor to trigger the WI.  Those things are extremely sensitive and would have no problem picking up the back pressure.  Cheap and easy to get as well.

The key is not to shove heap of water in but rather have it injecting frequently when the engine has some load on it.
Title: Re: Guide to using Veg oil.
Post by: BruceM on September 23, 2018, 04:43:45 PM
Marvelous job of technical writing with a fun narrative, Glort.

The WI section reminded me I must dope my Listeroid WI water with methanol very soon- freezing night time temps are coming!


Title: Re: Guide to using Veg oil.
Post by: dieselspanner on September 23, 2018, 08:24:10 PM
My mistake. your baby, as me old dad used to say!

You're right, it's 150ml / min, or around 6.5 minuets to pump a liter, a bit better than a damp day!

I'm away for a week or so, i'llget around to eventually..........

Title: Re: Guide to using Veg oil.
Post by: ajaffa1 on September 24, 2018, 10:07:53 AM
Thank you so much for the time you have spent on publishing your WVO for dummies. I will be proceeding with my plan to run my refurbished CS 6/1 on WVO.  I still have a way to go before first smoke, I also need to built it a shed and hook up the generator head. Sorry it`s all taking so long but my health ain`t great and I keep having to waste what time I have left visiting bloody Doctors. Had to go and see an orthopedic surgeon today, 250 Km round trip, he told me to go to see a neurologist. What a waste of time and money!  >:(

I will start looking for a couple of IBC containers to collect and store oil in. I will also be doing the rounds of the fast food outlets in Grafton, of which there are many. What a shame that the Australian population, which used to be slim tanned and health conscious, has followed the American model and become pale, lazy, fat and unhealthy. A perfect place to score a lot of WVO I would guess.

I will also be looking to find myself an old diesel vehicle without too many K`s on it. I`m sure there are some old Patrols, Pajeros, Prados or Hilux out there somewhere, just hard to find. I know a couple of mechanics and scrap metal dealers who would be happy to take my money so I`ll put the word out.

Once again thank you, sorry for putting the hard word on you to do it. AdeV if you are reading this could you please elevate Glort`s work to the Wall of Knowledge.

Title: Re: Guide to using Veg oil.
Post by: dieselspanner on September 24, 2018, 10:22:44 AM
+1 for the WOK

Title: Re: Guide to using Veg oil.
Post by: glort on September 24, 2018, 11:09:08 AM

Thanks Guys. Glad you found it helpful and I didn't make a laughing stock of myself.
Any criticisms, questions or additions, let me know so I can add them in.

Bob, If you can find yourself a Nissan Patrol with the TD42 Engine in decent nick, grab it. If you don't want it I'll buy the thing from you or the guy selling it.
Unfortunately they have a very good reputation and are much sought after for transplants into other models that didn't have the TD and other makes. of vehicle.

Had 2 of them now and they are excellent on Veg. I HIGHLY recommend you get a Turbo if you can find it although they didn't come out as turbo from the factory. A turbo Kit off fleabay can be had for about $6-800 and the transform the things from a slowly moving obstacle that you'll dread every hill you come to into a Mountain eating monster that when dialed up and given a squirt of Methanol in the WI, wil put a lot of other much newer vehicles to shame.
And thats before you actually do anything to them other than wind up the fuel and the boost. Put on a bigger exhaust and they start getting a bit too quick without a brake upgrade.

For a bargain Vegmobile, look for an earlier Musso with the mechanical Fuel pump. These things have the W124 Mercedes motor in them and are virtually bullet proof as well.  They can be had pretty cheap because they are not the prettiest car around ( if that concerns you) but they are pretty tough. I have personally spoken to 4 guys that have owned them and they all complain..... The clock on the dash don't work.
If that's the only complaint, I think they are doing well.

Some of the early Hiluxes and the like with the mechanical pumps should be fine too but are pretty slow and underpowered.  I'm not as big a maniac as I seem but I just like a vehicle I can drive up the pacific highway and never drop below the limit.  The patrol will do the limit in top gear and still pull away from 40Kmh road work zones in top with no fuss. 

That's the sort of grunt I like.

Don't buy a total heap thinking it will just be for  you to run around in. Once you have a vehicle that you can drive for nothing and one you can calculate is going to cost you 50 Bucks in fuel for that trip to the Doc, guess which one you'll be taking everywhere?  If you only use $50 a week worth of fuel, that's $2500 a year direct savings you can put towards the Veg burner.  Plus what you save on power with the genny.
Lismore was also a happy hunting ground on another trip. Didn't need it but I stumbled upon a load, had my tanks and pumps with me so brought back 175L from the 300L I took with me. Had to process it but made for an economical 2500Km trip!

Collecting oil in Grafton shouldn't be hard. Most country places have a disposal problem as the collectors have to come from afar and are generally no overly reliable.  I ran short on a trip a few years ago and managed to find plenty there.  Don't bother with the chain places, they all have contractors as part of their franchise but the little places can be great. that said, If the Chin stores have an accessable tank out the back ( Rare) go for it!

 Chinese/ Asian places are the top pick, Chicken shops can have loads of oil but also loads of fat from the meat. That may not be a bad thing for you.  If you settled the fat from the oil which is easy,  You could use the fat for the lister.  In summer it will be pretty Liquid, In winter have a start tank  and a fat tank.  Weld a pipe to the bottom of the fat tank  and run the exhaust or coolant through it to get the fat liquid and then you can change over.  Just have to purge back to oil in winter before you shut down.... Or keep a blow lamp handy.
Another one that can be good and is overlooked is the takeaways in industrial areas. These little places can be really busy and in my experience, can have surprisingly good oil despite what some of them look like on the outside.  the local Bowlo and RSL can also be oily gold mines.

If you get enough oil, don't worry about processing fat but some people have trouble and want to any fuel they can get. Fat is great fuel, just needs more care once the temp drops below about 30 oC. Blending with kero or petrol Keeps it liquid better as well.

Have a look round town and see what people are putting the used oil in.  Most I see use 44's with open tops so you will want to pump that. You may find some with tins but I highly recommend you get a pump. I collected from a big club a few times with a petrol water pump. Only way to do 1000L at a time but way over kill for 200L. Time you prime the pump and muck around, was quicker with the electric driven Chev pump.

We are coming into prime time for oil collecting now. Once the weather starts warming up, people go out and of course there are Christmas parties, get togethers, tourists etc. Stock up over summer when the oil is plentiful and pumps easy.  When you think you have enough/ too much, Keep going!
You never have too much.
The first 1000L will probably be the hardest and slowest to get, time you have got your first 4000L, it will be easy and you'll be able to look in any unfamiliar town and know exactly where it is.    :laugh:
Title: Re: Guide to using Veg oil.
Post by: ajaffa1 on September 24, 2018, 12:38:16 PM
Thanks Glort, I`ve been checking out the Musso range. In the Uk they sell under the name Daewoo. I didn`t know they had Merc engines and drive trains. Should be good and reliable provided the bodies don`t rust away because they are made of recycled sh1t with a poor paint job. There are a couple for sale on CarSales for under $5000 with reasonable K`s. Were the engines/gearboxes genuine German manufacture or did they just buy the designs and manufacture them in S Korea? Not worried about looks, can`t be uglier than me. Old ugly vehicles don`t get stolen or broken into often because thieves know it`s not worth the effort or risk.

I`d love a Nissan Patrol but will need to win the lotto to afford one, regardless of it`s age, especially out here in the bush where they are very much sought after. A friend of mine had a beauty, sadly it had some badly installed aftermarket electrics fitted. It caught fire one night and burned down the shed it was parked in. Luckily no one was injured. A month before he had driven it up to northern Queensland on a camping trip, it had a roof tent he slept in every night for three weeks, he still has nightmares about how lucky he was.

Title: Re: Guide to using Veg oil.
Post by: gadget on October 01, 2019, 02:32:41 PM
Hey Glort, I finally had some time to read through your PDF. Let me just say you have some great ideas. I wish I had read this years ago when I was running WVO in my diesel cars.

Your drying method is brilliant. I think it could also be done in other wasy to suit different needs and equipment. I always hated the idea of heating the oil to boil the water out. What a waste of energy to dry it that way. You are taking advantage of the air ability to do all the work for you. Its the same principle of an evaporative cooler, using the phase change of the water and dry air to your advantage. Do you use an evaporative cooler for cooling your house where you live? If so, I would love to show you my 2 stage cooler I am working on for my house.

I also now see what you mean about not needing to preheat the oil before injection. Good point on the oil temp in the injector before it is sprayed.

PDF should be pinned. A must read for anyone getting into waste oils.