Author Topic: Roid Bearing Quality?  (Read 776 times)

Willw

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Re: Roid Bearing Quality?
« Reply #15 on: August 23, 2019, 02:50:17 PM »
38AC: Thank you for sharing your knowledge; I didn't know that.
Daily driver '97 GMC W4 tipper on WVO/Kerosene mix.
6/1 clone standby generator.
Too many projects.

StrawHat

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Re: Roid Bearing Quality?
« Reply #16 on: August 24, 2019, 04:08:11 AM »
One trick I've used a few times on gearboxes, etc. is to find a metric bearing that is very close to the imperial size. Slightly over on the cup, and slightly under on the shaft bore of the cone. Mount the cup up on an arbor, set up in a cylindrical grinder and take the OD down to the needed imperial size. For the cone use ID grinding to open up the shaft bore to the imperial size. Ceramic turning tools can also be used in both OD and ID situations as long as the race doesn't have a lube hole in it. In other words, convert a metric bearing to an imperial sized bearing. Only works in a few select cases though where close sized metric bearings can be obtained, otherwise the races get too thin. Never alter the actual bearing rolling surfaces though.

In the old days when a bearing wore out, you'd just melt out the old babbit and re-pour new babbit. Usually the shaft served as part of the mold, so after some light clean up work the bearing was ready to go again with no machining. Light scraping was the most that was ever needed. Excellent for rough in the field repairs.

Didn't some of the old CS engines use babbit?

glort

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Re: Roid Bearing Quality?
« Reply #17 on: August 24, 2019, 08:16:03 AM »
Yes I still have the skills to do this sort of work, trouble is I no longer have the eyesight to read the instruments, guess we will have to hope it works out OK.

I hear you there mate!

I only went for an eye test about march and I need only the smallest correction but my focus range has gone and close up stuff just frustrates the hell out of me. I have been mucking round with electronic stuff a bit lately and wondering what the hell possessed me to get into this now when it's all getting to tiny Surface mount components and I can't see the standard size ones anyway! Man has to be an idiot!

Was in bunnings the other day buying some tools under the excuse of Pulling out the Kitchen for the new one the Mrs wants. I found one of these LED head lamp things.  My Drill has an LED on it and it's very handy for seeing in places like Cupboards But I'm alwys wanting to hold the drill  right where it shades the light.  The headlamp thing was only $10 and looked reasonable so I thought I'd give it a go.

Best $10 spent in a while!  Having good light makes things so much easier to see and this thing makes the job SO much easier.  I was soLdering up a voltage regulator this morning and put it on and it helped a lot. I don't even mind the Jibes of My Mrs and Daughter asking me if I got a new Job as a coal Miner, the thing is very helpful and makes things much easier.

Now I just need some of those Glasses with the Built in Magnifying Loupes. I dug some of my old photo Loupes Out and they have been handy for seeing what I had no chance of before but something a bit more convenient  and hands free would be good.

I was looking on fleabay last Night and bought a couple of Different headlamps  that hopefully are more powerful than the one I got. Should be seeing they take 18650 Batteries instead of AAA's.  Might still do a build my own Job and put a small LED Light bar on a hard hat with a belt pack battery.
I can Imaginer the Coal miner Jibes I'd get of the rude women then!
 >:(

ajaffa1

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Re: Roid Bearing Quality?
« Reply #18 on: August 24, 2019, 10:01:45 AM »
Hi Strawhat, grinding bearing races to fit an unusual or no longer available bearing size is very good advice provided you have access to a grinder and you keep the coolant flowing, wouldn`t want to alter the hardening/tempering with excess heat. Sadly I do not own a grinding machine. Many years ago I did have a lathe with a grinding attachment that would have been perfect for this situation. I tried not to use it too often as I was concerned about the amount of abrasive dust it deposited on the lathe sliding surfaces.

Yes, a lot of Lister engines have babbit filled bearings. I have only had to pour a new babbit bearing once on a very old saw milling machine, The trick is to coat the shaft with carbon from an oxy/acetylene torch with the oxygen turned off, once the shaft is well coated with soot, turn on the oxygen and warm up the bearing/bush housing, now pour your babbit. The soot will prevent it from sticking to the shaft.

Hi Glort, I have used head warn lamps a lot in the past and they are an excellent addition to any tool box, I used to keep a rechargeable LED set in the glove box of my UTE, when I got a flat tire at night it was invaluable. I have also used the cheap plastic safety glasses with the bifocal magnifying lens at the bottom. If I remember rightly, they come in five different strengths depending on how bad your eyes are, I guess I would need a number 5 now!  :laugh:

Bob

StrawHat

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Re: Roid Bearing Quality?
« Reply #19 on: August 25, 2019, 06:35:45 AM »
I'll bet some of those babbit Lister engines were the ones that have been reported to have lasted 40 years without serious internal maintenance.

Pretty much the entire steam engine era ran on babbit up to the early 1900's. Then came oil engines and early "glow tube" petrol engines. Note that oil engines are not true diesel engines. The compression ignition engine came along later. Not sure if Rudolf Diesel is the actual true inventor of the compression engine, but he perfected the idea into mass production.

Oil engines became popular at one time, taking over a lot of jobs once done by steam engines. About the best thermal efficiency from the best piston steam engines was only 6-7%, the oil engine almost immediately jumped to 12 %. Double that of steam. This ushered in internal combustion as the favorite power source of the time. Then came petrol engines with even better efficiency, especially after the spark plug was invented, and then the compression ignition engine with the best fuel efficiency.

An interesting European farm tractor (forgot the name) using an oil engine had no reverse gear. The driver simply cut the fuel, waited just before the engine completely stalled, hit the fuel again and the engine restarted in reverse. Those engines ran equally well in either direction! While those oil engines would run on just about any oil that would burn, they still only got about half the efficiency of an indirect injection CS Lister. They use an entirely different principle than compression ignition engines.


Hi Strawhat, grinding bearing races to fit an unusual or no longer available bearing size is very good advice provided you have access to a grinder and you keep the coolant flowing, wouldn`t want to alter the hardening/tempering with excess heat. Sadly I do not own a grinding machine. Many years ago I did have a lathe with a grinding attachment that would have been perfect for this situation. I tried not to use it too often as I was concerned about the amount of abrasive dust it deposited on the lathe sliding surfaces.

Yes, a lot of Lister engines have babbit filled bearings. I have only had to pour a new babbit bearing once on a very old saw milling machine, The trick is to coat the shaft with carbon from an oxy/acetylene torch with the oxygen turned off, once the shaft is well coated with soot, turn on the oxygen and warm up the bearing/bush housing, now pour your babbit. The soot will prevent it from sticking to the shaft.

Hi Glort, I have used head warn lamps a lot in the past and they are an excellent addition to any tool box, I used to keep a rechargeable LED set in the glove box of my UTE, when I got a flat tire at night it was invaluable. I have also used the cheap plastic safety glasses with the bifocal magnifying lens at the bottom. If I remember rightly, they come in five different strengths depending on how bad your eyes are, I guess I would need a number 5 now!  :laugh:

Bob

dieselspanner

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Re: Roid Bearing Quality?
« Reply #20 on: August 25, 2019, 09:39:10 AM »
Herbert Akroyd Stuart is the man you're thinking of, well worth a read up.......

Cheers Stef
Tighten 'til it strips, weld nut to chassis, peen stud, adjust with angle grinder.

ajaffa1

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Re: Roid Bearing Quality?
« Reply #21 on: August 25, 2019, 10:09:27 AM »
Hi StrawHat, I don`t know what it is you are trying to achieve but if you want an engine that will run 24/7 for the next ten years then the Lister CS is about as good as it gets. These things were built to last forever, all the spares you could ever want are still available. You should contact Gary (aka Dieselgman) and find out what he has available, 38ac might also be able to hook you up with an original CS.

I am lucky here in Australia because Rob at Old Timer Engines keeps every spare imaginable. He also buys and sells old stationary engines, some are just for garden ornaments and others he strips down and recycles the parts. I still think you should check out Gary at Diesel Electric Services. Sadly he does not post much here anymore, not because he is disinterested but because the US law has made it illegal for him to advertise servicing of engines that no longer meet the government emissions standards.

I believe the best efficiency of any engine is now held by the common rail diesel engine, sadly VW/Audi fiddled the emission figures and gave diesel engines a bad name.

Bob

38ac

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Re: Roid Bearing Quality?
« Reply #22 on: August 26, 2019, 08:05:48 PM »
Gary at Diesel Electric Services. Sadly he does not post much here anymore, not because he is disinterested but because the US law has made it illegal for him to advertise servicing of engines that no longer meet the government emissions standards.

Bob

Bob,

Gary has his reasons for not being on here much but that isnt one of them as it is entirely legal for him or anyone else to rebuild or sell parts for an older diesel engine and advertise those services. Certain manufacturers have made deals with the EPA where THEY will not supply remanufactured engines that do not meet current regulations and they must destroy and cores that are turned in to them.  These manufacturer deals do not affect the aftermarket in any way.

Collector and horder of about anything diesel

ajaffa1

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Re: Roid Bearing Quality?
« Reply #23 on: August 27, 2019, 01:40:30 PM »
Hi 38ac, I`m sure Gary posted on here a while back that he was having advertising/selling issues with the EPA, but what do I know I live in Australia.

I do hope he is not suffering the sort of health issues that effect us all at our age, please pass on my best wishes and tell him the forum is missing his knowledge and insight.

Bob

38ac

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Re: Roid Bearing Quality?
« Reply #24 on: August 27, 2019, 03:00:01 PM »
 Hi Bob,
Unless I missed something, entirely probable Gary answered a question as to why he didn't expand his web presence and update his web site with by saying he didn't want or need unwanted attention to his clone parts business. 

Truth of the matter is interest in India engines is just about done due to low cost solar, EPA, quality issues etc as the fellow at Boltan Equipment will soon find out.
Another large factor is I would guess that fully 90% of people who bought Listeroids never did anything useful with them and they are just decorations in the shed or garage. A lot of people are tired of looking at them and there are quite a few for sale, often at bargain prices.

Gary is well, just spoke with him yesterday via email.  The subject of this forum wasn't breached, I have no insight as to why he has left.
Collector and horder of about anything diesel

sirpedrosa

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Re: Roid Bearing Quality?
« Reply #25 on: August 27, 2019, 11:10:00 PM »
Hi Bob and Butch

I think I know why.

Recently I read all the topic of the "import from england". what a mexican novelle (2 years!)

And I think some sort of mistrust landed in Gary's lap with some LEF members breaking the joint venture of the endeavour.

And that can kill the amusement of posting, among other vicissitudes I don't need to describe... like understand antipodean humour (quote).

We must respect our diferences... All of them! Cultural, age, life experience, social awareness... and 1000's of others.

Giving an exemple: I need a stock key 9/16*5/16 paralell. USA suppliers can't sell it to me because of export fees, and I can't jeopardize a friendship to circumventing this situation.

While we talking here together, about  - most of all antiques that does't complie to EPA's (worldwide) but indeed are priceless for us - and fulfill our will of living, and maintain healthy mind - the real world just want a quick enrichment no matter how, nor who.

Just my thoughts. Do not censure me ...

Have a happy life, please.
VP
Bernard 18A - 1968 (mama's water pump - year of my birth)
Petter PAZ1 - Jun 1967, 3HP, sn 416xxxx
Petter PAZ1 - Nov 1979, 3HP, sn 425xxxx

StrawHat

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Re: Roid Bearing Quality?
« Reply #26 on: August 30, 2019, 04:56:36 AM »
Bargain prices? Most people selling these things are on fishing expeditions trying to get a bite on ridiculous prices. P.T. Barnum would be proud of anyone selling scrap iron for $3.00 a pound when its only worth $0.20 a pound at the most.


Truth of the matter is interest in India engines is just about done due to low cost solar, EPA, quality issues etc as the fellow at Boltan Equipment will soon find out.
Another large factor is I would guess that fully 90% of people who bought Listeroids never did anything useful with them and they are just decorations in the shed or garage. A lot of people are tired of looking at them and there are quite a few for sale, often at bargain prices.