Lister Engine Forum
Lister Engines => Lister Based Generators => Topic started by: GuyFawkes on February 12, 2006, 09:13:53 PM
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http://www.surfbaud.co.uk/Lister/gallery/index.php?
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Have added a bunch of new pictures, gallery name Lister 02
at
http://www.surfbaud.co.uk/Lister/gallery/index.php
All close ups of things like the solenoid linkage, injector pump, oil pump, etc etc etc
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Thanks for the pics! Question, what is the item that looks like a micro-switch down near where the governor spring would normally be and what is it for?
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speed cut out, disengages generator AC output from distribution box unless diesel rpm and therefore alternator rpm and therefore generated AC frequency is up to spec.
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Wow, that is rather sophisticated for a machine of this vintage, or even a new generator for that matter.
Thanks for the info!
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That's why I keep telling people (not on here cos I have only found this place a week ago) that before you can discount old tech as obsolete, the FIRST thing you gotta do is investigate iit and understand it in some depth.
my new one, the red one in the pictures, was built in 1956, that makes it bang on fifty years old.
if engine speed is correct, the governor will be in one place, so why not use that and a simple switch to make sure the genset never outputs wrong frequency AC?
yes, you can call it crude, or you can call it elegant.
what COUNTS is it is fifty years old, and still working.
nother example is the fuel tank with float + chain + bob weight fuel level indicator, fifty years old and it still works
you need a hell of a lot of bloody good reasons to change anything that has been PROVEN in fact and not theory to work for fifty years.
cheers
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Another question "guy" (I assume its a nom d' plume) the generator puts out 50 hz (English standard) but can that be changed to 60 hz either by increasing the speed to 1600 rpm or by some sort of fiddling with the innards?
Stan (not a nom d' plume)
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change gen head rpm is all it would take, eg smaller pulley
I have no idea at all if lister offered a 60 hz start-o-matic
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Thanks so much for the marvelous photos, Guy. I begin to understand the start o matic much better now.
I have a few questions:
Does a massive solenoid or geared motor actuator activate the decompresson pin?
Is the rack closer geared off the same actuator? It's not clear to me if this is a different actuator.
If it's moved off a separate mechanism which I didn't see, what is it's source of power- solenoid or motor drive?
Thanks again Guy!
Bruce M
Snowflake,AZ
Metro 6/1 (2002)
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solenoid, and the same mech through a linkage
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Thanks Guy, there is a lot of good, reliable engineering in these Start O Matics. I wish some Co. in India would clone it so we could get them over here.
When the Start O Matic begins it's starting function, does it start cranking with decompression pin in and rack closed, then open them after the engine is spinning or does it just pull back the rack pusher and decompression pin and then crank against compression?
Best Wishes,
Bruce
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I've seen both, after I've had a look at Ken's manual I should be able to tell you which way was factory >;^)
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I bet everyone here would love to see pictures of the inside of the crank case, the main bearings, the rod bearing.... ect.., myself included. Do it when you get time, of course. thanks ;D
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http://www.surfbaud.co.uk/Lister/Files/
start-o-matic pdf online
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Thanks Guy (and Ken) for this manual. I'm printing it out now and can't wait to study it.
Bruce M
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Guy Fawkes,
Thanks for hosting the CS engine manual. Mine was missing the sectional drawings from the back pages.
The prices for the spare parts are nearly as cheap as the Indian parts! Was this manual from 1956, same as your engine?
Ken
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Holy crap that's cool! I never knew that it actually started itself when a load was applied and shut down when load was taken off. Why hasn't anyone made a portable generator that does that?
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Two words: Product Liability.
Ok, so you're out on a jobsite. I rained last night. You plug all your tools into a distribution box, and the 20A twist lock into the generator which is off. The foreman yells to you to help scoop the pooled water that accumulated against the foundation last night. So you're shoveling debris away from the foundation when Jose the day laborer comes over to lend a hand. As he jumps off the platform onto the dry earth next to the puddle you're standing in, his toe catches the power cord of your worm-drive saw, which drops into the water. Suddenly, you hear the generator starting . . .
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Well, that could be the case. I think it would be neat though!
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List,
The Startomatic was designed in a bygone age, long before product liability was invented, and before lawyers realised that they could get mega-rich, feeding on inbred human stupidity.
But seriously, the SOM was designed for a specific purpose. It was for the electrification of farms and other remote properties in the UK (and elsewhere), in the 1950s before the electricity grid reached a lot of the smaller isolated communities.
At that time, you aspired to a 60W electric bulb in each room, a 2kW electric kettle and perhaps a 600W toaster in the kitchen. The only other appliance might have been a 200W wireless (vacuum tube) and a 300W TV in the living room. Motorised appliances would have been limited to a 750W vacuum cleaner.
Life was so much simpler then. These houses would have relied on coal and wood burned in open fires for heating, or possibly a oil fired range in the kitchen.
The SOM would be bolted down firmly in an outhouse as part of a permanent installation. There would be fixed wiring going to the house, with the SOM control box mounted on the shed wall.
There would be no question of trailing power leads, 1500W buzz saws, or the whole host of electric power tools that we take for granted these days.
I read recently that the auto-start function was not the problem, it was the auto-stop, as recalled in an anectdote by a retired Lister Service Engineer.
A farmer's wife wanting to have an amourous evening asked her husband to turn off the bedroom light. He did so, but the SOM kept chugging away. She said "I'm not doing anything until you've turned that racket off". So he was forced to get dressed and go to the shed to shut it down. When he got back, she was asleep!
Ken
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Most modern inverters that I know of have a search mode. My Trace 2512 can be set so that just the added capacitive load of plugging in a 200' extension cord will bring the inverter out of search mode. And my Generac 3500 watt generator has a mode where it cuts back to about half speed then speeds up to normal when a load is turned on. I have never used it, it is very annoying to wait for a skil saw slowly spin up.
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Andre' B.
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I guess I already have such a generator. I didn't think of it at the time because it's been quite a while since I used it, but my honda eu3000i does something similar. It just doesn't shut all the way off.