Lister Engine Forum

Lister Engines => Listeroid Engines => Topic started by: Procrustes on January 11, 2006, 04:25:18 PM

Title: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Procrustes on January 11, 2006, 04:25:18 PM
Here are the Listeroid brands I know of:

Satyajeet/GM-90        http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm
Vibha                        http://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Metro/Metrex              ?
Ashwamegh               http://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
Power Anand/Lovson  http://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htm
JKSON                      http://www.indiamart.com/jkgroup/

Any that I'm missing?

Powerful Solutions http://stores.ebay.com/PowerfulSolutions machines are supposedly made to spec by either JKSON or Anand.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: cujet on January 11, 2006, 06:14:47 PM
Mine are GTC brand. They are probably made by Poweranand. For the most part the quality seems OK.

Chris
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: hotater on January 11, 2006, 06:25:15 PM
Prakash Impex made my FuKing engine....or at least included one of their instruction books with it.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: quinnf on January 11, 2006, 06:55:04 PM
Yeah, Jack's got bragging rights on the edgiest name.   8)

I seriously doubt PS is made by Anand.  The engine doesnt look the same. 

Someone asked me earlier who it was that made the engine with the internal pushrods.  I think that was the Satyajeet. 

Procrustes, you can see there are a number of manufacturers who appear to offer the same/similar engines under different names.  So far you've only listed the ones who have websites and are interested in trade with the West.  There must be dozens of others who keep a lower profile.  India is a big country with a huge population and poor infrastructure.  I bet there are several dozen companies who manufacture or assemble engines regionally. 

Quinn
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Stan on January 11, 2006, 11:18:38 PM
Here's the email I received from Anand Ent.  This sure looks like the PS brand.  (Again, I have not interest in this company nor am I plugging their products this is for information only.

Many thanks for your email dated January 03, 2006.

We supply POWERLINE brand Engines. Please find attached our new applicable
pricelist.

Our offered prices are in US Dollars. They are inclusive of Cost, Shipping
Freight, Insurance and Wooden Case fumigation Charges upto any Canada Port,
All the port clearance charges, import duties, shipping agent fees and
in-land transportation at importing port (destination) will be in your
account. Please inform your nearest seaport.

Our engines are successfull in Australia, New Zealand and US conditions due
to following additional features which you may not found in others engines  :-

1) Online Lubricating Oil Filter for Single Cylinder
2) Arrangement to fix Thermostat Valve for cold conditions in Engine cooling
system.
3) Providing Magnets in Oil Chambers to attract Iron Particles to avoid any
damages to engine
4) Counter Balance Weight on Crankshaft for smooth running and High Torque
against Horse Power
5) Oil & Fuel Pipes are made out of Steel. There is no use of PVC/Plastic
6) Fumigation of Engine Wooden Cases as per IPPC norms issued by US Customs
and Border Protection.
7) Lubricating Oil Pump material : Gun Metal instead of Cast Iron (Gun metal
is 4 times costlier than Cast Iron)
8) Stretched Films used for wrapping engines: It keeps away dust &
protect colour
9) Changeover compression ratio valve

We have attached a strip displaying our features.

Do not hesitate to contact us for any further queries.

Regards,
Atul Patel
(Authorised Signatory)
Anand Enterprise,
11-E, Bhaktinagar Indl. Estate,
Rajkot - 360002 (INDIA)
Ph : 91-281-2362192/389
Fax : 91-281-2363729
Email : info@poweranand.com/powerin_ad1@sancharnet.in
Web : www.poweranand.com
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: schoust on January 11, 2006, 11:25:18 PM
   I only wish that somone was selling these on the East coast :(
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: kyradawg on January 11, 2006, 11:27:00 PM
?
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: trigzy on January 12, 2006, 03:18:24 AM
Schoust,
        Where on the East Coast are you?  I intend on making them available for sale here in Canada.  (I'm about 2 hours from either Buffalo or Detroit)  I normally import things from China, hopefully this goes just as well.  But I intended on giving it a once over and then some before ordering any "inventory".
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Procrustes on January 12, 2006, 04:54:45 AM
Hotater -- oh hell yes.  The updated compendium:

Prakash/Fuking           http://www.indiamart.com/prakashdiesels/
Satyajeet/GM-90         http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm
Vibha                        http://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Metro/Metrex              ?
Ashwamegh               http://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
Power Anand/Lovson  http://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htm
JKSON                      http://www.indiamart.com/jkgroup/
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Stan on January 12, 2006, 05:04:38 AM
Hi Kyradawg.....The prices he gave me were for landed in any canadian port, in us$
6/1  $981
12/2  $1717

there were prices for 8/1's, 10'1's etc but theyre in a spreadsheet format and I forgot where I put them.  theyre somewhere on this monstrous hard drive.  I'll find them if you want.  Let me know.  I know they all landed in the same ballpark.  Even the 16/2's, 20/2's etc.
Stan
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Stan on January 12, 2006, 05:11:27 AM
I forgot to add...somewhere on these forums (near the beginning) is a long post (by rocketboy I think) that outlines the difficulties in getting one of these imported into the country (any country).  There's port fees, trucking fees, import fees, inspection fees etc. etc..  I'd bet it would take at least $500 to get one of these from the port to your home even if you lived just around the corner. ???
Stan
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: kyradawg on January 12, 2006, 05:39:22 AM
http://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Procrustes on January 12, 2006, 07:11:09 AM
Duly noted.  And sorted.  Man I'm good.

Iron ingots!  I like it.

Ashwamegh               http://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
GG Automotive Gears  http://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm
JKSON                      http://www.indiamart.com/jkgroup/
Metro/Metrex              ?
Power Anand/Lovson  http://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htm
Prakash/Fuking           http://www.indiamart.com/prakashdiesels/
Satyajeet/GM-90         http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm
Vibha                        http://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Procrustes on January 12, 2006, 07:24:49 AM
Stan --

I guess you are referring this: http://www.f1-rocketboy.com/lister.html
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Joe on January 12, 2006, 02:12:23 PM
I would think the next logical list would be that of dealers/sellers and what they offer. 

After that, a list of aftermarket parts that are locally available and their sources. 

How about a spreadsheet of the various thread sizes on a typical engine?

Anyone up to scanning a new set of gaskets that could be used as templates to
cut out new "joints"?

Joe




 
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on January 12, 2006, 11:06:16 PM
It seems like it would be good to add some of the "specialty" tools too, I'm thinking of the tappet puller and gib puller from George B. at utterpower, but I'm sure there are others.  Fortunately there aren't too many, and most of them are generic.  If nothing else it would be good to list the trouble spots where a specialty tool would be useful.
Ray
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Listeroidsusa on January 15, 2006, 05:09:51 AM
I originally sold the LG brand engines from GG Automotive. They build good engines. I only changed brands due to someone (or so I'm told) who was on this board previously and didn't have the best ethics in the sale of LG engines. Due to negative publicity of the LG brand I started importing other brands. It was a shame as the LG engines were quite good and had excellent manufacturer support. John Culp's "Dolly" was one of my LG engines from GG Automotive. All the horror stories about importing Listers are true, I've got a lot of them myself. Dealing with Customs is a lot like dealing with the IRS, you never get the same answer or deal twice in a row. For example, I now have to deal with Homeland Security. That alone added $2300.00 to my last shipment, container storage until my turn came for the Vacis x-ray, bomb dog sniff, drug dog sniff, and the x-ray itself.

Mike
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Procrustes on January 16, 2006, 03:15:04 AM
Found a bunch more at http://www.listerdiesels.com/, including a better url for Prakash.

Ammerajkot                http://www.ameerrajkot.com
Anil Diesel                 http://www.anildiesel.com
Ashwamegh               http://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
Atul                           http://www.atulgroup.com
Field Marshal             http://www.fieldmarshal.com
GG Automotive Gears  http://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm
JKSON                      http://www.indiamart.com/jkgroup/
Metro/Metrex              ?
Power Anand/Lovson  http://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htm
Prakash/Fuking           http://www.prakash-india.com
Satyajeet/GM-90         http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm
Sterling Agra               http://www.sterlingagra.com
Vibha                        http://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Procrustes on January 16, 2006, 05:22:02 AM
Found Metro/Metex link:

Ammerajkot                http://www.ameerrajkot.com
Anil Diesel                 http://www.anildiesel.com
Ashwamegh               http://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
Atul                           http://www.atulgroup.com
Field Marshal             http://www.fieldmarshal.com
GG Automotive Gears  http://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm
JKSON                      http://www.indiamart.com/jkgroup/
Metro/Metrex              http://www.metroexporters.com/pages/index.html
Power Anand/Lovson  http://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htm
Prakash/Fuking           http://www.prakash-india.com
Satyajeet/GM-90         http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm
Sterling Agra               http://www.sterlingagra.com
Vibha                        http://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: kyradawg on January 16, 2006, 06:08:20 AM
GOOD WORK BROTHER! :D
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Mr Lister on January 16, 2006, 03:55:27 PM
Well Done Procrustes in tracing these down,

Sure are  "The Dirty Dozen"

What we now need to know is which are the main, reputable suppliers, who are just reselling, and who are assembling parts from other manufacturers and badge engineering. As someone else stated some of these companies are large million dollar enterprises in comparison to some of the parts suppliers and assemblers (and painters)  are 2-bit backstreet hovels.

I was impressed with the Poweranand site, they took the trouble to put a service manual, a spare parts catalogue and a test report on the 8/1 850rpm (albeit from 1979) on their site.   Interesting that this report is fairly comprehensive and contains dimension information of principal parts.

They even have a picture of Rocketboys twin sitting in the corner of its hangar, to reinforce that they are now selling to the US market.

It was interesting to see that some of the part numbers in the Anand parts catalogue were directly lifted from the original Lister parts catalogue. Does this mean, I wonder, whether, there is still a good compatability of parts for intechannging.

Time will tell, as I have several original Listers over here that will benefit a new lease of life from Indian parts.

Finally, I got no replies to my suggestion for a register of Listeroids in spreadsheet form.  Surely someone must be interested in knowing what the popular engines are amongst forum members (and not just the EPA)!



Ken




 
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: SHIPCHIEF on January 17, 2006, 06:40:27 AM
Alot of us are isolationist survivalist paranoid gun owning rugged individualist ruff and tuff types who don't want to be on no stinkin list. I even drink coffee after it gets cold!
All the rest of you guys go ahead and sign up! ;)
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rocketboy on January 17, 2006, 02:35:29 PM
Added GTC engines and persoanl comments

Ammerajkot                http://www.ameerrajkot.com
Anil Diesel                 http://www.anildiesel.com
Ashwamegh               http://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
Atul                           http://www.atulgroup.com
Field Marshal             http://www.fieldmarshal.com
GG Automotive Gears  http://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm
GTC Engines               http://www.geco-trade.com/default.asp  Geco Trading Corp, made by Power Anand...much lower prices
JKSON                      http://www.indiamart.com/jkgroup/
Metro/Metrex              http://www.metroexporters.com/pages/index.html
Power Anand/Lovson  http://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htm  " Excellent service"...Rocketboy
Prakash/Fuking           http://www.prakash-india.com
Satyajeet/GM-90         http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm
Sterling Agra               http://www.sterlingagra.com
Vibha                        http://www.vibha.com/diesel.html

BTW...NEVER buy a JIANG DONG Chinese diesel engine (Changfa style)! You'll be $orry.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Stan on January 17, 2006, 05:31:15 PM
I wonder if the GTC engine (made by Anand Ent.) is the "original" listeroid before some of the improvements were mandated by the N.A. market.  ie: cleaned, counter balanced crank, thermostat, oil /fuel filter etc..   That would explain the lower prices.  I too wondered about those prices.
Stan

Perhaps Atul could explain for us if he is monitoring this site.  I know he is a good guy.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on January 17, 2006, 05:36:06 PM
Under comments, could you put under JKSON  -  contract supplier of PS engines for Utterpower et al, or something to that effect.
Ray
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Procrustes on January 17, 2006, 10:31:34 PM
Ammerajkothttp://www.ameerrajkot.co
Anil Dieselhttp://www.anildiesel.com
Ashwameghhttp://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
Atulhttp://www.atulgroup.com
Field Marshalhttp://www.fieldmarshal.com
GG Automotive Gearshttp://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm
GTC Engineshttp://www.geco-trade.com/default.asprocketboy - Made by Power Anand...much lower prices
JKSONhttp://www.indiamart.com/jkgroup/rpg52 - Maker of PS/PowerSolutions branded engines
Metro/Metrexhttp://www.metroexporters.com/pages/index.html
Power Anand/Lovsonhttp://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htmRocketboy - Excellent service
Prakash/Fukinghttp://www.prakash-india.com
Satyajeet/GM-90http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm
Sterling Agrahttp://www.sterlingagra.com
Vibhahttp://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Procrustes on January 18, 2006, 06:56:38 AM
- Anil Diesel is no longer with us
- Misquoted rpg52
- Add Old Style Listers as a distrubutor for Anand

Ammerajkothttp://www.ameerrajkot.com
Ashwameghhttp://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
Atulhttp://www.atulgroup.com
Field Marshalhttp://www.fieldmarshal.com
GG Automotive Gearshttp://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm
GTC Engineshttp://www.geco-trade.com/default.asprocketboy - Made by Power Anand...much lower prices
JKSONhttp://www.indiamart.com/jkgroup/rpg52 - contract supplier of PS/PowerSolutions engines for Utterpower et al
Metro/Metrexhttp://www.metroexporters.com/pages/index.html
Power Anand/Lovsonhttp://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htmRocketboy - Excellent service (Meaning Power Anand directly).  http://oldstylelisters.com is a non-exclusive US distributor
Prakash/Fukinghttp://www.prakash-india.com
Satyajeet/GM-90http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm
Sterling Agrahttp://www.sterlingagra.com
Vibhahttp://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Procrustes on January 19, 2006, 04:59:35 AM
Changes:
- Separated Lovson from Power Anand.

Ammerajkothttp://www.ameerrajkot.com
Ashwameghhttp://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
Atulhttp://www.atulgroup.com
Field Marshalhttp://www.fieldmarshal.com
GG Automotive Gearshttp://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm
GTC Engineshttp://www.geco-trade.com/default.asprocketboy - Made by Power Anand...much lower prices
JKSONhttp://www.indiamart.com/jkgroup/rpg52 - contract supplier of PS/PowerSolutions engines for Utterpower et al
Lovsonhttp://www.lovson.com/lister-type-slow-speed-diesel-engines.html
Metro/Metrexhttp://www.metroexporters.com/pages/index.html
Power Anandhttp://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htmRocketboy - Excellent service (Meaning Power Anand directly).  http://oldstylelisters.com is a non-exclusive US distributor
Prakash/Fukinghttp://www.prakash-india.com
Satyajeet/GM-90http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm
Sterling Agrahttp://www.sterlingagra.com
Vibhahttp://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Doug on January 19, 2006, 05:54:28 AM
Wow thats a lot of homework.....

Good Show!!!
Doug
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Procrustes on January 21, 2006, 08:16:38 AM
Quote from: Procrustes on January 19, 2006, 04:59:35 AM
Changes:
- Add Ampro, Hrishi, Kissan Iron Works.
- Mention two Lovson lines
- JKSON prices from kyradawg, mention the fact that Joel is discontinuing his imports

Ammerajkothttp://www.ameerrajkot.com
Ampro Exportshttp://www.amproexports.com/lister-diesel-engines.html
Ashwameghhttp://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
Atulhttp://www.atulgroup.com
Field Marshalhttp://www.fieldmarshal.com
GG Auto Gearshttp://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm
GTC Engineshttp://www.geco-trade.com/default.asprocketboy - Made by Power Anand...much lower prices
Hrishi Exportshttp://www.hrishiexports.com/slow.html6/1 to 20/2
JKSONhttp://www.indiamart.com/jkgroup/rpg52 - contract supplier of PS/PowerSolutions engines for Utterpower et al.  UPDATE: according to eBay site this arrangement is over.  Direct import pricing to Baltimore (from kyradawg): $345 for a 6/1 - 735 for a 26/2. http://listerengine.com/smf/index.php?topic=166.msg1736#msg1736.
Kissan Iron Workshttp://www.kissangroup.com/kissan_iron_works/product/lister_type.htmAlloy and iron pistons, 5 to 14hp one bangers.
Lovsonhttp://www.lovson.com/lister-type-slow-speed-diesel-engines.htmlStandard Listeroids (SL) as well as the GM-90 (Little Giant, LG) series
Metro/Metrexhttp://www.metroexporters.com/pages/index.html
Power Anandhttp://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htmRocketboy - Excellent service (Meaning Power Anand directly).  http://oldstylelisters.com is a non-exclusive US distributor
Prakash/Fukinghttp://www.prakash-india.com
Satyajeethttp://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm
Sterling Agrahttp://www.sterlingagra.com
Vibhahttp://www.vibha.com/diesel.html

Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Horsepoor on January 29, 2006, 04:58:41 AM
Very interesting rounding up. I also recently purchased a GTC as did a few friends. I was pleased with the quality. and plan on buying at least one more engine. I am not exactly certain who may have played a part in the manufacture / parts, but I liked the price and quality. I think GTC is trying to break into the market, and it appears the market is expanding as more and more people discover these engines. I think you'll see similar observations from Cujet (Chris) & f1-rocketboy (Bob).

Bruce
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: kpgv on February 04, 2006, 12:30:20 AM
If you are the proud owner of a "FuKing" listeroid, you might want this in your "tool kit":

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6601638416&ssPageName=MERC_VI_ReBay_Pr4_PcY_BID_Stores_IT

 ;D"No comercial interest" :o

Kevin
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Joe on February 04, 2006, 01:49:16 PM
Kevin,
You owe me a new keyboard..I spewed my morning coffee on this one... :)

Joe
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: hotater on February 04, 2006, 02:43:46 PM
Kevin---

I agree.  THAT was destructive, instructive, on topic, and funny as all get out.   ;D
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: t19 on February 04, 2006, 09:23:00 PM
Damn my father has a couple of those in his tool kit - Immigrated to Canada in 1962
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Joe on February 05, 2006, 12:40:32 AM
Ummm.... I think you are allowed only one to a tool box.....



Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: 650rpm on February 11, 2006, 07:43:18 AM
http://www.vidhataindia.com/first.htm


I have a Vidhata 6/1
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Joe on February 11, 2006, 01:34:40 PM
mikeptag,
Welcome aboard. Alot of information available here. What are you using your engine for? Did you deal direct with India or is there an importer in the the  US.


Joe
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Procrustes on February 11, 2006, 04:58:00 PM
Changes: add Vidhata as per mikeptag.

Ammerajkothttp://www.ameerrajkot.com
Ampro Exportshttp://www.amproexports.com/lister-diesel-engines.html
Ashwameghhttp://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
Atulhttp://www.atulgroup.com
Field Marshalhttp://www.fieldmarshal.com
GG Auto Gearshttp://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm
GTC Engineshttp://www.geco-trade.com/default.asprocketboy - Made by Power Anand...much lower prices
Hrishi Exportshttp://www.hrishiexports.com/slow.html6/1 to 20/2
JKSONhttp://www.indiamart.com/jkgroup/rpg52 - contract supplier of PS/PowerSolutions engines for Utterpower et al.  UPDATE: according to eBay site this arrangement is over.  Direct import pricing to Baltimore (from kyradawg): $345 for a 6/1 - 735 for a 26/2. http://listerengine.com/smf/index.php?topic=166.msg1736#msg1736.
Kissan Iron Workshttp://www.kissangroup.com/kissan_iron_works/product/lister_type.htmAlloy and iron pistons, 5 to 14hp one bangers.
Lovsonhttp://www.lovson.com/lister-type-slow-speed-diesel-engines.htmlStandard Listeroids (SL) as well as the GM-90 (Little Giant, LG) series
Metro/Metrexhttp://www.metroexporters.com/pages/index.html
Power Anandhttp://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htmRocketboy - Excellent service (Meaning Power Anand directly).  http://oldstylelisters.com is a non-exclusive US distributor
Prakash/Fukinghttp://www.prakash-india.com
Satyajeethttp://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm
Sterling Agrahttp://www.sterlingagra.com
Vibhahttp://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Vidhatahttp://www.vidhataindia.com
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Gregmm on February 11, 2006, 09:37:01 PM
What would all think if we could get an OFF SITE page for the Indian venders for parts and such capitalism at it’s best let them compete on parts would help all us buyers. :D
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Mr Lister on February 14, 2006, 12:03:35 PM
Procrustes,

You have done good work over the last few weeks unravelling this lot.  Well done.

But of the 16 or 18 Indian companies who claim that they are making engines - how many really are. Some of them are just exporters who will swear blind that they manufacture.

I would hazard a guess that you could boil your list down to output from perhaps only 5 foundries.

I guess however, the customer in the West will never be fully understand the true relationships between these suppliers.


Ken
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Procrustes on February 14, 2006, 05:47:01 PM
Quote from: Mr Lister on February 14, 2006, 12:03:35 PM
... of the 16 or 18 Indian companies who claim that they are making engines - how many really are. Some of them are just exporters who will swear blind that they manufacture.

I would hazard a guess that you could boil your list down to output from perhaps only 5 foundries.

I guess however, the customer in the West will never be fully understand the true relationships between these suppliers.

I've made just a little bit of headway in this direction.  For instance one site has two lines, one of which I'm sure is a rebrand of the Satyajeet GM-90.  There are a number of small clues, eg Ashwamegh has exactly one direct injection engine, the 14/1, so I can look for that in spec sheets.  However I believe you're right in that the relations between sellers are extensive and fluid.

Classifying the engines by injection type, lubrication, bearings, etc might be useful, but that is not clear cut either.  Anand sells two lines for instance.

A third approach is to poll owners for frequency of repair.  Our small sample is a problem.  Worse though is spotty quality among brands.  Utterpower.com has a page gushing about Ashwamegh, and there are many happy Ashwamegh owners, but then Shipchief got the dreaded sandy hopper and several other folks had broken gear teeth.

Anyone should feel free to extend or copy the Roundup as they see fit.  It was essentially my own research, and I published it here to earn my keep.  I bought an Ashwamegh 6/1 from what has been an otherwise excellent lot of eight, so I probably won't have much time for this list anymore.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: JohnF13 on February 14, 2006, 10:12:13 PM
While I don't presume to speak for George at Utterpower, I don't think he now has the same opinion of Aswamegh as he had when he wrote that piece.  That was written before he discovered the problems with their gear train.  The rest of the engine is strong, but they really did cheap out on the gears, resulting in a probable failure rate in excess of 25%.  That appears to have been solved with the retrofitting of the bronze idler but quite frankly it should not have happened in the first place. 
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Horsepoor on February 15, 2006, 02:00:29 AM
Thinking, just thinking, about the bronze idler gear, took a quick look on Utterpower's web sie  but didnt see it listed among the current list of 4 sale items. Is it something offered through the Allmand drive link? Can anyonr advise or attach a link .
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: 650rpm on February 15, 2006, 02:57:47 AM
Quote from: Joe on February 11, 2006, 01:34:40 PM
mikeptag,
Welcome aboard. Alot of information available here. What are you using your engine for? Did you deal direct with India or is there an importer in the the  US.

Thank You. Glad to stray into here. I will be posting photos as I work on the engine. As it is now photos are in Coppermine, link in my profile.
I will be hooking it to an ST Head. Perhaps I will directdrive it to a WOODMASTER, 4-in-1 Planer/Molder/Sander/RipSaw...I got the engine and Generator from George B. It seems to be well made as I look it over, but I am putting all new fuel lines, fuel filter, tank. I have a radiator and fan  for cooling for now, later I'll figure a way to utilize the heat.

Mike
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Procrustes on February 15, 2006, 06:09:54 AM
Quote from: JohnF13 on February 14, 2006, 10:12:13 PM
While I don't presume to speak for George at Utterpower, I don't think he now has the same opinion of Aswamegh as he had when he wrote that piece.  That was written before he discovered the problems with their gear train.  The rest of the engine is strong, but they really did cheap out on the gears, resulting in a probable failure rate in excess of 25%.  That appears to have been solved with the retrofitting of the bronze idler but quite frankly it should not have happened in the first place. 

No doubt his views changed.  After all he's selling the Powerline/JKSon line now.  I didn't mean that he endorses Ashwamegh.

Incidentally I've heard, but have not confirmed, that Ashwamegh has corrected the gear stamp problem.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Joe on February 15, 2006, 01:27:02 PM
Think of the Utterpower web site as a collection of engineering notes or for that matter a diary.  It stretches over a period of a number of years…in that
time products/ opinions/ techniques and ideas change.  Lessons learned and improvements are all there but not necessarily in the nice orderly fashion one would like.   There is a tremendous amount of detail on the site but you have to read it all and figure out the time line on it.  For a retired guy it appears George is extremely busy.  That he freely gives of his knowledge and posts the benefit of his experience is plenty enough to ask of him. Expecting all that info to be carefully indexed is a bit much…..

On the stamped timing mark on the gears…there is further detail on that… suggesting that gear material and the stamp marks were contributing factors.
As to the bronze replacement gear…I know its there…but could not find it…keep looking….


George sells a particular product because it meets his current opinion of it ...he does not have a glowing opinion of it because he sells it.  He’ll drop any product that does not meet expectation and move on to a better one…. all in the interest of continuous improvement…..

Joe


Joe

Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: solarguy on February 16, 2006, 04:47:46 PM
Greetings,

Just discovered this site and am ecstatically happy. This site is a tremendous resource.

Two years ago I purchased a FuKing 6-1 from George, along with a 5kw st gen head.  Overall, I am as happy as the proverbial pig in a mudhole.  It was not exactly plug and play though...

I had some light vertical scoring of the cylinder walls, and sand stuck all over the place.  I did a complete tear down (except for removing the flywheels/crank) and spent many tedious hours removing sand.  A vibrating engraver makes an excellent tool for that by the way.

Once re-assembled, the rings wouldn't seat properly and/or the cylinder walls were too scored.  Oil consuption was pretty bad.  Another tear down, honed the cylinder walls, George got me a new set of Indian rings at cost, and everything turned out peachy.  Oil consumption is down to zero between 250 hour oil changes.  Presently have about 1,500 hours on the machine.

I have a cogen setup that is pretty successful, which I will likely describe in detail as time allows, and under the proper heading.  Oh yes, it's in the basement and my wife is a saint! ;D

Finest finest regards,

troy
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: JohnF13 on February 16, 2006, 06:41:12 PM
As Joe alluded to, the concensus now is that the stamping on the idlers is a bit of a red herring.....It seems that the major problem with the gears (and I had both the idler and the cam gear fail in my Aswamegh 25) is poor casting AND using less than enough material.  From what I have seen the stamping may cause the gear to fail sooner rather than later, but with such a poor castings they are doomed to failure regardless. 
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Procrustes on February 16, 2006, 07:19:10 PM
Quote from: JohnF13 on February 16, 2006, 06:41:12 PM
As Joe alluded to, the concensus now is that the stamping on the idlers is a bit of a red herring.....It seems that the major problem with the gears (and I had both the idler and the cam gear fail in my Aswamegh 25) is poor casting AND using less than enough material.  From what I have seen the stamping may cause the gear to fail sooner rather than later, but with such a poor castings they are doomed to failure regardless. 

I did not know that.  If I can ascertain the quality of my new Ashwamegh 6/1 gears I'll let you all know.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: JohnF13 on February 16, 2006, 10:37:32 PM
It is possible that the newer Ashwamegh gears are better - they have certainly received enough complaints about the old ones!
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: kpgv on February 19, 2006, 06:06:59 AM
Bruce, for gears, go here:

http://www.utterpower.com/listeroid_timing_gears.htm

FYI/convience-No personal financial bla-bla.

Kevin
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on February 28, 2006, 10:43:23 PM
FYE, here is another importer:  Mascot Enterprises
http://products.jimtrade.com/product_details.asp?ProductId=26396&SupplierId=92729
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: trigzy on February 28, 2006, 11:31:32 PM
I love these places that can only come up with an illustration of thier products.

International trade warning sign #1.

Steve
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Procrustes on March 01, 2006, 05:08:28 AM
Quote from: JohnF13 on February 16, 2006, 06:41:12 PM
As Joe alluded to, the concensus now is that the stamping on the idlers is a bit of a red herring.....It seems that the major problem with the gears (and I had both the idler and the cam gear fail in my Aswamegh 25) is poor casting AND using less than enough material.  From what I have seen the stamping may cause the gear to fail sooner rather than later, but with such a poor castings they are doomed to failure regardless. 

I looked at the Ashwamegh 6/1 idler gear.  There's no stamp on it.  The timing mark is painted on.  I don't know what to look for otherwise in terms of quality.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on March 17, 2006, 06:40:56 PM
List,
I have gone to the various manufacturer's websites listed in Procrustes list and tried to compile similar specifications for the various labels.  The websites vary tremendously from a fuzzy "photo" of an old lister illustration to excessively complete lists about variously useless specifications.  (How much does anyone care about the volume of the shipping box in cc's?) 

Some provide a lot of useful information, one provided a table of numbers with no labels as to what the numbers meant!  None of them talk about sand in the sump.  Some mention balance.  It seems that the bore and stroke imply the degree of standardization between engines, which I thought might be useful.  A few use the same piston and con rod in all their engines, others only vary the piston.  A few change both.  The dimensions of the foundation bolts, which may not be particularly useful in itself, would tend to indicate whether a different casting is used for the base.

Some manufacturer's (assemblers?, labelers?) have many variations on the same horsepower engine, (the record is Kissan Iron with five types of 10/1) while others seem to have one design, with only a variation in the engine speed (and I assume the flywheel size and weight).  I'm still not sure how useful this is, but I found it interesting.

I hope the format won't get too messed up importing into this box, it was straight in the original.  If only one number is used, all the engines were the same for that parameter.
Ray

Ammerajkot          http://www.ameerrajkot.com
H.P.             5 6       8    10 12      14 14
Cylinder          1 1       1   1      1
Bore in MM          114.3   139.7   120 127      139.7 130
Stroke in MM         139.7      139.7   139.7      152.4 147
Speed RPM         600 650    850   1000       650 1000
Compression Ratio          1:18      
Lub. Oil Consumption Capacity (Lit.)    4.5         4.5      5.0
Foundation Bolt Spacing in MM    330 x 330       330 x 330   
Fuel Tank Capacity (Lit.)       14.0   


Ampro Exports      http://www.amproexports.com/lister-diesel-engines.html
Particulars    6/1    8/1    10/1    12/1    14/1    16/1    12/2    16/2    20/2
Horse Power    6    8    10    12    14    16    12    16    20
RPM       650    850    1000    1000    850    850    650    850    1000
Bore       114.3   114.3   120   127   152.4   152.4   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke       139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   177.8   177.8   139.7   139.7   139.7
Bolt spacing   330 x 330            356 x 356      381 x 559
Fuel Cap.(Lit.)   8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Lub. Oil Cap.   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5   7.5   13   

Aswamegh      http://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
H.P.      6   8   10   12   12   14*   15*   16   20   20
RPM      650   850   1050   1000   650   1000   1000   850   1050   1000
Cylinder      1   1   1   1   2   1   1   2   2   2
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   130   130   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   146.05   139.7   139.7   145   160   139.7   139.7
Compression ratio:  18:1, except 14/1 and 15/1 which are 16.5:1.  They are Direct Injection engines.
All 2 cylinders have bush main bearings and oil pump, can be ordered with taper roller bearing.  6/1 and 8/1 are splash only, but can be ordered with oil pump.

Atul Group   http://www.atulgroup.com
HP   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   560   850   1000   1000
Bore   114   120   120   127
Stroke   139.6   139.6   139.6   139.6

Field Marshall http://www.fieldmarshal.com
Single and double cylinder 5 to 20 hp, 600 to 1000 rpm

GG Auto Gears   http://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm   
No information on website about engines.

GTC Engines   http://www.geco-trade.com/default.asp
H.P./Cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2
RPM   650   850   1000   650   850
Bore   114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Fuel tank   11   11   11   15   15
Compression  18:1

Hrishi Exports   http://www.hrishiexports.com/slow.html
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   14/1   12/2   16/2   20/2         
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Found. Bolt Space    330x330            381x559   
Fuel tank      8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Oil Capacity   5   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5

JKSON      http://www.indiamart.com/jkgroup/   6, 8, 10, 12, 16, 20 HP engines, no other details
Also rebranded as Power Solution (PS) by George of Utterpower and Joel.


Kissan Iron     http://www.kissangroup.com/kissan_iron_works/product/lister_type.htm
Model   KIW-   10   1   2   7A   8   4   7   7FE   7DI    7DIH   
HP/cyl.      5/1   6/1   8/1   8/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   10/1
RPM      600   650   850   950   900   1000   1000   1000   1000   1000   
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   120   120   120   120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   132   139.7   139.7
Found bolt space   330X330                     305X200   330X330   330X330
Fuel tank cap.   9   

Model   KIW-   12   12FE   14D.I.   
HP/cyl.      12/1   12/1   14/1
RPM      1000   1000   1000
Bore      127   1127   127
Stroke      139.7   132   139.7
Found bolt space   330x330   305x200   330x330   
Fuel tank cap.   12   12   12
It appears that the DI models are direct injection and likely have aluminum pistons.  Heavy flywheels are available for some models, as are water pumps.  Smaller engines are splash lubricated, larger likely have pumps but it is unclear.   

Lovson   http://www.lovson.com/lister-type-slow-speed-diesel-engines.html
Model      SL-6   SL-8   SL-10    SLC10   SLC10   SLC12
            /SLC   Tiger   Sumo   Sumo
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   900   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   127   127
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   16:1   16:1   17:1   17:1   17:1   17:1
Oil cap.      5 lit.
Found. Bolt space   330x330
Generally TRB main bearings, but bushing with oil pump is available.

Metro/Metrex   http://www.metroexporters.com/pages/index.html
Model      ME-6   ME-8   ME-10   ME-12   ME-16   ME-20
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1050
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1

Mascot Enterprises   http://products.jimtrade.com/product_details.asp?ProductId=26396&SupplierId=92729
No information other than a generic “Lister” picture.

Power Anand   http://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htm
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1LOP   10/1CBW   12/1   12/2   16/2   20/1   24/2
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000   650   850   1000   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   130   114.3   114.3   120   130
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
Fuel tank      8               13
Oil cap.      5               10
Found. Bolt space    330x330               560x382
The two 10/1’s have identical spec. but different model #’s.

Prakash/Fuking   http://www.prakash-india.com
I could only find Petter-type engines on their website.

Satyajeet   http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm      GM-90 direct injection engines w/aluminum pistons
Model      GM90/6   GM90/8   GM90/10   GM90/10   GM90/12   GM90/10   GM90/14
               Super      Sendo
RPM      750   900   1000   950   1050   800   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127   130   130
Stroke      130   130   130   130   130   146.5   146.5
Compression   17.5:1
Oil cap.      4.25
Found. Bolt space.   260x260      Lub. Splash plus oil pumps.  Balance weights on crankshaft.
Sterling Agra   http://www.sterlingagra.com

The spec. and descriptions appear identical to Kissan Iron, found above.

Vibha   http://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7


Vidhata   http://www.vidhataindia.com
Model   VL5   VL6   VL7   VL8   VL9
HP/cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   650   850   950   1000   850
Bore   114.3   120   120   120   127
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7



Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on March 17, 2006, 06:54:58 PM
Another observation:  the compression ratios varied from 16:1, 16.5:1, 17:1, 17.5:1, to 18:1, the most common.  No site mentioned the compression change valve, although I know it is offered by some manufacturers'.  One site showed an engine with the water pump, but did not offer it as an option, though I know it can be obtained.  Likely the same is true of other options.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on March 17, 2006, 11:29:55 PM
Sorry for the double posting, here is a cleaned up version, with some added comments.

“Standard”:  114.3 piston, 139.7 con rod.  Con rods go from 130 to 177.8.  Other common pistons are 120, 127 and 130.  Materials are mostly iron, few aluminum.  330x330 mm foundation bolt for 1 cyl., 381x559 for 2 cyl., some variation.

Ammerajkot          http://www.ameerrajkot.com
H.P.             5   6       8    10   12      14   14
Cylinder          1
Bore in MM          114.3      114.3   120 127      139.7 130
Stroke in MM          139.7      139.7   139.7      152.4 147
Speed RPM          600 650    850   1000       650 1000
Compression Ratio       1:18      
Lub. Oil Consumption Capacity (Lit.)    4.5      4.5      5.0
Foundation Bolt Spacing in MM    330 x 330       
Fuel Tank Capacity (Lit.)    14.0      
The 14/1’s are two versions, one with larger piston & longer stroke but lower speed, the other with smaller piston, shorter stroke but higher speed.  These are the only engines that use a piston size of 139.7, unless it’s a typo.

Ampro Exports      http://www.amproexports.com/lister-diesel-engines.html
Particulars    6/1    8/1    10/1    12/1    14/1    16/1    12/2    16/2    20/2
Horse Power    6    8    10    12    14      16       12       16        20
RPM       650    850    1000    1000    850    850    650    850    1000
Bore       114.3   114.3   120   127   152.4   152.4   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke           139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7 177.8   177.8   139.7   139.7   139.7
Bolt spacing   330 x 330              356 x 356        381 x 559
Fuel Cap.(Lit.)   8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Lub. Oil Cap.   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5   7.5   13
These all use the same con rod, except the 14/1 and 16/1.  Piston size and rpm varies.   

Aswamegh      http://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
H.P.      6   8   10   12   12   14   15   16   20   20
RPM          650   850   1050     1000    650   1000   1000  850    1050   1000
Cylinder   1   1   1   1   2     1      1       2       2        2
Bore      114.3 114.3 114.3 114.3   114.3 130    130   114.3   114.3  120
Stroke      139.7 139.7 139.7 146.05 139.7 139.7 145 160    139.7   139.7
Compression ratio:  18:1, except 14/1 and 15/1 which are 16.5:1.  They are Direct Injection engines.
All 2 cylinders have bush main bearings and oil pump, can be ordered with taper roller bearing.  6/1 and 8/1 are splash only, but can be ordered with oil pump.  All use the same piston except 14/1, 16/1 and 20/2.  Con rod varies.

Atul Group   http://www.atulgroup.com
HP   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   650   850   1000   1000
Bore   114   120   120   127
Stroke   139.6   139.6   139.6   139.6
All use the same con rod, but it is 0.1mm shorter than the standard.  Is it really different or not?

Field Marshall http://www.fieldmarshal.com
Single and double cylinder 5 to 20 hp, 600 to 1000 rpm, no other info.

GG Auto Gears   http://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm   
No information on website about engines.

GTC Engines   http://www.geco-trade.com/default.asp
H.P./Cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2
RPM   650   850   1000   650   850
Bore   114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Fuel tank   11   11   11   15   15
Compression  18:1
Same piston and con rod except piston for the 10/1.

Hrishi Exports   http://www.hrishiexports.com/slow.html
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   14/1   12/2   16/2   20/2         
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Found. Bolt Space    330x330         381x559   
Fuel tank      8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Oil Capacity   5   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5
All use the same con rod, only piston size varies.

JKSON      http://www.indiamart.com/jkgroup/   6, 8, 10, 12, 16, 20 HP engines, no other details
Also rebranded as Power Solution (PS) by George of Utterpower and Joel.


Kissan Iron     http://www.kissangroup.com/kissan_iron_works/product/lister_type.htm
Model   KIW-   10   1   2   7A   8   4   7   7FE   7DI    7DIH   
HP/cyl.      5/1   6/1   8/1   8/1   8/1   10/1 10/1   10/1   10/1      10/1
RPM      600   650   850   950   900  1000 1000   1000   1000   1000   
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   120   120   120    120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7  139.7  139.7 139.7 139.7139.7 132   139.7   139.7
Found bolt space  All 330X330 except                 305X200   
Fuel tank cap.   9   

Model   KIW-   12   12FE   14D.I.   
HP/cyl.      12/1   12/1   14/1
RPM      1000   1000   1000
Bore      127   127   127
Stroke      139.7   132   139.7
Found bolt space     305x200    
Fuel tank cap.   12   12   12
It appears that the DI models are direct injection and likely have aluminum pistons.  Heavy flywheels are available for some models, as are water pumps.  Smaller engines are splash lubricated, larger likely have pumps but it is unclear.   All use the same con rod, except one 12/1.    All the same size base casting size except one 10/1 and one 12/1.

Lovson   http://www.lovson.com/lister-type-slow-speed-diesel-engines.html
Model      SL-6   SL-8   SL-10    SLC10   SLC10   SLC12
                   /SLC     Tiger   Sumo   Sumo
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   900   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   127   127
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   16:1   16:1   17:1   17:1   17:1   17:1
Oil cap.      5 lit.
Found. Bolt space   330x330
Generally TRB main bearings, but bushing with oil pump is available.

Metro/Metrex   http://www.metroexporters.com/pages/index.html
Model      ME-6   ME-8   ME-10   ME-12   ME-16   ME-20
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1050
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
All use the same piston and con rod, only rpm varies.

Mascot Enterprises   http://products.jimtrade.com/product_details.asp?ProductId=26396&SupplierId=92729
No information other than a generic “Lister” picture.

Power Anand   http://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htm
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1LOP   10/1CBW   12/1   12/2   16/2   20/1   24/2
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000       650       850       1000    1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   130      114.3   114.3    120       130
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
Fuel tank      8                        13
Oil cap.      5                          10
Found. Bolt space    330x330               560x382
The two 10/1’s have identical spec. but different model #’s.  All use the same con rod.

Prakash/Fuking   http://www.prakash-india.com
I could only find Petter-type engines on their website.

Satyajeet   http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm      GM-90 direct injection engines w/aluminum pistons
Model      GM90/6   GM90/8   GM90/10   GM90/10   GM90/12   GM90/10   GM90/14
                                     Super           Sendo
RPM      750        900   1000       950          1050     800       1000
Bore      114.3      114.3   120      127           127      130         130
Stroke      130       130            130       130            130      146.5     146.5
Compression   17.5:1
Oil cap.   4.25
Found. Bolt space.   260x260      
Lub. Splash plus oil pumps.  Balance weights on crankshaft.  Most use a similar (but shorter) con rod than “standard” The two different con rods are unique too.  These engines have the smallest foundation bolt spacing of any listed.  Smallest oil cap.

Sterling Agra   http://www.sterlingagra.com
The spec. and descriptions appear identical to Kissan Iron, found above.

Vibha   http://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7


Vidhata   http://www.vidhataindia.com
Model   VL5   VL6   VL7   VL8   VL9
HP/cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   650   850   950   1000   850
Bore   114.3   120   120   120   127
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7



Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on March 17, 2006, 11:43:11 PM
I spent some time in the reply box, trying to align everything, only to have it completely messed up in the post.  If anyone wants a clean version, I have it in Word, and could email it.
Ray
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: taeuber on March 19, 2006, 12:59:04 AM
Hallo everybody.

I just add some info:

Field Marshall http://www.fieldmarshal.com
ENGINE TYPEFMS6FMS8FMS10PMVFM-11FM-111FM-IVFM-IV SUPRAFMS12FM12FM-11 DIFM-IV DIFM 10DIFM 14DIFM 16DIFM16DFM20D
POWER H.P. / kW6/4.48/5.910/7.356/4.48/5.99.5/710/7.3510/7.3512/8.812/8.88/5.910/7.3510/7.3514/10.316/11.7716/11.7720/14.7
NO. OF CYLINDER11111111111111122
BORE mm114.3114.3120114.3114.3120120120127127114.3114.3120127130114.3120
STROKE mm130130130139.7139.7139.7139.7139.7130139.7139.7139.7139.7139.7139.7139.7139.7
SPEED R.P.M.6608501000660850950100010001000100085010001000100010008501000
SPECIFIC FUEL CONSUMPTIONg/kWh - g/bhp/h255 - 188255 - 188255 - 188265 - 195265 - 195265 - 195265 - 195265 - 195265 - 195265 - 195240 - 177240 - 177240 - 177240 - 177240 - 177265 - 195265 - 195
COMPRESSION RATIO16:116:116:117:117:117:117:117:116:117:115.5:116:117:116:115.5:117:117:1
DISPLACEMENT c.m.313341334147014321432158015801580164617681432143215801768185328653160
LUBRICATIONSAE-30/40SAE-30/40SAE-30/40SAE-30/40SAE-30/40SAE-30/40SAE-30/40SAE-30/40SAE-30/40SAE-30/40SAE-30/40SAE-30/40SAE-30/40SAE-30/40SAE-30/40SAE-30/40SAE-30/40
BARE WEIGHT OF ENGINE (Approx.) Kgs.280280290320335320355380330385335350350385395440440
GROSS WEIGHT OF ENGINE (Approx.) Kgs.395395405455470455490515445520470485485520530635635
PACKED CASE SIZE : L x W x H mm940x700x1040940x700x1040940x700x10401070x700x11451070x700x11451070x700x11451070x700x11451070x700x1145940x700x10401070x700x11451070x700x11451070x700x11451070x700x11451070x700x11451070x700x11451375x725x11151375x725x1115
PACKING CASE VOLUME m30.690.690.690.860.860.860.860.860.690.860.860.860.860.860.861.111.11


Prakash/Fuking   http://www.prakash-india.com

ENGINE
Rating   8 to 12 hp
Cooling   Water Cooled
No. of cyl.   one
Fuel    Diesel
Type   Vertical ,4-stroke, compression ignition
Injection    In-direct/Direct
RPM    650 to 1000
Sp. Fuel Con.   197 grams/hp-hr
Fuel tank    10 liters
Rotation    Clockwise looking at the flywheel
Starting    Handle start with cranking

ModelRated PowerR.P.M.BORE (mm)STROKE (mm)Dry Weight
HPKW
PL-164.4650120139.7315
PL-285.9850120139.7315
PL-4107.41000120139.7325
PL-5128.81000127139.7425



What makes you so sure that the JKSON Listeroids are the ones that are sold as Power Solution (PS) by George of Utterpower and Joel?


Regards
Lars
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: kpgv on March 19, 2006, 02:05:35 AM
Hi Taeuber,
Because the thing came to me all crated up, not opened up by customs, or anyone else, and the little box inside with the extra rings, bearings, seals, manual, etc. all say "JKSON". ;D

Kevin

Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: taeuber on March 19, 2006, 11:18:21 AM
Hi Kevin,

yes indeed this should be seen as a proof.

Here is another web page from JKSON with the infos about there engines:
http://www.jksonengines.com/

Regards
Lars
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on March 19, 2006, 05:28:31 PM
Hi Lars,
Because of a delivery problem, Joel called me and during the conversation stated that the engines were indeed JKSON.
Ray
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: binnie on March 20, 2006, 04:45:43 AM
I bought a 12/2 Power Solutions brand with the "Power Solutions" name moulded into the Sump door and name plate attached...but the machine is a JKSON by make from the manufacturer. In other words what I understand is that JKSON mfgs them for Geo according to his stipulations and puts his brand name on them. It does have the Brass Idler gear stipulated by Geo., and the sump was clean when I inspected it. They look good & the moulding seem superior. Now lets see how they run.
It will be some time till I get this thing up & running...need to pour the base and we are still knee-deep in snow up here. Will let you know.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: taeuber on March 23, 2006, 10:16:43 AM
Hi everybody,

here some more websites for completeness:

http://www.crosswordagro.com
http://www.htcorporation.com/
http://kirloskarapps.kirloskar.com/

Bye
Lars
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on March 24, 2006, 01:17:13 AM
Added manufacturers thanks to Lars. 
“Standard”:  114.3 piston, 139.7 con rod.  Con rods go from 130 to 177.8.  Other common pistons are 120, 127 and 130.  Materials are mostly iron, few aluminum.  330x330 mm foundation bolt for 1 cyl., 381x559 for 2 cyl., some variation.

Ammerajkot          http://www.ameerrajkot.com
H.P.             5   6       8    10   12      14   14
Cylinder             1
Bore in MM          114.3      114.3   120 127      152.4 130
Stroke in MM          139.7      139.7   139.7      177.8 147
Speed RPM          600 650       850   1000       650 1000
Compression Ratio          1:18      
Lub. Oil Consumption Capacity (Lit.)    4.5         4.5      5.0
Foundation Bolt Spacing in MM    330 x 330       
Fuel Tank Capacity (Lit.)       14.0      14.0   14.0      14.0
The 14/1’s are two versions, one with larger piston & longer stroke but lower speed, the other with smaller piston, shorter stroke but higher speed.  These engines and Ampro use the unusual 152.4x177.8 piston & con rod in their 14/1 and 16/1.
They also offer what appears to be direct injection engines (“New Variety”), similar to (or the same?) as Satyajeet GM-90.

Ampro Exports      http://www.amproexports.com/lister-diesel-engines.html
Particulars    6/1    8/1    10/1    12/1    14/1    16/1    12/2    16/2    20/2
Horse Power    6    8    10    12    14    16    12    16    20
RPM       650    850    1000    1000    850    850    650    850    1000
Bore       114.3   114.3   120   127   152.4   152.4   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke       139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   177.8   177.8   139.7   139.7   139.7
Bolt spacing   330 x 330            356 x 356      381 x 559
Fuel Cap.(Lit.)   8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Lub. Oil Cap.   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5   7.5   13
These all use the same con rod, except the 14/1 and 16/1.  Piston size and rpm varies.   

Aswamegh      http://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
H.P.      6   8   10   12   12   14   15   16   20   20
RPM      650   850   1050   1000   650   1000   1000   850   1050   1000
Cylinder      1   1   1   1   2   1   1   2   2   2
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   130   130   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   146.05   139.7   139.7   145   160   139.7   139.7
Compression ratio:  18:1, except 14/1 and 15/1 which are 16.5:1.  They are Direct Injection engines.
All 2 cylinders have bush main bearings and oil pump, can be ordered with taper roller bearing.  6/1 and 8/1 are splash only, but can be ordered with oil pump.  All use the same piston except 14/1, 16/1 and 20/2.  Con rod varies.

Atul Group   http://www.atulgroup.com
HP   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   650   850   1000   1000
Bore   114   120   120   127
Stroke   139.6   139.6   139.6   139.6
All use the same con rod, but it is 0.1mm shorter than the standard.  Is it really different or not?

Field Marshall http://www.fieldmarshal.com
Single and double cylinder 5 to 20 hp, 600 to 1000 rpm, no other info.

GG Auto Gears   http://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm   
No information on website about engines.

GTC Engines   http://www.geco-trade.com/default.asp
H.P./Cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2
RPM   650   850   1000   650   850
Bore   114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Fuel tank   11   11   11   15   15
Compression  18:1
Same piston and con rod except piston for the 10/1.

Hindustan Trading Corporation    Liberty Diesel Engines   http://www.htcorporation.com/      
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1LOP   10/1 CBW   12/1   14/1      
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000      850   900
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   120      127   127
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7      139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1                     Direct Injected
Bolt spacing   330x330
6/1, 8/1, 10/1 are splash lubricated, others have oil pumps.  Bushing or TRB bearings available. 14/1 is Direct Injected.  Two cylinder engines are said to be available, but the webpage is not present.

Hindustan Trading Co. “Mini-Listers”
HP/Cyl      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   14/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127
Stroke      133.3   133.3   133.3   133.3   133.3
Bolt space   305x204
Mini-Listers have different characteristics:  All have TRB’s.  6/ and 8/1 are splash lubricated, others have oil pump.  All have shorter stroke than “standard” listeroid.  10/1 may have Direct Injection, 14/1 is only available with Direct Injection.
All have a different foundation bolt pattern than the “standard” Listeroid.  They are also lighter than the “standard”.     

Hrishi Exports   http://www.hrishiexports.com/slow.html
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   14/1   12/2   16/2   20/2         
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Found. Bolt Space    330x330            381x559   
Fuel tank      8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Oil Capacity   5   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5
All use the same con rod, only piston size varies.

JK Group of Industries  JKSON engines      http://www.jksonengines.com/ltde.htm   
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
Bush and TRB bearings available.  Oil pumps available.  Also rebranded as Power Solution (PS) by George of Utterpower and Joel.  PETTER / KIRLOSKAR engines also available.

Kirloskar      http://kirloskarapps.kirloskar.com/kirloskar/web/13$5010.html
Model      KS6   KS8   KS12   KS16
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   12/2   16/2
RPM      650   850   650   850
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Fuel tank      11 lit.   11 lit.   15 lit   15 lit.
Compression   18:1
All engines are Direct Injection.  Petter-type engines are also available.  Guaranteed for 12 months against defects. 
   

Kissan Iron     http://www.kissangroup.com/kissan_iron_works/product/lister_type.htm
Model   KIW-   10   1   2   7A   8   4   7   7FE   7DI    7DIH   
HP/cyl.      5/1   6/1   8/1   8/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   10/1
RPM      600   650   850   950   900   1000   1000   1000   1000   1000   
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   120   120   120   120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   132   139.7   139.7
Found bolt space   330X330                     305X200   330X330   330X330
Fuel tank cap.   9   

Model   KIW-   12   12FE   14D.I.   
HP/cyl.      12/1   12/1   14/1
RPM      1000   1000   1000
Bore      127   127   127
Stroke      139.7   132   139.7
Found bolt space   330x330   305x200   330x330   
Fuel tank cap.   12   12   12
It appears that the DI models are direct injection and likely have aluminum pistons.  Heavy flywheels are available for some models, as are water pumps.  Smaller engines are splash lubricated, larger likely have pumps but it is unclear.   All use the same con rod, except one 12/1.    All the same size base casting size except one 10/1 and one 12/1.

Lovson   http://www.lovson.com/lister-type-slow-speed-diesel-engines.html
Model      SL-6   SL-8   SL-10    SLC10   SLC10   SLC12
            /SLC   Tiger   Sumo   Sumo
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   900   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   127   127
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   16:1   16:1   17:1   17:1   17:1   17:1
Oil cap.      5 lit.
Found. Bolt space   330x330
Generally TRB main bearings, but bushing with oil pump is available.

Metro/Metrex   http://www.metroexporters.com/pages/index.html
Model      ME-6   ME-8   ME-10   ME-12   ME-16   ME-20
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1050
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
All use the same piston and con rod, only rpm varies.

Mascot Enterprises   http://products.jimtrade.com/product_details.asp?ProductId=26396&SupplierId=92729
No information other than a generic “Lister” picture.

Nissan   Crossword Agro Industries   http://www.crosswordagro.com
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   16/1   12/2   16/2
The 12/1 is call a “Mini-Lister”, looks different from the “standard” lister types.  No spec. available.

Power Anand   http://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htm
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1LOP   10/1CBW   12/1   12/2   16/2   20/1   24/2
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000   650   850   1000   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   130   114.3   114.3   120   130
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
Fuel tank      8               13
Oil cap.      5               10
Found. Bolt space    330x330               560x382
The two 10/1’s have identical spec. but different model #’s.  All use the same con rod.

Prakash/Fuking   http://www.prakash-india.com
I could only find Petter-type engines on their website.

Satyajeet   http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm      GM-90 direct injection engines w/aluminum pistons
Model      GM90/6   GM90/8   GM90/10   GM90/10   GM90/12   GM90/10   GM90/14
               Super      Sendo
RPM      750   900   1000   950   1050   800   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127   130   130
Stroke      130   130   130   130   130   146.5   146.5
Compression   17.5:1
Oil cap.      4.25
Found. Bolt space.   260x260      
Lub. Splash plus oil pumps.  Balance weights on crankshaft.  Most use a similar (but shorter) con rod than “standard” The two different con rods are unique too.  These engines have the smallest foundation bolt spacing of any listed.

Sterling Agra   http://www.sterlingagra.com
The spec. and descriptions appear identical to Kissan Iron, found above.

Vibha   http://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7


Vidhata   http://www.vidhataindia.com
Model   VL5   VL6   VL7   VL8   VL9
HP/cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   650   850   950   1000   850
Bore   114.3   120   120   120   127
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7



Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Joe on March 24, 2006, 12:25:15 PM
rpg52,
A lot of work has gone into compiling/maintaining this info - Thanks....

Joe
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: SHIPCHIEF on March 24, 2006, 11:56:18 PM
I'm not seeing the 20/1 on the Poweranand site. I thought that was a Satyajeet, but it didn't see it the either?
Say Dirtbikepilot, Where did yours come from?
Scott E
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on March 25, 2006, 12:07:41 AM
Shipchief,
I think it was a typo, I only see a 20/2 on Poweranand too.  Corrected for next iteration.
Ray
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on March 25, 2006, 12:40:39 AM
Everyone,
I have gone to the various manufacturer’s websites and assembled the following from their information.  Some provide a lot of useful information, one provided a table of numbers with no labels as to what the numbers meant!  None of them talk about sand in the sump.  Some mention balance.  It seems that the bore and stroke imply the degree of standardization between engines, which I thought might be useful.  A few use the same piston and con rod in all their engines, others only vary the piston.  A few change both.  The dimensions of the foundation bolts, which may not be particularly useful in itself, would tend to indicate whether a different casting is used for the base.
 “Standard”:  114.3 piston, 139.7 con rod.  Con rods go from 130 to 177.8.  Other common pistons are 120, 127 and 130.  Materials are mostly iron, few aluminum.  330x330 mm foundation bolt for 1 cyl., 381x559 for 2 cyl., some variation.  5/1, 6/1 and 8/1 are often the same engine, only with an increase in rpm from 600, 650 to 850 (and likely with smaller diameter, heavier flywheels).
Other observations:  14/1 and 16/1 are most often made from odd sized or “non-standard” pistons or con rods.  Oil capacities are not given for many of the engines, but the Kirloskar capacities are about half that of other manufacturer’s.  The Hindustan Trading Co. “Mini-Listers” appear to be a considerably different design than that offered by others.  The piston sizes are “standard” but the con rod and foundation bolt patterns are different than any other engines.
Hope this is helpful, it was to me.  :)

Ammerajkot          http://www.ameerrajkot.com
H.P./Cyl.             5/1   6/1       8/1    10/1   12/1   14/1   14/1
Bore in MM          114.3      114.3   120 127      152.4 130
Stroke in MM          139.7      139.7   139.7      177.8 147
Speed RPM          600 650       850   1000       650 1000
Compression Ratio          1:18      
Lub. Oil Consumption Capacity (Lit.)    4.5         4.5      5.0
Foundation Bolt Spacing in MM    330 x 330       
Fuel Tank Capacity (Lit.)       14.0      14.0   14.0      14.0
The 14/1’s are two versions, one with larger piston & longer stroke but lower speed, the other with smaller piston, shorter stroke but higher speed.  These engines and Ampro use the unusual 152.4x177.8 piston & con rod in their 14/1 and 16/1.
They also offer what appears to be direct injection engines (“New Variety”), similar to (or the same?) as Satyajeet GM-90.

Ampro Exports      http://www.amproexports.com/lister-diesel-engines.html
Particulars    6/1    8/1    10/1    12/1    14/1    16/1    12/2    16/2    20/2
Horse Power    6    8    10    12    14    16    12    16    20
RPM       650    850    1000    1000    850    850    650    850    1000
Bore       114.3   114.3   120   127   152.4   152.4   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke       139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   177.8   177.8   139.7   139.7   139.7
Bolt spacing   330 x 330            356 x 356      381 x 559
Fuel Cap.(Lit.)   8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Lub. Oil Cap.   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5   7.5   13
These all use the same con rod, except the 14/1 and 16/1.  Piston size and rpm varies.   

Aswamegh      http://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
H.P./Cyl      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   12/2   14/1   15/1   16/2   20/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1050   1000   650   1000   1000   850   1050   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   130   130   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   146.05   139.7   139.7   145   160   139.7   139.7
Compression ratio:  18:1, except 14/1 and 15/1 which are 16.5:1.  They are Direct Injection engines.
All 2 cylinders have bush main bearings and oil pump, can be ordered with taper roller bearing.  6/1 and 8/1 are splash only, but can be ordered with oil pump.  All use the same piston except 14/1, 16/1 and 20/2.  Con rod varies.

Atul Group   http://www.atulgroup.com
HP   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   650   850   1000   1000
Bore   114   120   120   127
Stroke   139.6   139.6   139.6   139.6
All use the same con rod, but it is 0.1mm shorter than the standard.  Is it really different or not?

Crossword Agro Industries   http://www.crosswordagro.com/english/ssde.htm
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   12/2   16/1   12/2   16/2
See Nissan engines below.   

Field Marshall http://www.fieldmarshal.com
Model      FMS6   FMS8   FMS10   PMV   FM11   FM111   FMIV
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   6/1   8/1   9.5/1   10/1
RPM      660   850   1000   660   850   950   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120   120
Stroke      130   130   130   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   16:1         17:1

GG Auto Gears   http://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm   
No information on website about engines.

GTC Engines   http://www.geco-trade.com/default.asp
H.P./Cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2
RPM   650   850   1000   650   850
Bore   114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Fuel tank   11   11   11   15   15
Compression  18:1
Same piston and con rod except piston for the 10/1.

Hindustan Trading Corporation    Liberty Diesel Engines   http://www.htcorporation.com/      
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1LOP   10/1 CBW   12/1   14/1      
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000      850   900
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   120      127   127
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7      139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1                     Direct Injected
Bolt spacing   330x330
6/1, 8/1, 10/1 are splash lubricated, others have oil pumps.  Bushing or TRB bearings available. 14/1 is Direct Injected.  Two cylinder engines are said to be available, but the webpage is not present.

Hindustan Trading Co. “Mini-Listers”
HP/Cyl      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   14/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127
Stroke      133.3   133.3   133.3   133.3   133.3
Bolt space   305x204
Mini-Listers have different characteristics:  All have TRB’s.  6/ and 8/1 are splash lubricated, others have oil pump.  All have shorter stroke than “standard” listeroid.  10/1 may have Direct Injection, 14/1 is only available with Direct Injection.
All have a different foundation bolt pattern than the “standard” Listeroid.  They are also lighter than the “standard”.     

Hrishi Exports   http://www.hrishiexports.com/slow.html
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   14/1   12/2   16/2   20/2         
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Found. Bolt Space    330x330            381x559   
Fuel tank      8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Oil Capacity   5   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5
All use the same con rod, only piston size varies.

JK Group of Industries  JKSON engines      http://www.jksonengines.com/ltde.htm   
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
Bush and TRB bearings available.  Oil pumps available.  Also rebranded as Power Solution (PS) by George of Utterpower and Joel.  PETTER / KIRLOSKAR engines also available.

Kirloskar      http://kirloskarapps.kirloskar.com/kirloskar/web/13$5010.html
Model      KS6   KS8   KS12   KS16
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   12/2   16/2
RPM      650   850   650   850
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Fuel tank      11 lit.   11 lit.   15 lit   15 lit.
Compression   18:1
All engines are Direct Injection.  Petter-type engines are also available.  Guaranteed for 12 months against defects.
Oil cap. 6/1 & 8/1 2.6 lit., smaller than “standard”.  Oil cap. of others 5.7 lit.
   

Kissan Iron     http://www.kissangroup.com/kissan_iron_works/product/lister_type.htm
Model   KIW-   10   1   2   7A   8   4   7   7FE   7DI    7DIH   
HP/cyl.      5/1   6/1   8/1   8/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   10/1
RPM      600   650   850   950   900   1000   1000   1000   1000   1000   
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   120   120   120   120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   132   139.7   139.7
Found bolt space   330X330                     305X200   330X330   330X330
Fuel tank cap.   9   

Model   KIW-   12   12FE   14D.I.   
HP/cyl.      12/1   12/1   14/1
RPM      1000   1000   1000
Bore      127   127   127
Stroke      139.7   132   139.7
Found bolt space   330x330   305x200   330x330   
Fuel tank cap.   12   12   12
It appears that the DI models are direct injection and likely have aluminum pistons.  Heavy flywheels are available for some models, as are water pumps.  Smaller engines are splash lubricated, larger likely have pumps but it is unclear.   All use the same con rod, except one 12/1.    All the same size base casting size except one 10/1 and one 12/1 (KE models).

Lovson   http://www.lovson.com/lister-type-slow-speed-diesel-engines.html
Model      SL-6   SL-8   SL-10    SLC10   SLC10   SLC12
            /SLC   Tiger   Sumo   Sumo
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   900   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   127   127
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   16:1   16:1   17:1   17:1   17:1   17:1
Oil cap.      5 lit.
Found. Bolt space   330x330
Generally TRB main bearings, but bushing with oil pump is available.

Metro/Metrex   http://www.metroexporters.com/pages/index.html
Model      ME-6   ME-8   ME-10   ME-12   ME-16   ME-20
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1050
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
All use the same piston and con rod, only rpm varies.

Mascot Enterprises   http://products.jimtrade.com/product_details.asp?ProductId=26396&SupplierId=92729
No information other than a generic “Lister” picture.

Nissan   Crossword Agro Industries   http://www.crosswordagro.com
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   16/1   12/2   16/2
The 12/1 is call a “Mini-Lister”, looks different from the “standard” lister types.  No spec. available.

Power Anand   http://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htm
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1LOP   10/1CBW   12/1   12/2   16/2   20/2   24/2
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000   650   850   1000   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   130   114.3   114.3   120   130
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
Fuel tank      8               13
Oil cap.      5               10
Found. Bolt space    330x330               560x382
The two 10/1’s have identical spec. but different model #’s.  All use the same con rod.

Prakash/Fuking   http://www.prakash-india.com
Model      PL1   PL2   PL4   PL5
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000
Bore      120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   138.7   139.7   139.7
Direct or Indirect Injection. 


Satyajeet   http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm      GM-90 direct injection engines w/aluminum pistons
Model      GM90/6   GM90/8   GM90/10   GM90/10   GM90/12   GM90/10   GM90/14
               Super      Sendo
RPM      750   900   1000   950   1050   800   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127   130   130
Stroke      130   130   130   130   130   146.5   146.5
Compression   17.5:1
Oil cap.      4.25
Found. Bolt space.   260x260      
Lub. Splash plus oil pumps.  Balance weights on crankshaft.  Most use a similar (but shorter) con rod than “standard” The two different con rods are unique too.  These engines have the smallest foundation bolt spacing of any listed.

Sterling Agra   http://www.sterlingagra.com
The spec. and descriptions appear identical to Kissan Iron, found above.

Vibha   http://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7


Vidhata   http://www.vidhataindia.com
Model   VL5   VL6   VL7   VL8   VL9
HP/cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   650   850   950   1000   850
Bore   114.3   120   120   120   127
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7



Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Doug on April 10, 2006, 03:35:07 AM
I have enver heard of these fellows but they have Petters and even a triple petter.

http://www.indiamart.com/htc

BTW:
Prakash has added a new high speed clone to the line up something like a Yanmar. Is the twilte of the Listeriod is upon us????

http://www.indiamart.com/basantindustries/

http://www.indiamart.com/indiacasting/#diesel-engines

http://www.indiamart.com/doneria/

http://www.rishabhengineering.com/diesel-engines.html#lister-diesel-engines

Interesting mix of companies many I've never seen in the brand round up...

Doug
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on June 04, 2006, 01:07:18 AM
May ’06 iteration, some corrections, etc.
I have gone to the various manufacturer’s websites and assembled the following from their information.  Some provide a lot of useful information, one provided a table of numbers with no labels as to what the numbers meant!  None of them talk about sand in the sump.  Some mention balance.  It seems that the bore and stroke imply the degree of standardization between engines, which I thought might be useful.  A few use the same piston and con rod in all their engines, others only vary the piston.  A few change both.  The dimensions of the foundation bolts, which may not be particularly useful in itself, would tend to indicate whether a different casting is used for the base.
 “Standard”:  114.3 piston, 139.7 con rod.  Con rods go from 130 to 177.8.  Other common pistons are 120, 127 and 130.  Materials are mostly iron, few aluminum.  330x330 mm foundation bolt for 1 cyl., 381x559 for 2 cyl., some variation.  5/1, 6/1 and 8/1 are often the same engine, only with an increase in rpm from 600, 650 to 850 (and likely with smaller diameter, heavier flywheels).
Other observations:  14/1 and 16/1 are most often made from odd sized or “non-standard” pistons or con rods.  Oil capacities are not given for many of the engines, but the Kirloskar capacities are about half that of other manufacturer’s for the 6/1 & 8/1.  The Hindustan Trading Co. “Mini-Listers” appear to be a considerably different design than that offered by others.  The piston sizes are “standard” but the con rod and foundation bolt patterns are different than any other engines.  Direct Injection implies a different head design than “standard”, and may have an aluminum piston. 

Ammerajkot          http://www.ameerrajkot.com
H.P./Cyl.             5/1   6/1       8/1    10/1      12/1   14/1   14/1
Bore in MM          114.3      114.3   120    127   139.7 130
Stroke in MM          139.7      139.7   139.7   139.7   152.4 147
Speed RPM          600 650       850   1000       650 1000
Compression Ratio          1:18      
Lub. Oil Capacity (Lit.)       4.5               5.0
Foundation Bolt Spacing in MM    330 x 330       
Fuel Tank Capacity (Lit.)       14.0      
The 14/1’s are two versions, one with larger piston & longer stroke but lower speed, the other with smaller piston, shorter stroke but higher speed.  The 14/1’s use unusual piston and con rod’s.  I wonder if there was a typo in their spec. sheet – why would they use a piston exactly the same size as a standard con rod?

Ampro Exports      http://www.amproexports.com/lister-diesel-engines.html
Particulars    6/1    8/1    10/1    12/1    14/1    16/1    12/2    16/2    20/2
Horse Power    6    8    10    12    14    16    12    16    20
RPM       650    850    1000    1000    850    850    650    850    1000
Bore       114.3   114.3   120   127   152.4   152.4   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke       139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   177.8   177.8   139.7   139.7   139.7
Bolt spacing   330 x 330            14, 16=356 x 356      2 cyl. = 381 x 559
Fuel Cap.(Lit.)   8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Lub. Oil Cap.   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5   7.5   13
These all use the same con rod, except the 14/1 and 16/1.  Piston size and rpm varies.  Ampro uses the unusual 152.4x177.8 piston & con rod in their 14/1 and 16/1.  They also offer what appear to be direct injection engines (“New Variety”), similar to (or the same?) as Satyajeet GM-90 in 6, 8, 10, & 12/1 models.  Check out their toilets (water closets)!

   

Aswamegh      http://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
H.P./Cyl      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   12/2   14/1   15/1   16/2   20/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1050   1000   650   1000   1000   850   1050   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   130   130   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   146.05   139.7   139.7   145   160   139.7   139.7
Compression ratio:  18:1, except 14/1 and 15/1 which are 16.5:1.  They are Direct Injection engines.
All 2 cylinders have bush main bearings and oil pump, can be ordered with taper roller bearing.  6/1 and 8/1 are splash only, but can be ordered with oil pump.  Same piston except 14/1, 16/1 and 20/2.  Con rod the same except 12/1, 15/1 & 16/2.

Atul Group   http://www.atulgroup.com
HP   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   650   850   1000   1000
Bore   114   120   120   127
Stroke   139.6   139.6   139.6   139.6
All use the same con rod, but it is 0.1mm shorter than the standard.  Is it really different or not?

Crossword Agro Industries   http://www.crosswordagro.com/english/ssde.htm
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   12/2   16/1   12/2   16/2
See Nissan engines below.   

Field Marshall http://www.fieldmarshal.com
Model      FMS6   FMS8   FMS10   PMV   FM11   FM111   FMIV
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   6/1   8/1   9.5/1   10/1
RPM      660   850   1000   660   850   950   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120   120
Stroke      130   130   130   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   16:1         17:1
Somewhat unique rpm rating for 6/1, shorter con rod for 6, 8, 10/1 – are these the same as the direct injected engines offered by Satyajeet?  They share the unique con rod length.   Other 6, 8/1’s seem “standard”.  This is the only 9.5/1 offered by any manufacturer.   

GG Auto Gears   http://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm   
No information on website about engines.

GTC Engines   http://www.geco-trade.com/default.asp
H.P./Cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2
RPM   650   850   1000   650   850
Bore   114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Fuel tank   11   11   11   15   15
Compression  18:1
Same piston and con rod except piston for the 10/1.

Hindustan Trading Corporation    Liberty Diesel Engines   http://www.htcorporation.com/      
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1LOP   10/1 CBW   12/1   14/1      
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000      850   900
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   120      127   127
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7      139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1                     Direct Injected
Bolt spacing   330x330
6/1, 8/1, 10/1 are splash lubricated, others have oil pumps.  Bushing or TRB bearings available. 14/1 is Direct Injected.  Two cylinder engines are said to be available, but the webpage is not present.

Hindustan Trading Co. “Mini-Listers”
HP/Cyl      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   14/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127
Stroke      133.3   133.3   133.3   133.3   133.3
Bolt space   305x204
Mini-Listers have different characteristics:  All have TRB’s.  6/ and 8/1 are splash lubricated, others have oil pump.  All have shorter stroke than “standard” listeroid.  10/1 may have Direct Injection, 14/1 is only available with Direct Injection.
All have a different foundation bolt pattern than the “standard” Listeroid.  They are also lighter than the “standard”.     

Hrishi Exports   http://www.hrishiexports.com/slow.html
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   14/1   12/2   16/2   20/2         
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Found. Bolt Space    330x330            381x559   
Fuel tank      8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Oil Capacity   5   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5
All use the same con rod, only piston size varies.

http://www.indiamart.com/basantindustries/
http://www.indiamart.com/indiacasting/#diesel-engines
http://www.indiamart.com/doneria/
http://www.rishabhengineering.com/diesel-engines.html#lister-diesel-engines
These providers (manufacturers’?) provide almost no information about their engines except hp (sometimes).

JK Group of Industries  JKSON engines      http://www.jksonengines.com/ltde.htm   
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
Bush and TRB bearings available.  Oil pumps available.  Also rebranded as Power Solution (PS) by George of Utterpower and Joel.  PETTER / KIRLOSKAR engines also available.  Same con rod, two piston sizes.

Kirloskar      http://kirloskarapps.kirloskar.com/kirloskar/web/13$5010.html
Model      KS6   KS8   KS12   KS16
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   12/2   16/2
RPM      650   850   650   850
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Fuel tank      11 lit.   11 lit.   15 lit   15 lit.
Compression   18:1
All engines are Direct Injection.  Petter-type engines are also available.  Guaranteed for 12 months against defects.
Oil cap. of 6/1 & 8/1 is 2.6 lit., smaller than “standard”.  Oil cap. of others 5.7 lit.  Same piston and con rod in all.
   

Kissan Iron     http://www.kissangroup.com/kissan_iron_works/product/lister_type.htm
Model   KIW-   10   1   2   7A   8   4   7   7FE   7DI    7DIH   
HP/cyl.      5/1   6/1   8/1   8/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   10/1
RPM      600   650   850   950   900   1000   1000   1000   1000   1000   
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   120   120   120   120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   132   139.7   139.7
Found bolt space   330X330                     305X200   330X330   330X330
Fuel tank cap.   9   

Model   KIW-   12   12FE   14D.I.   
HP/cyl.      12/1   12/1   14/1
RPM      1000   1000   1000
Bore      127   127   127
Stroke      139.7   132   139.7
Found bolt space   330x330   305x200   330x330   
Fuel tank cap.   12   12   12
It appears that the DI models are direct injection and likely have aluminum pistons.  Heavy flywheels are available for some models, as are water pumps.  Smaller engines are splash lubricated, larger likely have pumps but it is unclear.   All use the same con rod, except one 12/1.    All the same size base casting size except KE models of 10/1 and 12/1.

Lovson   http://www.lovson.com/lister-type-slow-speed-diesel-engines.html
Model      SL-6   SL-8   SL-10    SLC10   SLC10   SLC12
            /SLC   Tiger   Sumo   Sumo
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   900   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   127   127
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   16:1   16:1   17:1   17:1   17:1   17:1
Oil cap.      5 lit.
Found. Bolt space   330x330
Generally TRB main bearings, but bushing with oil pump is available.  All use same con rod.

Metro/Metrex   http://www.metroexporters.com/pages/index.html
Model      ME-6   ME-8   ME-10   ME-12   ME-16   ME-20
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1050
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
All use the same piston and con rod, only rpm varies.

Mascot Enterprises   http://products.jimtrade.com/product_details.asp?ProductId=26396&SupplierId=92729
No information other than a generic “Lister” picture.

Nissan   Crossword Agro Industries   http://www.crosswordagro.com
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   16/1   12/2   16/2
The 12/1 is called a “Mini-Lister”, looks different from the “standard” lister types.  No spec. available.

Power Anand   http://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htm
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1LOP   10/1CBW   12/1   12/2   16/2   20/2   24/2
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000   650   850   1000   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   130   114.3   114.3   120   130
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
Fuel tank      8               13
Oil cap.      5               10
Found. Bolt space    330x330               560x382
The two 10/1’s have identical spec. but different model #’s.  All use the same con rod, two piston sizes.

Prakash/Fuking   http://www.prakash-india.com
Model      PL1   PL2   PL4   PL5
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000
Bore      120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Direct or Indirect Injection.   Same pistons and con rods.


Satyajeet   http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm      GM-90 direct injection engines w/aluminum pistons
Model      GM90/6   GM90/8   GM90/10   GM90/10   GM90/12   GM90/10   GM90/14
               Super      Sendo
RPM      750   900   1000   950   1050   800   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127   130   130
Stroke      130   130   130   130   130   146.5   146.5
Compression   17.5:1
Oil cap.      4.25
Found. Bolt space.   260x260      
Lub. Splash plus oil pumps.  Balance weights on crankshaft.  Most use a similar (but shorter) con rod than “standard” The two different con rods are unique too.  These engines have relatively smallest foundation bolt spacing, except for “mini-Lister” of Hindustan Trading Corporation.

Sterling Agra   http://www.sterlingagra.com
The spec. and descriptions appear identical to Kissan Iron, found above.

Vibha   http://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
All use the same con rod, but two piston sizes.


Vidhata   http://www.vidhataindia.com
Model   VL5   VL6   VL7   VL8   VL9
HP/cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   650   850   950   1000   850
Bore   114.3   120   120   120   127
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Same con rod, only piston varies.



Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: fattywagonman on July 10, 2006, 03:28:24 PM
I havn't seen these guys on the list...
http://www.gangadhar.net/diesel_engines5.html
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: taeuber on July 10, 2006, 04:54:36 PM
Hi fattywagonman,

this seller seems to sell the same engines like this one:
http://www.topland-india.com/products/engine/htm/engine_1.htm

Bye
Lars
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on July 10, 2006, 08:22:35 PM
July ’06 iteration, included two more manufacturer’s.
I have gone to the various manufacturer’s websites and assembled the following from their information.  Some provide a lot of useful information, one provided a table of numbers with no labels as to what the numbers meant!  None of them talk about sand in the sump.  Some mention balance.  It seems that the bore and stroke imply the degree of standardization between engines, which I thought might be useful.  A few use the same piston and con rod in all their engines, others only vary the piston.  A few change both.  The dimensions of the foundation bolts, which may not be particularly useful in itself, would tend to indicate whether a different casting is used for the base.
 “Standard”:  114.3 piston, 139.7 con rod.  Con rods go from 130 to 177.8.  Other common pistons are 120, 127 and 130.  Materials are mostly iron, few aluminum.  330x330 mm foundation bolt for 1 cyl., 381x559 for 2 cyl., some variation.  5/1, 6/1 and 8/1 are often the same engine, only with an increase in rpm from 600, 650 to 850 (and likely with smaller diameter, heavier flywheels).
Other observations:  14/1 and 16/1 are most often made from odd sized or “non-standard” pistons or con rods.  Oil capacities are not given for many of the engines, but the Kirloskar capacities are about half that of other manufacturer’s for the 6/1 & 8/1.  The Hindustan Trading Co. “Mini-Listers” appear to be a considerably different design than that offered by others.  The piston sizes are “standard” but the con rod and foundation bolt patterns are different than any other engines.  Direct Injection implies a different head design than “standard”, and may have an aluminum piston. 

Ammerajkot          http://www.ameerrajkot.com
H.P./Cyl.             5/1   6/1       8/1    10/1      12/1   14/1   14/1
Bore in MM          114.3      114.3   120    127   139.7 130
Stroke in MM          139.7      139.7   139.7   139.7   152.4 147
Speed RPM          600 650       850   1000       650 1000
Compression Ratio          1:18      
Lub. Oil Capacity (Lit.)       4.5               5.0
Foundation Bolt Spacing in MM    330 x 330       
Fuel Tank Capacity (Lit.)       14.0      
The 14/1’s are two versions, one with larger piston & longer stroke but lower speed, the other with smaller piston, shorter stroke but higher speed.  The 14/1’s use unusual piston and con rod’s.  I wonder if there was a typo in their spec. sheet – why would they use a piston exactly the same size as a standard con rod?

Ampro Exports      http://www.amproexports.com/lister-diesel-engines.html
H.P./ Cyl     6/1    8/1    10/1    12/1    14/1    16/1    12/2    16/2    20/2
RPM       650    850    1000    1000    850    850    650    850    1000
Bore       114.3   114.3   120   127   152.4   152.4   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke       139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   177.8   177.8   139.7   139.7   139.7
Bolt spacing   330 x 330            14, 16=356 x 356      2 cyl. = 381 x 559
Fuel Cap.(Lit.)   8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Lub. Oil Cap.   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5   7.5   13
These all use the same con rod, except the 14/1 and 16/1.  Piston size and rpm varies.  Ampro uses the unusual 152.4x177.8 piston & con rod in their 14/1 and 16/1 – these engines also have an unusual size of foundation bolt pattern.  They offer what appear to be direct injection engines (“New Variety”), similar to (or the same?) as Satyajeet GM-90 in 6, 8, 10, & 12/1 models.  Check out their toilets (water closets)!
   

Aswamegh      http://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
H.P./Cyl      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   12/2   14/1   15/1   16/2   20/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1050   1000   650   1000   1000   850   1050   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   130   130   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   146.05   139.7   139.7   145   160   139.7   139.7
Compression ratio:  18:1, except 14/1 and 15/1 which are 16.5:1.  They are Direct Injection engines.
All 2 cylinders have bush main bearings and oil pump, can be ordered with taper roller bearing.  6/1 and 8/1 are splash only, but can be ordered with oil pump.  Same piston except 14/1, 16/1 and 20/2.  Con rod the same except 12/1, 15/1 & 16/2.

Atul Group   http://www.atulgroup.com
HP   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   650   850   1000   1000
Bore   114   120   120   127
Stroke   139.6   139.6   139.6   139.6
All use the same con rod, but it is 0.1mm shorter than the standard.  Is it really different or not?

Crossword Agro Industries   http://www.crosswordagro.com/english/ssde.htm
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   12/2   16/1   12/2   16/2
See Nissan engines below.   

Field Marshall http://www.fieldmarshal.com
Model      FMS6   FMS8   FMS10   PMV   FM11   FM111   FMIV
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   6/1   8/1   9.5/1   10/1
RPM      660   850   1000   660   850   950   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120   120
Stroke      130   130   130   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   16:1         17:1
Somewhat unique rpm rating for 6/1, shorter con rod for 6, 8, 10/1 – are these the same as the direct injected engines offered by Satyajeet?  They share the unique con rod length.   Other 6, 8/1’s seem “standard”. 

Gangadhar Industries  http://www.gangadhar.net/diesel_engines5.html
Model #   01   01B   01M   02   02B   02M   08   08A   08M
HP/Cyl   6/1   6/1   6/1   8/1   8/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1
RPM   650   650   650   850   850   850   1000   1000   1000
Bore   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   120   120   120
Stroke   139.7   139.7   130   139.7   139.7   130   139.7   139.7   130
All indirect injection w/iron piston except 08A with direct injection and Al piston.  All the 10/1’s and the “B” models have oil pumps.  The “B” models have bushing bearings, others with TRB’s.  The 10/1 “A” and “M” models have crankshaft balance weights.    No other information on foundations or compression.  All the 6 and 8 hp have standard piston, one with shorter con rod.  10 hp have larger piston, one with shorter con rod.  Most have “ISI” but do not define the term.  The company also manufacture gen sets, welders, pumps and other equipment. 

GG Auto Gears   http://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm   
No information on website about engines.

GTC Engines   http://www.geco-trade.com/default.asp
H.P./Cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2
RPM   650   850   1000   650   850
Bore   114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Fuel tank   11   11   11   15   15
Compression  18:1
Same piston and con rod except piston for the 10/1.

Hindustan Trading Corporation    Liberty Diesel Engines   http://www.htcorporation.com/      
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1LOP   10/1 CBW   12/1   14/1      
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000      850   900
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   120      127   127
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7      139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1                     Direct Injected
Bolt spacing   330x330
6/1, 8/1, 10/1 are splash lubricated, others have oil pumps.  Bushing or TRB bearings available. 14/1 is Direct Injected.  Two cylinder engines are said to be available, but the webpage is not present.

Hindustan Trading Co. “Mini-Listers”
HP/Cyl      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   14/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127
Stroke      133.3   133.3   133.3   133.3   133.3
Bolt space   305x204
Mini-Listers have different characteristics:  All have TRB’s.  6/ and 8/1 are splash lubricated, others have oil pump.  All have shorter stroke than “standard” listeroid.  10/1 may have Direct Injection, 14/1 is only available with Direct Injection.
All have a different foundation bolt pattern than the “standard” Listeroid.  They are also lighter than the “standard”.     

Hrishi Exports   http://www.hrishiexports.com/slow.html
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   14/1   12/2   16/2   20/2         
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Found. Bolt Space    330x330            381x559   
Fuel tank      8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Oil Capacity   5   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5
All use the same con rod, only piston size varies.

http://www.indiamart.com/basantindustries/
http://www.indiamart.com/indiacasting/#diesel-engines
http://www.indiamart.com/doneria/
http://www.rishabhengineering.com/diesel-engines.html#lister-diesel-engines
These providers (manufacturers’?) provide almost no information about their engines except hp (sometimes).

JK Group of Industries  JKSON engines      http://www.jksonengines.com/ltde.htm   
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
Bush and TRB bearings available.  Oil pumps available.  Also rebranded as Power Solution (PS) by George of Utterpower and Joel.  PETTER / KIRLOSKAR engines also available.  Same con rod, two piston sizes.

Kirloskar      http://kirloskarapps.kirloskar.com/kirloskar/web/13$5010.html
Model      KS6   KS8   KS12   KS16
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   12/2   16/2
RPM      650   850   650   850
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Fuel tank      11 lit.   11 lit.   15 lit   15 lit.
Compression   18:1
All engines are Direct Injection.  Petter-type engines are also available.  Guaranteed for 12 months against defects.
Oil cap. of 6/1 & 8/1 is 2.6 lit., smaller than “standard”.  Oil cap. of others 5.7 lit.  Same piston and con rod in all.
   

Kissan Iron     http://www.kissangroup.com/kissan_iron_works/product/lister_type.htm
Model   KIW-   10   1   2   7A   8   4   7   7FE   7DI    7DIH   
HP/cyl.      5/1   6/1   8/1   8/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   10/1
RPM      600   650   850   950   900   1000   1000   1000   1000   1000   
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   120   120   120   120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   132   139.7   139.7
Found bolt space   330X330                     305X200   330X330   330X330
Fuel tank cap.   9   

Model   KIW-   12   12FE   14D.I.   
HP/cyl.      12/1   12/1   14/1
RPM      1000   1000   1000
Bore      127   127   127
Stroke      139.7   132   139.7
Found bolt space   330x330   305x200   330x330   
Fuel tank cap.   12   12   12
It appears that the DI models are direct injection and likely have aluminum pistons.  Heavy flywheels are available for some models, as are water pumps.  Smaller engines are splash lubricated, larger likely have pumps but it is unclear.   All use the same con rod, except one 12/1.    Two versions of 8/1, one with smaller piston & higher speed, one with larger piston and lower speed.  5 versions of 10/1, some with direct injection, one with smaller con rod.   All the same size base casting size except KE models of 10/1 and 12/1.

Lovson   http://www.lovson.com/lister-type-slow-speed-diesel-engines.html
Model      SL-6   SL-8   SL-10    SLC10   SLC10   SLC12
            /SLC   Tiger   Sumo   Sumo
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   900   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   127   127
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   16:1   16:1   17:1   17:1   17:1   17:1
Oil cap.      5 lit.
Found. Bolt space   330x330
Generally TRB main bearings, but bushing with oil pump is available.  All use same con rod.

Metro/Metrex   http://www.metroexporters.com/pages/index.html
Model      ME-6   ME-8   ME-10   ME-12   ME-16   ME-20
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1050
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
All use the same piston and con rod, only rpm varies.

Mascot Enterprises   http://products.jimtrade.com/product_details.asp?ProductId=26396&SupplierId=92729
No information other than a generic “Lister” picture.

Nissan   Crossword Agro Industries   http://www.crosswordagro.com
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   16/1   12/2   16/2
The 12/1 is called a “Mini-Lister”, looks different from the “standard” lister types.  No spec. available.

Power Anand   http://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htm
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1LOP   10/1CBW   12/1   12/2   16/2   20/2   24/2
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000   650   850   1000   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   130   114.3   114.3   120   130
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
Fuel tank      8               13
Oil cap.      5               10
Found. Bolt space    330x330               560x382
The two 10/1’s have identical spec. but different model #’s.  All use the same con rod, two piston sizes.

Prakash/Fuking   http://www.prakash-india.com
Model      PL1   PL2   PL4   PL5
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000
Bore      120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Direct or Indirect Injection.   Same pistons and con rods.


Satyajeet   http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm      GM-90 direct injection engines w/aluminum pistons
Model      GM90/6   GM90/8   GM90/10   GM90/10   GM90/12   GM90/10   GM90/14
               Super      Sendo
RPM      750   900   1000   950   1050   800   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127   130   130
Stroke      130   130   130   130   130   146.5   146.5
Compression   17.5:1
Oil cap.      4.25
Found. Bolt space.   260x260      
Lub. Splash plus oil pumps.  Balance weights on crankshaft.  Most use a similar (but shorter) con rod than “standard” The two different con rods are unique too.  These engines have relatively the smallest foundation bolt spacing, except for “mini-Lister” of Hindustan Trading Corporation.

Sterling Agra   http://www.sterlingagra.com
The spec. and descriptions appear identical to Kissan Iron, found above.

Topland Group of Companies   http://www.topland-india.com/products/engine/htm/engine_1.htm
Model      10A1   10A   10B   12A   12B   12ADI   14A
HP/cyl      5/1   6/1   6/1   8/1   8/1   8/1   9.5/1
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
RPM      600   650   650   850   850   850   1000

Model      19A   15A   15A1   15B   16A   16A1   16ASD   16ADI   16ASDI
HP/cyl      10/1   10/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1
Bore      120   120   120   120   120   120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
RPM      1000   1000   900   1000   1000   900   1000   1000   1000

Model      11A   11A1   17A   28A   28A1   29ADI   29ADI1   30ADI   30ADI1   
HP/Cyl      12/1   10/1   12/1   10/1   14/1   10/1   15/1   16/1   10/1
Bore      127   127   127   127   127   127   127   130   130
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   160   160   160   160   160
RPM      1000   900   1000   900   900   1000   900   1000   900

Model      18ADI   18ADI2
HP/Cyl      18   20
Bore      155   155
Stroke      177.8   177.8
RPM      750   825
28(!) different models, obviously from a wide range of  manufacturers.  Eleven different 10/1’s!  First group has “standard” bore and stroke.  Second group has “semi-standard” bore of 120 mm and standard con rod.  They have a bewildering array of options, including SDM or Super Deluxe Model.  Curiously, the 18/1 and 20/1 do not have an oil pump, though many of the others do.  They say they are India’s largest manufacturer of engines and pumps.   


Vibha   http://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
All use the same con rod, but two piston sizes.


Vidhata   http://www.vidhataindia.com
Model   VL5   VL6   VL7   VL8   VL9
HP/cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   650   850   950   1000   850
Bore   114.3   120   120   120   127
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Same con rod, only piston varies.



Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: taeuber on July 11, 2006, 09:04:33 AM
Hallo!

Topland sells complete Lister Type, Slow Speed, Water-Cooled V-Belt Driven generator sets:

http://www.topland-india.com/products/genset/htm/genset_19.htm


Regards
Lars
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: kyradawg on July 11, 2006, 04:31:27 PM

Peace&Love, Darren
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: taeuber on July 13, 2006, 03:52:16 PM
Another exporter:

http://www.agroengine.com/diesel1.htm#water

Lars
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on July 17, 2006, 05:58:02 PM
July ’06 iteration, includes the Windsor and the “mini-listers” of the Topland group.
I have gone to the various manufacturer’s websites and assembled the following from their information.  Some provide a lot of useful information, one provided a table of numbers with no labels as to what the numbers meant!  None of them talk about sand in the sump.  Some mention balance.  It seems that the bore and stroke imply the degree of standardization between engines, which I thought might be useful.  A few use the same piston and con rod in all their engines, others only vary the piston.  A few change both.  The dimensions of the foundation bolts, which may not be particularly useful in itself, would tend to indicate whether a different casting is used for the base.
 “Standard”:  114.3 piston, 139.7 con rod.  Con rods go from 130 to 177.8.  Other common pistons are 120, 127 and 130.  Materials are mostly iron, few aluminum.  330x330 mm foundation bolt for 1 cyl., 381x559 for 2 cyl., some variation.  5/1, 6/1 and 8/1 are often the same engine, only with an increase in rpm from 600, 650 to 850 (and likely with smaller diameter, heavier flywheels).
Other observations:  14/1 and 16/1 are most often made from odd sized or “non-standard” pistons or con rods.  Oil capacities are not given for many of the engines, but the Kirloskar capacities are about half that of other manufacturer’s for the 6/1 & 8/1.  The Hindustan Trading Co. “Mini-Listers” appear to be a considerably different design than that offered by others.  The piston sizes are “standard” but the con rod and foundation bolt patterns are different than any other engines.  Direct Injection implies a different head design than “standard”, and may have an aluminum piston. 

Ammerajkot          http://www.ameerrajkot.com
H.P./Cyl.             5/1   6/1       8/1    10/1      12/1   14/1   14/1
Bore in MM          114.3      114.3   120    127   139.7 130
Stroke in MM          139.7      139.7   139.7   139.7   152.4 147
Speed RPM          600 650       850   1000       650 1000
Compression Ratio          1:18      
Lub. Oil Capacity (Lit.)       4.5               5.0
Foundation Bolt Spacing in MM    330 x 330       
Fuel Tank Capacity (Lit.)       14.0      
The 14/1’s are two versions, one with larger piston & longer stroke but lower speed, the other with smaller piston, shorter stroke but higher speed.  The 14/1’s use unusual piston and con rod’s.  I wonder if there was a typo in their spec. sheet – why would they use a piston exactly the same size as a standard con rod?

Ampro Exports      http://www.amproexports.com/lister-diesel-engines.html
H.P./ Cyl     6/1    8/1    10/1    12/1    14/1    16/1    12/2    16/2    20/2
RPM       650    850    1000    1000    850    850    650    850    1000
Bore       114.3   114.3   120   127   152.4   152.4   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke       139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   177.8   177.8   139.7   139.7   139.7
Bolt spacing   330 x 330            14, 16=356 x 356      2 cyl. = 381 x 559
Fuel Cap.(Lit.)   8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Lub. Oil Cap.   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5   7.5   13
These all use the same con rod, except the 14/1 and 16/1.  Piston size and rpm varies.  Ampro uses the unusual 152.4x177.8 piston & con rod in their 14/1 and 16/1 – these engines also have an unusual size of foundation bolt pattern.  They offer what appear to be direct injection engines (“New Variety”), similar to (or the same?) as Satyajeet GM-90 in 6, 8, 10, & 12/1 models.  Check out their toilets (water closets)!
   

Aswamegh      http://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
H.P./Cyl      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   12/2   14/1   15/1   16/2   20/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1050   1000   650   1000   1000   850   1050   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   130   130   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   146.05   139.7   139.7   145   160   139.7   139.7
Compression ratio:  18:1, except 14/1 and 15/1 which are 16.5:1.  They are Direct Injection engines.
All 2 cylinders have bush main bearings and oil pump, can be ordered with taper roller bearing.  6/1 and 8/1 are splash only, but can be ordered with oil pump.  Same piston except 14/1, 16/1 and 20/2.  Con rod the same except 12/1, 15/1 & 16/2.

Atul Group   http://www.atulgroup.com
HP   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   650   850   1000   1000
Bore   114   120   120   127
Stroke   139.6   139.6   139.6   139.6
All use the same con rod, but it is 0.1mm shorter than the standard.  Is it really different or not?

Crossword Agro Industries   http://www.crosswordagro.com/english/ssde.htm
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   12/2   16/1   12/2   16/2
See Nissan engines below.   

Field Marshall http://www.fieldmarshal.com
Model      FMS6   FMS8   FMS10   PMV   FM11   FM111   FMIV
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   6/1   8/1   9.5/1   10/1
RPM      660   850   1000   660   850   950   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120   120
Stroke      130   130   130   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   16:1         17:1
Somewhat unique rpm rating for 6/1, shorter con rod for 6, 8, 10/1 – are these the same as the direct injected engines offered by Satyajeet?  They share the unique con rod length.   Other 6, 8/1’s seem “standard”. 

Gangadhar Industries  http://www.gangadhar.net/diesel_engines5.html
Model #   01   01B   01M   02   02B   02M   08   08A   08M
HP/Cyl   6/1   6/1   6/1   8/1   8/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1
RPM   650   650   650   850   850   850   1000   1000   1000
Bore   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   120   120   120
Stroke   139.7   139.7   130   139.7   139.7   130   139.7   139.7   130
All indirect injection w/iron piston except 08A with direct injection and Al piston.  All the 10/1’s and the “B” models have oil pumps.  The “B” models have bushing bearings, others with TRB’s.  The 10/1 “A” and “M” models have crankshaft balance weights.    No other information on foundations or compression.  All the 6 and 8 hp have standard piston, one with shorter con rod.  10 hp have larger piston, one with shorter con rod.  Most have “ISI” but do not define the term.  The company also manufacture gen sets, welders, pumps and other equipment. 

GG Auto Gears   http://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm   
No information on website about engines.

GTC Engines   http://www.geco-trade.com/default.asp
H.P./Cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2
RPM   650   850   1000   650   850
Bore   114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Fuel tank   11   11   11   15   15
Compression  18:1
Same piston and con rod except piston for the 10/1.

Hindustan Trading Corporation    Liberty Diesel Engines   http://www.htcorporation.com/      
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1LOP   10/1 CBW   12/1   14/1      
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000      850   900
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   120      127   127
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7      139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1                     Direct Injected
Bolt spacing   330x330
6/1, 8/1, 10/1 are splash lubricated, others have oil pumps.  Bushing or TRB bearings available. 14/1 is Direct Injected.  Two cylinder engines are said to be available, but the webpage is not present.

Hindustan Trading Co. “Mini-Listers”
HP/Cyl      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   14/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127
Stroke      133.3   133.3   133.3   133.3   133.3
Bolt space   305x204
Mini-Listers have different characteristics:  All have TRB’s.  6/ and 8/1 are splash lubricated, others have oil pump.  All have shorter stroke than “standard” listeroid.  10/1 may have Direct Injection, 14/1 is only available with Direct Injection.
All have a different foundation bolt pattern than the “standard” Listeroid.  They are also lighter than the “standard”.     

Hrishi Exports   http://www.hrishiexports.com/slow.html
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   14/1   12/2   16/2   20/2         
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Found. Bolt Space    330x330            381x559   
Fuel tank      8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Oil Capacity   5   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5
All use the same con rod, only piston size varies.

http://www.indiamart.com/basantindustries/
http://www.indiamart.com/indiacasting/#diesel-engines
http://www.indiamart.com/doneria/
http://www.rishabhengineering.com/diesel-engines.html#lister-diesel-engines
These providers (manufacturers’?) provide almost no information about their engines except hp (sometimes).

JK Group of Industries  JKSON engines      http://www.jksonengines.com/ltde.htm   
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
Bush and TRB bearings available.  Oil pumps available.  Also rebranded as Power Solution (PS) by George of Utterpower and Joel.  PETTER / KIRLOSKAR engines also available.  Same con rod, two piston sizes.

Kirloskar      http://kirloskarapps.kirloskar.com/kirloskar/web/13$5010.html
Model      KS6   KS8   KS12   KS16
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   12/2   16/2
RPM      650   850   650   850
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Fuel tank      11 lit.   11 lit.   15 lit   15 lit.
Compression   18:1
All engines are Direct Injection.  Petter-type engines are also available.  Guaranteed for 12 months against defects.
Oil cap. of 6/1 & 8/1 is 2.6 lit., smaller than “standard”.  Oil cap. of others 5.7 lit.  Same piston and con rod in all.
   

Kissan Iron     http://www.kissangroup.com/kissan_iron_works/product/lister_type.htm
Model   KIW-   10   1   2   7A   8   4   7   7FE   7DI    7DIH   
HP/cyl.      5/1   6/1   8/1   8/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   10/1
RPM      600   650   850   950   900   1000   1000   1000   1000   1000   
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   120   120   120   120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   132   139.7   139.7
Found bolt space   330X330                     305X200   330X330   330X330
Fuel tank cap.   9   

Model   KIW-   12   12FE   14D.I.   
HP/cyl.      12/1   12/1   14/1
RPM      1000   1000   1000
Bore      127   127   127
Stroke      139.7   132   139.7
Found bolt space   330x330   305x200   330x330   
Fuel tank cap.   12   12   12
It appears that the DI models are direct injection and likely have aluminum pistons.  Heavy flywheels are available for some models, as are water pumps.  Smaller engines are splash lubricated, larger likely have pumps but it is unclear.   All use the same con rod, except one 12/1.    Two versions of 8/1, one with smaller piston & higher speed, one with larger piston and lower speed.  5 versions of 10/1, some with direct injection, one with smaller con rod.   All the same size base casting size except KE models of 10/1 and 12/1.

Lovson   http://www.lovson.com/lister-type-slow-speed-diesel-engines.html
Model      SL-6   SL-8   SL-10    SLC10   SLC10   SLC12
            /SLC   Tiger   Sumo   Sumo
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   900   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   127   127
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   16:1   16:1   17:1   17:1   17:1   17:1
Oil cap.      5 lit.
Found. Bolt space   330x330
Generally TRB main bearings, but bushing with oil pump is available.  All use same con rod.

Metro/Metrex   http://www.metroexporters.com/pages/index.html
Model      ME-6   ME-8   ME-10   ME-12   ME-16   ME-20
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1050
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
All use the same piston and con rod, only rpm varies.

Mascot Enterprises   http://products.jimtrade.com/product_details.asp?ProductId=26396&SupplierId=92729
No information other than a generic “Lister” picture.

Nissan   Crossword Agro Industries   http://www.crosswordagro.com
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   16/1   12/2   16/2
The 12/1 is called a “Mini-Lister”, looks different from the “standard” lister types.  No spec. available.

Power Anand   http://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htm
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1LOP   10/1CBW   12/1   12/2   16/2   20/2   24/2
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000   650   850   1000   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   130   114.3   114.3   120   130
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
Fuel tank      8               13
Oil cap.      5               10
Found. Bolt space    330x330               560x382
The two 10/1’s have identical spec. but different model #’s.  All use the same con rod, two piston sizes.

Prakash/Fuking   http://www.prakash-india.com
Model      PL1   PL2   PL4   PL5
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000
Bore      120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Direct or Indirect Injection.   Same pistons and con rods.


Satyajeet   http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm      GM-90 direct injection engines w/aluminum pistons
Model      GM90/6   GM90/8   GM90/10   GM90/10   GM90/12   GM90/10   GM90/14
               Super      Sendo
RPM      750   900   1000   950   1050   800   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127   130   130
Stroke      130   130   130   130   130   146.5   146.5
Compression   17.5:1
Oil cap.      4.25
Found. Bolt space.   260x260      
Lub. Splash plus oil pumps.  Balance weights on crankshaft.  Most use a similar (but shorter) con rod than “standard” The two different con rods are unique too.  These engines have relatively the smallest foundation bolt spacing, except for “mini-Lister” of Hindustan Trading Corporation.

Sterling Agra   http://www.sterlingagra.com
The spec. and descriptions appear identical to Kissan Iron, found above.

Topland Group of Companies   http://www.topland-india.com/products/engine/htm/engine_1.htm
Model      10A1   10A   10B   12A   12B   12ADI   14A
HP/cyl      5/1   6/1   6/1   8/1   8/1   8/1   9.5/1
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
RPM      600   650   650   850   850   850   1000

Model      19A   15A   15A1   15B   16A   16A1   16ASD   16ADI   16ASDI
HP/cyl      10/1   10/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1
Bore      120   120   120   120   120   120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
RPM      1000   1000   900   1000   1000   900   1000   1000   1000

Model      11A   11A1   17A   28A   28A1   29ADI   29ADI1   30ADI   30ADI1   
HP/Cyl      12/1   10/1   12/1   10/1   14/1   10/1   15/1   16/1   10/1
Bore      127   127   127   127   127   127   127   130   130
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   160   160   160   160   160
RPM      1000   900   1000   900   900   1000   900   1000   900

Model      18ADI   18ADI2   20A   21A   22A   23A, 24A, 25A, 25ADI, 26A, 26AI, 27ADI, 27ADI1
HP/Cyl      18/1   20/1   12/2   16/2   20/2   “Mini-listers”, all 1 cyl, 130mm stroke, 114.3, 120.
Bore      155   155   114.3   114.3   114.3   127mm bores, 6,8,10,12,14 hp, 650-1000 rpm.
Stroke      177.8   177.8   139.7   139.7   139.7   1st three indirect injection, all others direct.
RPM      750   825   650   850   1000
36(!) different models, obviously from a wide range of  manufacturers.  Fourteen different 10/1’s!  First group has “standard” bore and stroke.  Second group has “semi-standard” bore of 120 mm and standard con rod.  They have a bewildering array of options, including SDM or Super Deluxe Model.  Curiously, the 18/1 and 20/1 do not have an oil pump, though many of the others do.  The two cylinders are all standard bore and stroke.  They also have high speed (1500 rpm) water cooled diesels from 3 to 45 hp and high speed air cooled from 3 to 20 hp.  Some engines are designed for marine use.  Also have gen sets, alternators, & pumps.  They say they are India’s largest manufacturer of engines and pumps.   


Vibha   http://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
All use the same con rod, but two piston sizes.


Vidhata   http://www.vidhataindia.com
Model   VL5   VL6   VL7   VL8   VL9
HP/cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   650   850   950   1000   850
Bore   114.3   120   120   120   127
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Same con rod, only piston varies.

Windsor Exports   http://www.agroengine.com/diesel1.htm#water

HP/Cyl   6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   12/1   12/1   14/1   16/1   20/1
RPM   560   850   1000   1050   1000   650   900   850   1050
Bore    114.3   114.3   120   114.3   127   114.3   139.7   114.3   114.3
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   152.4   139.7   139.7

The 6 and 8 HP are splash lubed, the rest have pumps.  All have 139.7 con rods, except the 14 HP.  The 14 HP has the unusual piston size of 139.7, the same as the  con rod in all the others.  One other manufacturer has this same combination.  RPM and piston size varies considerably, but many have the “standard” 114.3 mm piston.  They also have Petteroids.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: GuyFawkes on July 17, 2006, 06:28:46 PM
The original Lister CS 6/1 was 4.5 inch bore and 5.5 inch stroke

25.4 mm per inch, this is one of the few metric / imperial conversions that is actually an exact number

4.5" x 25.4 = 114.3 mm

5.5" x 25.4 = 139.7 mm

it's hard to see how anyone can get any rounding errors, unless they did it in excel, which internally is reasonably accurate, but displays rounded numbers

http://www.wsdot.wa.gov/reference/metrics/factors.htm
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Doug on July 30, 2006, 05:42:24 AM
Anyone ever notice if you open the prakas webpage to Petters in one window and the kissan page in aonther and flip back and forth realy fast they are almost exactly the same......
all the technicla specs in the same place and exactly a like.
Works for most of their engines....

Thats realy odd what gives????
 
Doug
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on July 30, 2006, 05:56:06 AM
Check out the Topland site, I think they have engines from half a dozen different "manufacturers".  I'd love to know how they actually interact.  Does Topland actually manufacture anything, or do they just market stuff?  Who knows.
Ray
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Doug on July 30, 2006, 05:59:15 AM
I think they are an export company first, like Ampro....

Check out their History, its under construction lol!!!!!

Doug

Oh, and I think this is a vission statment
 

'CORE VALUES'
Page Under Construction
 



'TOPLAND'
contributes to the national might by earning the much needed foreign exchange by virtue of exports to more than two dozen countries in the Africa, Asia, Central America & the Middle East.
 
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Twinscrew on August 01, 2006, 03:51:07 AM
Topland uses the "Hang Loose" logo. I suspected that those Indians were surfers all along. Problem is they got nothin' but beach.  ;D
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: peterako on October 02, 2006, 02:48:31 PM
Hi after a email from anand i leared that anand is not manufacturing for lovson any more. :o

Does anybody know the manufactor from LOVSON. ??? ???
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: d3ejmz on October 03, 2006, 04:32:49 PM
Hey all... New to the forums here.

In reading this vast accumulation of information on the brands of listeroids available, and visiting the external links, I notice that One Engine stands out above all the others in terms of Specific Fuel Consumption. It is the Ashwamegh 14/1 which weighs in using 230g/kw/hr. Coming in a close second is their 15/1 which is rated at 240g/kw/hr. No where else do I see these numbers among the vast sea of listeroids. These numbers are from 2 engines with slightly different bores,  and both are DI engines. It seems that they hit a sweet spot with the combustion chamber size/cylinder crossection ratio ...or something. Any engineers here can help us figure out what's going on? And the numbers seem to have been the result of a real test, rather than copied out of some book somewhere, since there are no other numbers like these.

Sure am wondering...

Jim  ???
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: buickanddeere on October 08, 2006, 12:59:48 AM
  I would like to see independent lab results on  radomly chosen engines out of the warehouse. 
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on January 11, 2007, 12:45:24 AM
It seems like it would be useful to included the observations by OM in Nov., '06 about Listeroids.  Unfortunately he hasn't posted any more information lately.  Ray
 
OM:  "I just happened to go through this site today and have spent the last 3 hours reading the comments of various individuals regarding listeroids from India.
I am from India , no , I am not trying to sell any engines or spares , but know the full manufacturing process of these engines as my father ( who expired last year ) used to sell them to various countries in Africa.
I started my career in Nigeria selling these engines and got out of this business as I did not like what I was selling.
Let me tell you how these engines are made:
They are all made in a city called rajkot.
There is no other centre in India which makes these engines , if anyone tells you otherwise they are lying.
No engine manufacturer is a manufacturer of more than two or three parts out of the total parts required to make an engine.
It is a cottage industry , where each part ( leaving out a few critical parts ) is made by small manufacturers who supply them to the so called engine manufacturer.
The manufacturer will then hire people on daily wages basis to assemble the engines.
After the engine is assembled it is put on the test line to see that it is working properly.
Immediately after the test is over it is packed in wooden cases , this is the reason why you will always get oil in the crankcase which makes you feel that you are buying a used engine.
As far as casting pieces are concerned this problem will never go ( believe me I have tried ) as the manufacturer never bothers to machine them out and the exporter of these engines sitting in Bombay ( now Mumbai ) never sees what is being packed and exported.
You can get these engines made in any name as all you have to do is put the name on the crankcase cover ( which does not cost much ) and get plates printed in your name                    ( minimum qty. of plates can be as low as 100pcs and again the cost is not much ).
Parts catalogues and instruction manuals can also be printed in your name , as there is only one printer who supplies everybody , all you have to do is to change the cover page and put your brand name.
The reason why I am letting everybody know all this is as follows :
Quality : you only get what you pay for ( pay peanuts and get monkeys )
Problems : have been , will be and will never go away as the people of this town do not understand what quality means , the few who do are not interested in exporting as their engines sell at better prices in India.
I hope I have put some light on this matter and it is of help to everybody and may help reduce their frustration regarding these engines from India.
I would also like to add that quality products are being exported from India and please do not judge the country by one product.
Once again believe me this not a sales pitch , but is being done without any malice towards anyone."

In India the listeroids are used primarily for drawing water.
The petteroids are used for drawing water , generators and in rural areas as an engine in a locally fabricated vehicle.
The parts made by good manufacturers are :
Fuel injection system by mico or motorpal
Pistons and piston rings by goetze , usha , india pistons or perfect circle ( but most manufacturers use locally made ones )
Crankshafts should be in en9 grade steel but most manufacturers use mild steel
Please let me know if you need names of manufacturers for any other parts.
I hope this is of help.
Regards
OM
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Horsepoor on January 11, 2007, 07:34:26 AM
OM / rpg52,

I read your post with great interest and fowarded a copy to some other members of similar interest. I would greatly appreicate you posting more information on qualitity part sources. I truely enjoy working on my Listeriod and like to improve overall performance. Thank you again for your extremely interesting post.

Bruce
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: craig c on January 14, 2007, 04:08:57 AM
Quote from: rpg52 on January 11, 2007, 12:45:24 AM
It seems like it would be useful to included the observations by OM in Nov., '06 about Listeroids.  Unfortunately he hasn't posted any more information lately.  Ray
 
OM:  "I just happened to go through this site today and have spent the last 3 hours reading the comments of various individuals regarding listeroids from India.
I am from India , no , I am not trying to sell any engines or spares , but know the full manufacturing process of these engines as my father ( who expired last year ) used to sell them to various countries in Africa.
I started my career in Nigeria selling these engines and got out of this business as I did not like what I was selling.
Let me tell you how these engines are made:
They are all made in a city called rajkot.
There is no other centre in India which makes these engines , if anyone tells you otherwise they are lying.
No engine manufacturer is a manufacturer of more than two or three parts out of the total parts required to make an engine.
It is a cottage industry , where each part ( leaving out a few critical parts ) is made by small manufacturers who supply them to the so called engine manufacturer.
The manufacturer will then hire people on daily wages basis to assemble the engines.
After the engine is assembled it is put on the test line to see that it is working properly.
Immediately after the test is over it is packed in wooden cases , this is the reason why you will always get oil in the crankcase which makes you feel that you are buying a used engine.
As far as casting pieces are concerned this problem will never go ( believe me I have tried ) as the manufacturer never bothers to machine them out and the exporter of these engines sitting in Bombay ( now Mumbai ) never sees what is being packed and exported.
You can get these engines made in any name as all you have to do is put the name on the crankcase cover ( which does not cost much ) and get plates printed in your name                    ( minimum qty. of plates can be as low as 100pcs and again the cost is not much ).
Parts catalogues and instruction manuals can also be printed in your name , as there is only one printer who supplies everybody , all you have to do is to change the cover page and put your brand name.
The reason why I am letting everybody know all this is as follows :
Quality : you only get what you pay for ( pay peanuts and get monkeys )
Problems : have been , will be and will never go away as the people of this town do not understand what quality means , the few who do are not interested in exporting as their engines sell at better prices in India.
I hope I have put some light on this matter and it is of help to everybody and may help reduce their frustration regarding these engines from India.
I would also like to add that quality products are being exported from India and please do not judge the country by one product.
Once again believe me this not a sales pitch , but is being done without any malice towards anyone."

In India the listeroids are used primarily for drawing water.
The petteroids are used for drawing water , generators and in rural areas as an engine in a locally fabricated vehicle.
The parts made by good manufacturers are :
Fuel injection system by mico or motorpal
Pistons and piston rings by goetze , usha , india pistons or perfect circle ( but most manufacturers use locally made ones )
Crankshafts should be in en9 grade steel but most manufacturers use mild steel
Please let me know if you need names of manufacturers for any other parts.
I hope this is of help.
Regards
OM
om/rpg52
                          Hi, can you supply names of manufacturers of quality lister - petter engines and as you say there are quality engines    built in india and they are not exporting them, would they export them for the right price ? could you supply there names. thanks craig c
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on January 15, 2007, 01:44:27 AM
Craig C
I wish I knew something, but I don't.  OM seemed to have some personal experience, unfortunately he hasn't posted since Nov. of '06.  I just posted this because his post had a lot of interesting info.  I'm nearly as ignorant as everyone else who hasn't visited India, specifically Rajkot.
Ray
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Rod on January 30, 2007, 01:49:54 PM
     Hello All:
       I dealt directly with Atul Patel at Anand Ent. when I bought my Powerline 16-2. This was very easy, with good communication and it was on board ship in no time at all. Thing was the ship went into the wrong ocean, this was not the fault of Anand. The box was labeled right but the people in Mumbi don't seem to know the dif. between Portland Or. and Portland Maine. It was part my fault, because it should have gone to Boston, the correct port for my area (I don't import so I don't know these things), in any case, I sent an e-mail to Atul and he took care of all problems at no expense to me.
      Overall condition of the unit was very good, I found a very small amount of grit (sand?) in the cam covers & that was all. The lifters were a little rough, I touched them up with a toolpost grinder & then the lapping plate. I did the standard governor mod. to make it into a generator, and then ran it. After a few hours, maybe 5, of on and off running, I had the cooling working good, and the Hz. meter holding within 1 1/2 cycles, maybe 2. Then the power went out, she did a very good job, but with the extened run we found that something wasn't right. Black goo running down one header. (See thread about possible cracked head) I sent Mr. Patel some pictures of the scratch & the carbon line on the head gasket. I now have a   NEW HEAD coming with gaskets, in the mail, his offering, no arguments, no questions, no problems, I am extremely happy with the company, the service, and the product.     My only complaint was the charges that the people in my own country screwed me with, I bet if any one of them farted I ended up paying the laundry bill for his underwear.
         I can't say that you would have the same experience, maybe I just have good karma, but overall I have a good feeling about dealing with Anand and Mr. Atul Patel. I've gone over all the writing in their web-site & the book that came with the engine. Nowhere does it mention warranty, however I seem to have one, they came thru with no legal obligation. I call that a good company!!
                                                                                                                                                 Rod
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: MeanListerGreen on January 31, 2007, 04:56:10 PM
Good idea on scanning templates.  I have a gasket set but unfortunately no scanner.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: taeuber on January 31, 2007, 06:18:49 PM
Quote from: Rod on January 30, 2007, 01:49:54 PM
I did the standard governor mod. to make it into a generator, and then ran it.

Hallo Rod,

could you post me a link, a page number in Georges PDF or something with the description of the modification you mean?
I own a 12/2 since a week and have it open for cleaning and everything. I don't want to forget to make all things that should have been done.

Thanks
Lars
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Doug on January 31, 2007, 09:55:35 PM
Quote from: Rod on January 30, 2007, 01:49:54 PM
   
         I can't say that you would have the same experience, maybe I just have good karma, but overall I have a good feeling about dealing with Anand and Mr. Atul Patel. I've gone over all the writing in their web-site & the book that came with the engine. Nowhere does it mention warranty, however I seem to have one, they came thru with no legal obligation. I call that a good company!!
                                                                                                                                                 Rod

Atul is a nice open fellow who has offered me parts as well.
Gus pushed the limmits for what I think they were able to produce and I think it cost them more to produce and ship this engine than I paid and he included some extras I never asked for. I've told him I will pay for any parts I need its only fair I think.

Doug
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Rod on January 31, 2007, 10:32:46 PM
   Taeuber:
       To be honest, I cant remember if it was in his web-site or on the CD. It's just a matter of reversing the position of the adjusting hook for the spring. First you mount the end of the spring directly to the govenor arm. Then, make up a bracket for the hook shaped adjustment thing. The bracket can mounted on the bolt (stud) that held the spring, but needs to be designed in such a way that you can use a longer spring WITHOUT any interferance. That should do it.
       With the hook on the governor arm, it swings in an arch which, as I understand it is part of the problem. By moving it to a fixed point, you remove that problem. Then all you need is the right spring. George sells a kit, you can find it in his web-sight. I just like making my own stuff, for me that's a big part of the fun.
    Good Luck
       Rod
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Rod on January 31, 2007, 11:09:02 PM
     Doug:
        Anand had an order of something going to a diesel shop in Bangor, so they just added my parts to it. It is up to me to get the parts home, but still and all I couldn't be happier. With all the bad mouthing about the Indians I hear I felt the need to give credit where cerdit is due.
         Did you ever read the Ramayana, very good book - even without anything about Lister engines!!
                    Rod
                                           
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Doug on January 31, 2007, 11:37:16 PM
No can't say I ever read it....

I sat threw a play called the Mahahbaratta, probly not spelled right, but that's where Oppehiemer's the quote " I am become death the destroyer of worlds" came from. I believe I sat for 14 hours over two days.

Again no Lister diesels, but lots of guys with extra arms, weapons of mass distruction, good guys and evil. And it left me with some new persectives on war and the price to be paid for peace.

Doug
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Rod on February 01, 2007, 01:52:35 PM
      Doug:
    I've got that one too, the Mahabharata is the most holy book of the Hindu, A very interesting point, that I can't see how a play could show is that the war ends with an atomic blast. I states that an iron tiped arrow (in what we call the bronze age) explodes with the light of 10,000 suns, elephants 10 miles from the point of impact were blown off their feet and burst into flames & the explosion made a cloud in the shape of a parasol. This war is supposed to have ended the last "time of man" more or less 10,000 years ago. There was a building project in India that had to be terminated because of contaminated soil in the same basic area as the war.
       I find it most curious that Oppehiemer borrowed from this book!!
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Doug on February 05, 2007, 08:22:34 PM
I'm an Athiest....

Edited for fear of starting a holy war....

We need more multy armed blue guys and nuclear powered arrows.

Doug
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on March 02, 2007, 12:37:21 AM
Here is a interesting and useful quote from a thread started by Listerdiesel.  Placed here to prevent it from disappearing into the mire.



I've been reading most of the posts on the Indian engines, and have had some contacts over the years with Tom Mackay in Perth, Australia who imported the Metex engines for some years.

It seems to me that the expectations raised by the advertising of these engines are not realised when they eventually turn up. This is due to a variety of reasons, mostly poor quality machining, lack of inspection of finished parts and engines and just generally poor adaptation of what was originally a good and reliable design.

What seems to have happened, looking at the postings here, is that people are buying the engines based on a pretty hyped up advertising blurb and then when they receive their engine they feel let down

Costs of getting a genuine Lister or Petter engine are high, not so much on the actual purchasing, but on shipping and handling. It seems that it is easier and cheaper to buy a new Indian clone than it is to buy a secondhand Lister or Petter and ship it out from the UK. I picked up a couple of radiator cooled 6/1 Listers recently for £60 each, 'poorly handled' condition but complete down to radiators, air filters etc etc. That is how cheap they 'can' be, albeit internal condition unknown.

The Indian clones are part of a cottage industry almost, one that has many people all working to fulfil a small but interested market. It will never get to major figures in production terms as they simply don't have the machinery or technology to produce such stuff. People making parts in the street in India is quite a common sight. I was there in Delhi in 1980/81 for 13 weeks, and the crudeness of some of the manufacturing had to be seen to be believed, but they are all scratching a living, not riding round in big V8 pickups.

Dirt floors are the norm in most factories, machinery has been restricted by successive governments wanting to avoid importing costs and hard currency trade, so almost anything is picked up and kept going.

The secondhand machine tool trade from the UK to India and Pakistan is running at very high levels at present, anything from 1940's to 1960's machinery is bing bought and containerised out to these countries to go into their manufacturing industries. Most of this stuff is pretty clapped out when it leaves here, so you can imagine how it is when they get to use it. Similar trading goes on through Europe.

But, imagine receiving your first capstan lathe.....  making studs and suchlike on a machine rather than in a vice with a hacksaw and dies. Or your first milling machine, no more filing!  One of the places I was working with in delhi, made window frames. Two kids sat in the gutter outside with a big block of steel, a chisel and a BIG hammer. All they did all day long was to cut up lengths of steel strip for the frames. There was one drilling machine in the place and one welder. 20 or more people worked there, labour is cheap, machinery and the electricity to power them is expensive.

Most of these places will never compete in an open market with a serious engine maker. They have a small niche market and it will never get any better than that. The engines are in a kind of 1940's 'second universe' where they will not do anything to improve the mechanics of the things but occasionally they will increase bore and stroke sizes to uprate the power etc.

It would be nice to think that these guys would have a future in this business, but longer-term they will fall by the wayside as the requirements of modern-day practices will see that they cannot afford all the health & safety and other costs/requirements that have killed off most of the manufacturing in western countries. Unfortunately there are no more 'low-labour cost' countries left after China and India.

China will probably jump this stage completely, they know where they are going with technology and will not get into this closed loop, other than a few small outfits who will operate like the Indians have.

Kirloskar started all this in the 1950's, and here we are 50 years on with essentially the same products. 'Nuff said.

Peter
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: LowGear on March 15, 2007, 05:48:01 AM
Do any manufactures utilize solid flywheels rather than the spoked ones I see everywhere?  Why?
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on March 16, 2007, 08:34:30 PM
Lowgear,

The soild flywheels are available, and generally used for the higher speed engines (800 - 1000 rpm).  The spoked ones are only rated for 650 rpm.  One could (it seems) order solid flywheels for any engine though.  They are generally heavier, and would therefore, cost more than the spoked ones.  They are also often smaller in diameter, to reduce the forces involved at higher rpms.
Ray
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Stan on March 17, 2007, 01:39:09 AM
The SOM style flywheels, though not exactly solid (2 oval holes and 1 smaller round hole) are very heavy.  Penelope's are a full 25" in diameter with a 4" deep and 3.5" wide rim and the center is 1" thick.  I have decided not to take them off as the main bearings "sound" very quiet and there appears to be no play up and down or sideways.  That said, I don't know if I lifted the 240 lb flywheels up and down adequately to see if there was any play  : ???  They do sound very quiet with a stethoscope though.
Stan
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: LowGear on March 17, 2007, 06:52:40 AM
The holes or spokes spinning around seem to be an added unnecessary risk.  While I love the tradition of these funky old farts I can also see a wrench or screwdriver hurling out into the unknown after being kissed by one of these non functional extra effort to incorporate artistic touches.

LG
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: adhall on March 17, 2007, 05:58:16 PM
LowGear:

To answer your question about solid vs. spoked flywheels:
Spoked flywheels do have an advantage over disk flywheels in that you get more "flywheel effect" for a given flywheel weight. This is because a spoked flywheel has proportionately more of it's material in the rim of the flywheel where it makes the biggest contribution to the flywheel's inertia.

I suspect that there may be another advantage to a spoked flywheel regarding the ease of producing the casting, but I can't say for sure on that point.

In other words, the spokes are just there for looks. ;)

Best regards,
Andy Hall

Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: max.network23 on May 18, 2007, 03:22:05 PM
Andy wrote:
>I suspect that there may be another advantage to a spoked flywheel regarding the ease of producing
>the casting, but I can't say for sure on that point.

Another that I can think of is -> Less material means less cost.

-John
Listeroid Wannabe
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: phaedrus on May 18, 2007, 04:15:29 PM
Back in the 1970's I spent about 18 months working in various capacities in iron foundries. Essentially I learned a bit about each specialty and contributed some useful work. Built some physical strength too!

Anyway, regarding casting wheels, the  web or spokes tend to cool faster than the more massive rim and hub. As the iron cools and becomes solid it shrinks. Shrinks quite a bit, maybe 1/4 inch per foot (something like that). The solid "front" , which is more or less conical, moves toward the more massive areas, if things are done right, and the still liquid material "feeds" into the front. This means that the hub and also the rim areas have to also be fed liquid iron. This, in turn, means "risers" - large openings in the cope, or upper part of the "flask" - the mould itself. These risers represent a cost, as they too solidify and can't be sold - they have to be re-introduced in the material flow through the process, eg thrown in the scrap pile. This is a fuel cost. They also have to be removed and the "gate", the area where they connected to the casting, has to be ground clean - a labor cost. Foundrymen try to minimize the number and size of risers for these reasons.

With a bit of visualization you can "see" how spokes are easier to cast that a thin web.

In an effort to spread out thermal stress that occurs after the phase change to solid, spokes are sometimes designed as curves.

This, however, is generally unnecessary if castings are allowed to cool slowly and season. We used to season castings - leave 'em outside in the weather, for a year. Yes, a year. The iron, which is really an alloy of carbon and iron, takes time to get used to being in a shape, so to speak.

I have looked at castings ever since those days, always with an eye to how they were made. Excepting the crankshaft itself (which I know nothing about making), there does not seem to be anything about a 6-1 that any decent local iron foundry in any American town of, say, 1930, couldn't make. We made an air compressor that was driven by an impulse turbine (which we also made) through a leather belt - the compressor was a twin and stood about 4 feet tall. It's there today (I think) - 13 Eureka Street, Sutter Creek CA
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on May 18, 2007, 06:34:25 PM
phadrus -
Thanks for the interesting post.  I assume you are talking about the Knight Foundry in Sutter Creek?  I don't know much about it (though I have visited the buildings).  There is a bit of it's history here (now outdated) http://crm.cr.nps.gov/archive/17-8/17-8-11.pdf

The Knight Foundry Corporation (http://www.knightfoundry.org/) recently reached an agreement with the City of Sutter Creek to buy the site.  The only reason I mention all this is that ~15 years ago, I happened to meet a guy at a party at a relative of a friend's house who had just bought the foundry.  I don't even remember the guys name, but he said that the pattern shop walls were covered with so many wooden casting patterns, that it seemed impossible to assess them all.  What they did was bring in some sort of video recorder (this is entirely a guess on my part, I've forgotten the details).  They had a laser set up in the middle of the building - the laser turned, the surface of all the walls was recorded in digital form, and the record of all the patterns was then assessed by computer to describe all the casting patterns hanging on the wall.

The other story he told was about the cupola furnace.  Apparently it was in great need of repair, but there was no funding.  Fortunetly, a semi truck happened down the street and happened to catch one of the guy wires steadying the cupola and chimney above the roof.  The damage caused by the truck was covered by insurance, allowing the cupola to be rebuilt.

I realize this doesn't have much to do with Listeroids, but it seems the foundry "could" make Listeroids, though it seems unlikely anytime soon.  Apparently, it is still the only water powered foundry in the US.  Lots of other cast parts for steam engines, locomotives, old cars, etc. have been made there in the recent past, and could be again.
Ray
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: phaedrus on May 18, 2007, 07:23:04 PM
I would have said "Knight Turbine", but I thought nobody'd know of the place. Yep, I know that cupola, the big one, we never used the little one when I was there. I have re-lined that damn thing with gunmix so many times, leaving my blood in the surface. A tough job.

Wendel B was the coremaker. Henry,. who was over 100 years old was the pattern maker. Dave was gone....

It's interesting what's happened there. Last time I visited Carl owned it and it was still a going business.

I love the recollections, and don't really want to change 'em - so I've stayed away. I don't want to see it the way it must be.

When I left I joined the Steelworkers and saw Fontana go under - after that a bit at a modern foundry in LA. Then I changed fields...
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rmchambers on May 19, 2007, 12:17:26 AM
I hate the idea of this kind of know-how going away.  The simple old ways of doing stuff aren't always improved upon by high technology.  I'm glad some of these places are preserved before the knowledge dies with the last guy doing the work.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Stan on May 19, 2007, 06:26:44 PM
Here's a biggy.  It's located in Juneau Alaska and it's got to be approx. 12+feet in diameter (measured by pacing).
Stan

(http://listerengine.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10021/normal_IMG_0908%20%28Medium%29.JPG)
Title: what about the ATUL engines?
Post by: sanchez on May 31, 2007, 03:36:35 PM
I have an offer of basant industries, the price is low, but I am not sure if decide by they, some one know the engines, what about the quality and any other comment.

Thanks guys.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on June 07, 2007, 04:35:56 PM
sanchez,
I can't offer any guidance specific to Basant Industries, however, based on lots of comments, you get what you pay for.  Most of these engines are all made by the same people, you are just dealing with a different marketer.  With some exceptions, few companies offer support if you find problems after receiving the engine.  That said, best of luck!
Ray
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: joe wvo on June 07, 2007, 07:34:40 PM
rpg,

You say that most of these engines are made by the same company....., do you know that for a fact or is it an assumption?  If you do know it as a fact, which company is doing the manufacturing?

Thanks

Joe wvoi

Quote from: rpg52 on June 07, 2007, 04:35:56 PM
sanchez,
I can't offer any guidance specific to Basant Industries, however, based on lots of comments, you get what you pay for.  Most of these engines are all made by the same people, you are just dealing with a different marketer.  With some exceptions, few companies offer support if you find problems after receiving the engine.  That said, best of luck!
Ray
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on June 30, 2007, 11:43:49 PM
Joe,
Kind of lost track of this thread for a while, maybe you have too?  Anyway, look on page 6 of this thread near the bottom, and on page 7 near the middle.  I really don't know anything anyone else who hasn't traveled to India knows - but these are pretty interesting first hand observations though.  Seems like listeroid manufacturing is kind of a cottage industry, based around Rajkot.  Many "manufacturers", mostly making the same kinds of products, to varying degrees of "standards".  There does seem to be a few manufacturers that make their own castings, but who they might be, I could only offer an opinion.  All subject to change, depending on unknown variables.  I'm mostly pleased with my Listeroid, others have differing opinions.  Mine happens to be a JKSON, rebranded by George of Utterpower as PS, for what that is worth.  Many of the importers have shied off with the coming EPA regulations.  Mike Montieth has been working hard certifying his particular Listeroid variant, and seems dedicated to continuing.  As always, costs are driving the market, exactly where is yet to be determined.
Ray
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on July 18, 2007, 11:37:44 PM
July '07

This is dated info, at least a year old (I'm speaking of the info I gathered).  I haven't been checking websites and updating the list.  This is a loooooong post, included are two earlier posts that talk about Listeroid engines in general and the part of India where they are made.
Ray
PS, had to do these in two separate posts - tooo long.

It seems like it would be useful to included the observations by OM in Nov., '06 about Listeroids.  Unfortunately he hasn't posted any more information lately.  Ray
 
OM:  "I just happened to go through this site today and have spent the last 3 hours reading the comments of various individuals regarding listeroids from India.
I am from India , no , I am not trying to sell any engines or spares , but know the full manufacturing process of these engines as my father ( who expired last year ) used to sell them to various countries in Africa.
I started my career in Nigeria selling these engines and got out of this business as I did not like what I was selling.
Let me tell you how these engines are made:
They are all made in a city called rajkot.
There is no other centre in India which makes these engines , if anyone tells you otherwise they are lying.
No engine manufacturer is a manufacturer of more than two or three parts out of the total parts required to make an engine.
It is a cottage industry , where each part ( leaving out a few critical parts ) is made by small manufacturers who supply them to the so called engine manufacturer.
The manufacturer will then hire people on daily wages basis to assemble the engines.
After the engine is assembled it is put on the test line to see that it is working properly.
Immediately after the test is over it is packed in wooden cases , this is the reason why you will always get oil in the crankcase which makes you feel that you are buying a used engine.
As far as casting pieces are concerned this problem will never go ( believe me I have tried ) as the manufacturer never bothers to machine them out and the exporter of these engines sitting in Bombay ( now Mumbai ) never sees what is being packed and exported.
You can get these engines made in any name as all you have to do is put the name on the crankcase cover ( which does not cost much ) and get plates printed in your name (minimum qty. of plates can be as low as 100pcs and again the cost is not much ).
Parts catalogues and instruction manuals can also be printed in your name , as there is only one printer who supplies everybody , all you have to do is to change the cover page and put your brand name.
The reason why I am letting everybody know all this is as follows :
Quality : you only get what you pay for ( pay peanuts and get monkeys )
Problems : have been , will be and will never go away as the people of this town do not understand what quality means , the few who do are not interested in exporting as their engines sell at better prices in India.
I hope I have put some light on this matter and it is of help to everybody and may help reduce their frustration regarding these engines from India.
I would also like to add that quality products are being exported from India and please do not judge the country by one product.
Once again believe me this not a sales pitch , but is being done without any malice towards anyone."

In India the listeroids are used primarily for drawing water.
The petteroids are used for drawing water , generators and in rural areas as an engine in a locally fabricated vehicle.
The parts made by good manufacturers are :
Fuel injection system by mico or motorpal
Pistons and piston rings by goetze , usha , india pistons or perfect circle ( but most manufacturers use locally made ones )
Crankshafts should be in en9 grade steel but most manufacturers use mild steel
Please let me know if you need names of manufacturers for any other parts.
I hope this is of help.
Regards
OM


Here is a interesting and useful quote from a thread started by Listerdiesel.  Placed here to prevent it from disappearing into the mire.

I've been reading most of the posts on the Indian engines, and have had some contacts over the years with Tom Mackay in Perth, Australia who imported the Metex engines for some years.

It seems to me that the expectations raised by the advertising of these engines are not realised when they eventually turn up. This is due to a variety of reasons, mostly poor quality machining, lack of inspection of finished parts and engines and just generally poor adaptation of what was originally a good and reliable design.

What seems to have happened, looking at the postings here, is that people are buying the engines based on a pretty hyped up advertising blurb and then when they receive their engine they feel let down

Costs of getting a genuine Lister or Petter engine are high, not so much on the actual purchasing, but on shipping and handling. It seems that it is easier and cheaper to buy a new Indian clone than it is to buy a secondhand Lister or Petter and ship it out from the UK. I picked up a couple of radiator cooled 6/1 Listers recently for £60 each, 'poorly handled' condition but complete down to radiators, air filters etc etc. That is how cheap they 'can' be, albeit internal condition unknown.

The Indian clones are part of a cottage industry almost, one that has many people all working to fulfil a small but interested market. It will never get to major figures in production terms as they simply don't have the machinery or technology to produce such stuff. People making parts in the street in India is quite a common sight. I was there in Delhi in 1980/81 for 13 weeks, and the crudeness of some of the manufacturing had to be seen to be believed, but they are all scratching a living, not riding round in big V8 pickups.

Dirt floors are the norm in most factories, machinery has been restricted by successive governments wanting to avoid importing costs and hard currency trade, so almost anything is picked up and kept going.

The secondhand machine tool trade from the UK to India and Pakistan is running at very high levels at present, anything from 1940's to 1960's machinery is bing bought and containerised out to these countries to go into their manufacturing industries. Most of this stuff is pretty clapped out when it leaves here, so you can imagine how it is when they get to use it. Similar trading goes on through Europe.

But, imagine receiving your first capstan lathe.....  making studs and suchlike on a machine rather than in a vice with a hacksaw and dies. Or your first milling machine, no more filing!  One of the places I was working with in delhi, made window frames. Two kids sat in the gutter outside with a big block of steel, a chisel and a BIG hammer. All they did all day long was to cut up lengths of steel strip for the frames. There was one drilling machine in the place and one welder. 20 or more people worked there, labour is cheap, machinery and the electricity to power them is expensive.

Most of these places will never compete in an open market with a serious engine maker. They have a small niche market and it will never get any better than that. The engines are in a kind of 1940's 'second universe' where they will not do anything to improve the mechanics of the things but occasionally they will increase bore and stroke sizes to uprate the power etc.

It would be nice to think that these guys would have a future in this business, but longer-term they will fall by the wayside as the requirements of modern-day practices will see that they cannot afford all the health & safety and other costs/requirements that have killed off most of the manufacturing in western countries. Unfortunately there are no more 'low-labour cost' countries left after China and India.

China will probably jump this stage completely, they know where they are going with technology and will not get into this closed loop, other than a few small outfits who will operate like the Indians have.

Kirloskar started all this in the 1950's, and here we are 50 years on with essentially the same products. 'Nuff said.

Peter

Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: rpg52 on July 18, 2007, 11:38:28 PM
July ’06 iteration, includes the Windsor and the “mini-listers” of the Topland group.
I have gone to the various manufacturer’s websites and assembled the following from their information.  Some provide a lot of useful information, one provided a table of numbers with no labels as to what the numbers meant!  None of them talk about sand in the sump.  Some mention balance.  It seems that the bore and stroke imply the degree of standardization between engines, which I thought might be useful.  A few use the same piston and con rod in all their engines, others only vary the piston.  A few change both.  The dimensions of the foundation bolts, which may not be particularly useful in itself, would tend to indicate whether a different casting is used for the base.
 “Standard”:  114.3 piston, 139.7 con rod.  Con rods go from 130 to 177.8.  Other common pistons are 120, 127 and 130.  Materials are mostly iron, few aluminum.  330x330 mm foundation bolt for 1 cyl., 381x559 for 2 cyl., some variation.  5/1, 6/1 and 8/1 are often the same engine, only with an increase in rpm from 600, 650 to 850 (and likely with smaller diameter, heavier flywheels).
Other observations:  14/1 and 16/1 are most often made from odd sized or “non-standard” pistons or con rods.  Oil capacities are not given for many of the engines, but the Kirloskar capacities are about half that of other manufacturer’s for the 6/1 & 8/1.  The Hindustan Trading Co. “Mini-Listers” appear to be a considerably different design than that offered by others, (also offered by Topland).  The piston sizes are “standard” but the con rod and foundation bolt patterns are different than any other engines.  Direct Injection implies a different head design than “standard”, and may have an aluminum piston. 

Ammerajkot          http://www.ameerrajkot.com
H.P./Cyl.             5/1   6/1       8/1    10/1      12/1   14/1   14/1
Bore in MM          114.3      114.3   120    127   139.7 130
Stroke in MM          139.7      139.7   139.7   139.7   152.4 147
Speed RPM          600 650       850   1000       650 1000
Compression Ratio          1:18      
Lub. Oil Capacity (Lit.)       4.5               5.0
Foundation Bolt Spacing in MM    330 x 330       
Fuel Tank Capacity (Lit.)       14.0      
The 14/1’s are two versions, one with larger piston & longer stroke but lower speed, the other with smaller piston, shorter stroke but higher speed.  The 14/1’s use unusual piston and con rod’s.  I wonder if there was a typo in their spec. sheet – why would they use a piston exactly the same size as a standard con rod?

Ampro Exports      http://www.amproexports.com/lister-diesel-engines.html
H.P./ Cyl     6/1    8/1    10/1    12/1    14/1    16/1    12/2    16/2    20/2
RPM       650    850    1000    1000    850    850    650    850    1000
Bore       114.3   114.3   120   127   152.4   152.4   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke       139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   177.8   177.8   139.7   139.7   139.7
Bolt spacing   330 x 330            14, 16=356 x 356      2 cyl. = 381 x 559
Fuel Cap.(Lit.)   8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Lub. Oil Cap.   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5   7.5   13
These all use the same con rod, except the 14/1 and 16/1.  Piston size and rpm varies.  Ampro uses the unusual 152.4x177.8 piston & con rod in their 14/1 and 16/1 – these engines also have an unusual size of foundation bolt pattern.  They offer what appear to be direct injection engines (“New Variety”), similar to (or the same?) as Satyajeet GM-90 in 6, 8, 10, & 12/1 models.  Check out their toilets (water closets)!
   

Aswamegh      http://www.indiamart.com/ashwamegh/#diesel-engine
H.P./Cyl      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   12/2   14/1   15/1   16/2   20/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1050   1000   650   1000   1000   850   1050   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   130   130   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   146.05   139.7   139.7   145   160   139.7   139.7
Compression ratio:  18:1, except 14/1 and 15/1 which are 16.5:1.  They are Direct Injection engines.
All 2 cylinders have bush main bearings and oil pump, can be ordered with taper roller bearing.  6/1 and 8/1 are splash only, but can be ordered with oil pump.  Same piston except 14/1, 16/1 and 20/2.  Con rod the same except 12/1, 15/1 & 16/2.

Atul Group   http://www.atulgroup.com
HP   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   650   850   1000   1000
Bore   114   120   120   127
Stroke   139.6   139.6   139.6   139.6
All use the same con rod, but it is 0.1mm shorter than the standard.  Is it really different or not?

Crossword Agro Industries   http://www.crosswordagro.com/english/ssde.htm
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   12/2   16/1   12/2   16/2
See Nissan engines below.   

Field Marshall http://www.fieldmarshal.com
Model      FMS6   FMS8   FMS10   PMV   FM11   FM111   FMIV
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   6/1   8/1   9.5/1   10/1
RPM      660   850   1000   660   850   950   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120   120
Stroke      130   130   130   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   16:1         17:1
Somewhat unique rpm rating for 6/1, shorter con rod for 6, 8, 10/1 – are these the same as the direct injected engines offered by Satyajeet?  They share the unique con rod length.   Other 6, 8/1’s seem “standard”. 

Gangadhar Industries  http://www.gangadhar.net/diesel_engines5.html
Model #   01   01B   01M   02   02B   02M   08   08A   08M
HP/Cyl   6/1   6/1   6/1   8/1   8/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1
RPM   650   650   650   850   850   850   1000   1000   1000
Bore   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   120   120   120
Stroke   139.7   139.7   130   139.7   139.7   130   139.7   139.7   130
All indirect injection w/iron piston except 08A with direct injection and Al piston.  All the 10/1’s and the “B” models have oil pumps.  The “B” models have bushing bearings, others with TRB’s.  The 10/1 “A” and “M” models have crankshaft balance weights.    No other information on foundations or compression.  All the 6 and 8 hp have standard piston, one with shorter con rod.  10 hp have larger piston, one with shorter con rod.  Most have “ISI” but do not define the term.  The company also manufacture gen sets, welders, pumps and other equipment. 

GG Auto Gears   http://www.ggautomotive.com/lg_04.htm   
No information on website about engines.

GTC Engines   http://www.geco-trade.com/default.asp
H.P./Cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2
RPM   650   850   1000   650   850
Bore   114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Fuel tank   11   11   11   15   15
Compression  18:1
Same piston and con rod except piston for the 10/1.

Hindustan Trading Corporation    Liberty Diesel Engines   http://www.htcorporation.com/      
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1LOP   10/1 CBW   12/1   14/1      
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000      850   900
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   120      127   127
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7      139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1                     Direct Injected
Bolt spacing   330x330
6/1, 8/1, 10/1 are splash lubricated, others have oil pumps.  Bushing or TRB bearings available. 14/1 is Direct Injected.  Two cylinder engines are said to be available, but the webpage is not present.

Hindustan Trading Co. “Mini-Listers”
HP/Cyl      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   14/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127
Stroke      133.3   133.3   133.3   133.3   133.3
Bolt space   305x204
Mini-Listers have different characteristics:  All have TRB’s.  6/ and 8/1 are splash lubricated, others have oil pump.  All have shorter stroke than “standard” listeroid.  10/1 may have Direct Injection, 14/1 is only available with Direct Injection.
All have a different foundation bolt pattern than the “standard” Listeroid.  They are also lighter than the “standard”.     

Hrishi Exports   http://www.hrishiexports.com/slow.html
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   14/1   12/2   16/2   20/2         
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Found. Bolt Space    330x330            381x559   
Fuel tank      8   8   10   10   12   12   12   12
Oil Capacity   5   5   5   5   5   7.5   7.5   7.5
All use the same con rod, only piston size varies.

http://www.indiamart.com/basantindustries/
http://www.indiamart.com/indiacasting/#diesel-engines
http://www.indiamart.com/doneria/
http://www.rishabhengineering.com/diesel-engines.html#lister-diesel-engines
These providers (manufacturers’?) provide almost no information about their engines except hp (sometimes).

JK Group of Industries  JKSON engines      http://www.jksonengines.com/ltde.htm   
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
Bush and TRB bearings available.  Oil pumps available.  Also rebranded as Power Solution (PS) by George of Utterpower and Joel.  PETTER / KIRLOSKAR engines also available.  Same con rod, two piston sizes.

Kirloskar      http://kirloskarapps.kirloskar.com/kirloskar/web/13$5010.html
Model      KS6   KS8   KS12   KS16
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   12/2   16/2
RPM      650   850   650   850
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Fuel tank      11 lit.   11 lit.   15 lit   15 lit.
Compression   18:1
All engines are Direct Injection.  Petter-type engines are also available.  Guaranteed for 12 months against defects.
Oil cap. of 6/1 & 8/1 is 2.6 lit., smaller than “standard”.  Oil cap. of others 5.7 lit.  Same piston and con rod in all.
   

Kissan Iron     http://www.kissangroup.com/kissan_iron_works/product/lister_type.htm
Model   KIW-   10   1   2   7A   8   4   7   7FE   7DI    7DIH   
HP/cyl.      5/1   6/1   8/1   8/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   10/1
RPM      600   650   850   950   900   1000   1000   1000   1000   1000   
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   120   120   120   120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   132   139.7   139.7
Found bolt space   330X330                     305X200   330X330   330X330
Fuel tank cap.   9   

Model   KIW-   12   12FE   14D.I.   
HP/cyl.      12/1   12/1   14/1
RPM      1000   1000   1000
Bore      127   127   127
Stroke      139.7   132   139.7
Found bolt space   330x330   305x200   330x330   
Fuel tank cap.   12   12   12
It appears that the DI models are direct injection and likely have aluminum pistons.  Heavy flywheels are available for some models, as are water pumps.  Smaller engines are splash lubricated, larger likely have pumps but it is unclear.   All use the same con rod, except one 12/1.    Two versions of 8/1, one with smaller piston & higher speed, one with larger piston and lower speed.  5 versions of 10/1, some with direct injection, one with smaller con rod.   All the same size base casting size except KE models of 10/1 and 12/1.

Lovson   http://www.lovson.com/lister-type-slow-speed-diesel-engines.html
Model      SL-6   SL-8   SL-10    SLC10   SLC10   SLC12
            /SLC   Tiger   Sumo   Sumo
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   900   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   127   127
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   16:1   16:1   17:1   17:1   17:1   17:1
Oil cap.      5 lit.
Found. Bolt space   330x330
Generally TRB main bearings, but bushing with oil pump is available.  All use same con rod.

Metro/Metrex   http://www.metroexporters.com/pages/index.html
Model      ME-6   ME-8   ME-10   ME-12   ME-16   ME-20
HP/cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1050
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
All use the same piston and con rod, only rpm varies.

Mascot Enterprises   http://products.jimtrade.com/product_details.asp?ProductId=26396&SupplierId=92729
No information other than a generic “Lister” picture.

Nissan   Crossword Agro Industries   http://www.crosswordagro.com
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1   16/1   12/2   16/2
The 12/1 is called a “Mini-Lister”, looks different from the “standard” lister types.  No spec. available.

Power Anand   http://www.poweranand.com/diesel_engine.htm
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1LOP   10/1CBW   12/1   12/2   16/2   20/2   24/2
RPM      650   850   1000   1000   1000   650   850   1000   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   120   130   114.3   114.3   120   130
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Compression   18:1
Fuel tank      8               13
Oil cap.      5               10
Found. Bolt space    330x330               560x382
The two 10/1’s have identical spec. but different model #’s.  All use the same con rod, two piston sizes.

Prakash/Fuking   http://www.prakash-india.com
Model      PL1   PL2   PL4   PL5
HP/Cyl.      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/1
RPM      650   850   1000   1000
Bore      120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Direct or Indirect Injection.   Same pistons and con rods.


Satyajeet   http://www.satyajeet.com/de2.htm      GM-90 direct injection engines w/aluminum pistons
Model      GM90/6   GM90/8   GM90/10   GM90/10   GM90/12   GM90/10   GM90/14
               Super      Sendo
RPM      750   900   1000   950   1050   800   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   127   127   130   130
Stroke      130   130   130   130   130   146.5   146.5
Compression   17.5:1
Oil cap.      4.25
Found. Bolt space.   260x260      
Lub. Splash plus oil pumps.  Balance weights on crankshaft.  Most use a similar (but shorter) con rod than “standard” The two different con rods are unique too.  These engines have relatively the smallest foundation bolt spacing, except for “mini-Lister” of Hindustan Trading Corporation.

Sterling Agra   http://www.sterlingagra.com
The spec. and descriptions appear identical to Kissan Iron, found above.

Topland Group of Companies   http://www.topland-india.com/products/engine/htm/engine_1.htm
Model      10A1   10A   10B   12A   12B   12ADI   14A
HP/cyl      5/1   6/1   6/1   8/1   8/1   8/1   9.5/1
Bore      114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3   114.3
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
RPM      600   650   650   850   850   850   1000

Model      19A   15A   15A1   15B   16A   16A1   16ASD   16ADI   16ASDI
HP/cyl      10/1   10/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   10/1
Bore      120   120   120   120   120   120   120   120   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
RPM      1000   1000   900   1000   1000   900   1000   1000   1000

Model      11A   11A1   17A   28A   28A1   29ADI   29ADI1   30ADI   30ADI1   
HP/Cyl      12/1   10/1   12/1   10/1   14/1   10/1   15/1   16/1   10/1
Bore      127   127   127   127   127   127   127   130   130
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   160   160   160   160   160
RPM      1000   900   1000   900   900   1000   900   1000   900

Model      18ADI   18ADI2   20A   21A   22A   23A, 24A, 25A, 25ADI, 26A, 26AI, 27ADI, 27ADI1
HP/Cyl      18/1   20/1   12/2   16/2   20/2   “Mini-listers”, all 1 cyl, 130mm stroke, 114.3, 120.
Bore      155   155   114.3   114.3   114.3   127mm bores, 6,8,10,12,14 hp, 650-1000 rpm.
Stroke      177.8   177.8   139.7   139.7   139.7   1st three indirect injection, all others direct.
RPM      750   825   650   850   1000
36(!) different models, obviously from a wide range of  manufacturers.  Fourteen different 10/1’s!  First group has “standard” bore and stroke.  Second group has “semi-standard” bore of 120 mm and standard con rod.  They have a bewildering array of options, including SDM or Super Deluxe Model.  Curiously, the 18/1 and 20/1 do not have an oil pump, though many of the others do.  The two cylinders are all standard bore and stroke.  They also have high speed (1500 rpm) water cooled diesels from 3 to 45 hp and high speed air cooled from 3 to 20 hp.  Some engines are designed for marine use.  Also have gen sets, alternators, & pumps.  They say they are India’s largest manufacturer of engines and pumps.   


Vibha   http://www.vibha.com/diesel.html
Model      6/1   8/1   10/1   12/2   16/2   20/2
RPM      650   850   1000   650   850   1000
Bore      114.3   114.3   120   114.3   114.3   120
Stroke      139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
All use the same con rod, but two piston sizes.


Vidhata   http://www.vidhataindia.com
Model   VL5   VL6   VL7   VL8   VL9
HP/cyl.   6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   12/1
RPM   650   850   950   1000   850
Bore   114.3   120   120   120   127
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7
Same con rod, only piston varies.

Windsor Exports   http://www.agroengine.com/diesel1.htm#water
HP/Cyl   6/1   8/1   10/1   10/1   12/1   12/1   14/1   16/1   20/1
RPM   560   850   1000   1050   1000   650   900   850   1050
Bore    114.3   114.3   120   114.3   127   114.3   139.7   114.3   114.3
Stroke   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   139.7   152.4   139.7   139.7

The 6 and 8 HP are splash lubed, the rest have pumps.  All have 139.7 con rods, except the 14 HP.  The 14 HP has the unusual piston size of 139.7, the same as the  con rod in all the others.  Ammerajkot has this same combination of a 139.7 piston and 152.4 con rod in their 14/1, but rotates at 650 rpm instead of 900.  RPM and piston size varies considerably, but many have the “standard” 114.3 mm piston.  They also have Petteroids.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: dieseldave on October 13, 2007, 04:44:58 AM
HI!  I'm new to this site. This seems to be the best site going for Listeroid info! I caught the Lister virus about six weeks ago. I came across a thread on a site where a Lister is being used to generate power and also heat a house using WVO.

I have ordered a LG90 14/1 from Lovson. Should arrive in about 5 to 6 weeks time.

Lovson claims to do the following with thier engines:
    _we put all the partsthrough an acid wash,to clean the sand and other impurities.
    _our castings are graded,you wont find any holes on the body or the flywheels
    _we use steel gears,tappets are provided with"lapping"finish
    _every engine is tested with new oil

   In addition to this ,the LG or Little Giant engines have a counter balanced crankshaft and balanced flywheels. Direct injection/aluminum piston.  Unit comes with oil pump.

   After reading about the "sand issues" in various threads,I will have to wait and see. Hopefully,they are taking corrective action on the SAND issue.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Doug on October 14, 2007, 12:41:53 AM
I have found another engine manufactured by KOEL and sold in North America as the KA-27

No pictures, no info other than a 78mm bore and 86 mm stroke. The engine data I have is from a generic service manual for small diesel engines printed in 1994. KOEL would apear to have a had a North American distributor.

Anyone have an info inthe KA - 27?

Doug
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: lowspeedlife on January 06, 2008, 04:49:05 PM
Does anyone know who makes the "Omega" engines sold by Kwic industries? i want to order some spares & it would be nice to get the right parts on the first try!  thanks, scott r.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Doug on January 06, 2008, 05:25:10 PM
I can;t say but if you ask Pat from Altopro he may be able to help.
I think he has bought an engine or two from them ( from whom ever made Omega ) or he may be able to tell you where to get parts or he may even have some. Yous need to ask I guess....
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: lowspeedlife on January 06, 2008, 06:30:19 PM
thanks doug, i will. scottr.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Doug on January 06, 2008, 10:54:33 PM
I just emailed Pat on your behalf hopefuly he will respond to you here soon

Doug
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: altopro on January 07, 2008, 02:00:21 AM
For what engine do you need parts?

PAT
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: outlaw06 on February 19, 2008, 03:01:31 PM
I am new to the forum, all seems very intersting.   I have a farm and  need backup power for my wells and geothermal system.  A few questions...   Could I hook the cooling system on a lister to my in floor heat and regulate the temp with some sort of control?

 I would like to make electricity and heat the house concurrently, the heat mass  in the floor will hold the heat while I don't need the electricity, (at night or during mid-day)  My wells are 1 and -1 1/2 horse and 220.  I have a  6kw portable gen set with a B&S  engine, i would like to convert to a lister using the 6HP motor,  to run my house.  I also have a 15 KW and a 30 KW PTO gen set.  I beleive a 25 HP  lister engine would run those, as my 30 HP  New Holland tractor  does. 

Are these things  possible, and more importantly, do any of you have experience doing them?  Running a PTO generator off a tractor here in Iowa can get  mighty expensive. So aI am looking at a lister!   

For the final part of the question, is there any  manufacturer that you all have had  particularly good or poor luck with.  I have been in contact with Vijjay, they manufacture Ashwengha....   Can I rely on them for shipping and sending an engine or should I go through an importer?   I am willing to pay a little more to get rid of the hassles, but am not oppposed to going direct if the reliability is generally good.

Last  but not least, would you all recommend multiple listers, say 6 hp, running smaller gen sets wired for separate circuits or a larger gen set. 

Thanks for your help.  I continue to enjoy reading the forum.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Stan on February 19, 2008, 03:13:28 PM
Welcome "out..."

Go small, cut back on your needs.  Size matters in some things  ;D  but for generators, smaller and simpler is better.
Stan
btw...got a first name?
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: dpollo on February 19, 2008, 03:51:13 PM
outlaw:    You have evidently run several different units for back up power. Your 6 kw Briggs may be a good place to start figuring. What you have to decide is how much power you are likely to need at any given time. The 6kw unit will run your wells and some lighting but have you test run it to see if it will handle motor starts where the inrush current for starting can be many times the running current.

What I have done is apply the backup power to essential circuits .... like the workshop, furnace, well pump, freezers and some lighting. I do not try to heat water electrically, but do run an in floor heating setup  (3kw) on an as-needed basis.

 I can do this easily with a gasoline powered "NorthStar" unit  and my Lister  (15 hp)  with a 5 kw Kato handles these loads and more without protest. The only time it balked was  while running a 5kw load and would not then start an air compressor. Shed some load and it handled it well.  PTO systems are great for portability and emergencies but think of the waste heat that tractor engine is shedding.  Do some load testing with what you have and then you will be able to make a good choice .
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: matt on February 20, 2008, 04:17:06 AM
Hi Outlaw and Welcome!!

Check out this website.....

http://www.powercubes.com/listers.html

This guy has done a huge amount with his lister for home heating and power generation with a nice ST Generator head. 
And he does it all whilst using Wast Vege Oil for the Lister's fuel!!!

A real "pioneer" of sorts.

As regards the engine brand...if you live in the US and enjoy DIY, then I would reccomend buying a kit engine from George and Joel.

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=110225297478&ssPageName=MERC_VIC_RSCC_Pr4_PcY_BIN_Stores_IT&refitem=110214166891&itemcount=4&refwidgetloc=closed_view_item&usedrule1=StoreCatToStoreCat&refwidgettype=cross_promot_widget&_trksid=p284.m183&_trkparms=algo%3DDR%26its%3DS%252BI%252BSS%26itu%3DISS%252BUCI%252BSI%26otn%3D4

They supply the JKson 6/1 in semi knock down form. The advantages here is that the JKson crankcase etc. is as near identical to the original Listers as you might get from India. Also, because they are only partly assembled, they have not been test run - so any sand remaining inside has not had a chance to cause headaches. I have heared they give great support too.

In case you didn't know, George is one of the main discoverers of the Indian Listeroids we are just so crazy about here. He runs the famous utterpower.com website.

Buy the CD off the utterpower website, study it, and then think about purchasing.

I have no commercial arrangement with them, other than buying the CD ROM and being very satisfied with the information therein.

Happy investigating!!!


regards,
Matt

(modified to include JKson comment)
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: centralmainediesel on June 04, 2008, 08:11:15 PM
We, at Central Maine Diesel, just imported three separate engines from Topland Enterprizes of India. The salesman is very agressive and hardworking. We are impressed with the quality of the engines, though have not tried each out as yet. We have a single, double and an awesome looking triple!! We have set up the single and it runs smoothly(for a Lister!!), and has a great sound, sort of like a Harley at idle. In touch with the salesman, he has indicated they are willing to make any changes to any of their models to suit our liking. So far...we like everything, including the support. We will offer these on our website www.generatorsales.com in the future and only after significant testing. We have been happy with the quality of the Anand engines and Atul has been especially supportive. Does anyone have any response, positive or otherwise with regards to dealings with Topland and/or have you one of their engines in use? Is this something others may be interested in?....Thanks, Phil Pepin
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Craig on June 06, 2008, 04:01:15 PM
You say that you have a single and a double, what HP are they?  Will you continue to carry the Anand engines or will you switch completely over to Topland if your testing goes well?

Thanks
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Doug on June 08, 2008, 07:52:47 PM
Troble with Topland is they don't make a lot of their engines so its hard for them to realty have consistant QC
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: centralmainediesel on June 11, 2008, 05:01:22 PM
At Central Maine Diesel, we have had good luck and great backing from Anand with regards to their engines. The quality is there and they obviously take great pride in what they do. I could not ask for more support from a vendor. Atul has been the best and answered my many questions and has worked with several of our customers on setup. We brought in the 16hp single and the 30hp double (as well as an awesome looking/sounding triple!) from Topland to compare quality issues, see what type of support we would get for our customers and wanted to make sure that we were able to provide engines on a consistant basis should something happen to change down the road with our current supplier. We are in this for the long haul and are committed to providing parts, engines and support to anyone who buys from us.
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: ronmar on June 12, 2008, 01:31:16 AM
Quote from: outlaw06 on February 19, 2008, 03:01:31 PM
I am new to the forum, all seems very intersting.   I have a farm and  need backup power for my wells and geothermal system.  A few questions...   Could I hook the cooling system on a lister to my in floor heat and regulate the temp with some sort of control?

Yes, you can.  I have a 6/1 with a brazed flat plate heat exchanger on the cooling system.  This cuts my antifreeze needs down drastically as I only have about 2 gallons of coolant in the primary side of the system, including what is in the expansion tank.  The free flowing brazed plate heatex still allows this very small(for a lister) coolant volume in the primary side to thermosiphon.  I use a small taco pump to circulate water thru the secondary side of the heatex.  On the output of the secondary side of the heatexchanger, I have a small thermostat from a mercury mariner outboard engine.  This is a 120F thermostat which maintains the output on the secondary side near that 120F.  You are only going to get about 17,000 BTU/HR out of a 6/1 at full load(around 3KW of electric power). 

Quote from: outlaw06 on February 19, 2008, 03:01:31 PM
I would like to make electricity and heat the house concurrently, the heat mass  in the floor will hold the heat while I don't need the electricity, (at night or during mid-day)  My wells are 1 and -1 1/2 horse and 220.  I have a  6kw portable gen set with a B&S  engine
 

Will your 6HP B&S run those wells?  That sounds lke a pretty large pump for a 3-4KW generator. EDIT:  Oops, I read 6HP instead of 6KW, thanks Oliver90.  A 6KW/12HP set would probably be large enough.    The biggest trick would be getting from the rated engine RPM to PTO RPM to run one of your PTO sets.  The 6/1-12/2 engines  runs at 650 RPM, the 8/1-16/2's run at 800+  and the 10/1 and 20/2 engines run at around 1000 RPM to get their rated HP if I recall correctly?.  Reducing their RPM reduces their HP output, so a 12/2 reduced to 540 RPM would probably be a little over 10HP.  you will probably need some form of gearbox to get a 540 RPM output from their rated power output RPM. Since the PTO sets already have a gearbox, that is starting to get complicated.  It would probably be cheaper to just add another 1800 RPM gen head and make a standalone set with a 12/2(6KW) or 20/2(10KW).  You could offset some of this cost by selling your 30KW PTO generator as you don't have enought tractor HP to make use of it's full potential.  As for HP, the rule of thumb for sustainable electrical power generation is 2HP per KW, so a 25HP lister should be able to sustain a 12.5KW electrical load, just as your 30Hp tractor can sustain a 15KW electrical load.   

I went the "kit" engine route from George and Joel and am very happy with the result.  I also reccomend Georges CD as it has a lot of information in one easy place.

Good Luck

Ron  
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Petersbpus on June 23, 2008, 07:25:25 PM
My Metro is really a Field Marshal, at least the case and crank shaft are.
Now that I removed all the outside paint and strange putty under it, you can plainly see where they ground off the embossed Field Marshal and left the 6HP.
Then covered it in putty that smelled like rancid grease and talc mix. ick.
The crank shaft has Field Marshal cast right in the side.
I knew Metro was only a reseller of many different products. Who knows who put the parts together.
At least it gives me some ideas of "What to call the Beast" when it's up and running?? Metro didn't invoke any exotic names.
What do you all think of Field Marshal brand??
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Doug on June 24, 2008, 04:03:33 AM
All you know is you have casting and a crank that said Fieled Marshall.

You may have rejects that were sold and built into an engine or extra casting done for them resold to another builder for Metro.
You may infact have a Field Marshall.

No way to tell.....

I have pictures of the topland logo on casting from another engine builder as an example, no explaination was ever clearly given as to why.
Rajkot engine companies are hard to follow.

I have a crank in my petteroid that says DM10
My engine was made by PEC ( Anand Powerline ).
Just because my crank says DM10 I can't assume its KOEL that built the crank or the engine or anything
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: horsefly76 on June 29, 2008, 10:53:23 AM
Quote from: outlaw06 on February 19, 2008, 03:01:31 PM


 

Are these things  possible, and more importantly, do any of you have experience doing them?  Running a PTO generator off a tractor here in Iowa can get  mighty expensive. So aI am looking at a lister!

 





Welcome Outlaw!

What part of Iowa? I grew up/lived in Waterloo till 3 1/2 years ago I moved to Arizona. I have a 6/1 Metro
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: the_postman on November 26, 2009, 06:42:19 PM
Hi,

I received two 6/1's with the markings MK Engineers on the outside of the crate.  Is that the manufacturer?  Anybody know anything about them???

Thanks!

eric
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Doug on November 27, 2009, 01:46:40 AM
Send them back Eric those are clearly not your initials
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: dieselgman on December 01, 2009, 03:38:26 PM
MK Engineers is an exporter and point of contact for many supposed "Brands" in India. They generally do a fine job of weeding out substandard stuff but beware too many assumptions and notions of the word "manufacturer". Cottage Industry in India is the method of production for all the Lister clone engines and their networks are an amazing study - but responsibility is not generally held (nor is it accepted) by any one entity. The best you can hope for is a reasonable assembler who can provide consistent results. These are generally NOT the exporters or companies you will be dealing with as an outsider. We have struggled with several over time to get transparency and accurate information and also have traveled there in person to set up relationships. The Indian business model we are dealing with does not necessarily include the Western values of integrity and honesty, I hate to say it. The best we have been able to do is factor in a lot of spare parts for our own warranty service and hammer away at the problems as they arise. These machines still offer a huge value and simply need to be doctored a bit to come up to Western standards.

Gary - Diesel Electric
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Doug on December 01, 2009, 08:38:33 PM
Point of contension Gary:

There is nothing Cottage about some of the companies you are refering too.
Fieldmarshal is quite large for example and KOEL is large enough to have joint ventures with Toyota, Duetz, Petter, and has even managed to contain and start to push CAT out of the Indian market for industrial engines.

Ya man KOEL is so non Cottage they have been here in the North American market since the 70s. Why you guys never tried to import some of their engines ( listeroids and Petteroids ) is hard to understand I managed to get them to talk to me abou the HA series and FL912.....
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Amarbir[India] on May 30, 2010, 07:29:16 PM
Sir ,
    Guys how many of you have a field marshal .according To Me They are the largest guys for lister
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: billdrilling on April 14, 2011, 05:50:19 AM
I have never joined a forum of any kind before but I was wondering if any of you have ever heard of the "Dev" brand. The build all kinds of engine parts and he says he builds complete CS engines. Long story short,6/1's dropped in Vancouver for 700 ea. I took a chance and he says they are ready to ship and he has been keeping me upddated,guess we'll see. Thanks,Bill
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: dieselgman on July 13, 2011, 07:09:55 PM
We now have a handful of the KOEL (Kirloskar) brand available... will resell, but this may well be the one and only batch we can get in the USA. These are near 20 years old - have been in temperature controlled storage for all this time.

dieselgman
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: dieselgman on July 13, 2011, 07:16:34 PM
And, by the way, being a huge conglomerate (KOEL) does not mean they make all their own parts or do not participate in the cottage industry I described to source same.

I believe they will operate just like Lister/Petter, and never tell! Trade secrets and all that! This is what I am told by some of the insiders in India. It is all about making the quick $.

dieselgman
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: mikern on July 14, 2011, 05:29:19 AM
Amabir, my first listeroid is a Field Marshall 6/1, I also have a Metro 6/1 (for standby), the FM has given me great service. Mike
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: bigbad on August 19, 2021, 12:19:00 PM
The last addition here was 2011  Many of the links posted here are dead.  Is this engine going the way of the dodo bird?
Title: Re: The Brand Roundup
Post by: Hugh Conway on August 19, 2021, 06:48:07 PM
Welcome bigbad.
This is certainly an old thread!
Resurrection.
We are all ageing out.......demand for and interest in  the engines seems to be doing same.
I'm still operating a listeroid 6/1 regularly (2500 hours on it now) for off-grid winter battery charging and a Dursley 6/1 for times when I need extra shop power.
Also other things seem to be commanding much more time and attention in these strange days.....it is reassuring to have 2 reliable engines turning PMGs and about 1000 lts of fuel on hand.
Cheers
Hugh