Author Topic: ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit  (Read 667 times)

old seagull man

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 112
    • View Profile
ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit
« on: May 30, 2019, 02:57:46 PM »
Hi All;

I have been offered at a very good price an new old stock one of these units.

An was wondering if anyone had any experience with them?

What i was thinking is i could put the speed sensor on the output shaft of the gen head and control the engine speed with the unit and always have a 1500 rpm generator no matter the load.

glort

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2977
    • View Profile
Re: ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit
« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2019, 05:42:51 PM »

Seem to be working well for this guy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJs1tS4sJM4

Been thinking of one of these myself. Can you get more than one at the right price?   :laugh:

old seagull man

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 112
    • View Profile
Re: ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit
« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2019, 04:10:32 AM »
No Sorry mate, but this is not a bad price for the lot.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/ESD5500E-Engine-Speed-Controller-MSP6729-Magnetic-Speed-Sensor-ADC120-actuator/143230026989?_trksid=p2485497.m4902.l9144

Its exactly the same as the picture my mate sent. he works for a mining company, and it was in the stock to be cleaned up.
You you don't need a cheap 250kw 3 phase motor do you? make a good induction generator.

ajaffa1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1367
    • View Profile
Re: ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit
« Reply #3 on: May 31, 2019, 09:43:18 AM »
Hi OSM, thanks for posting that, I have been looking for a reasonably priced generator speed controller for a while, having watched the video posted by Glort, I think that may be just what I`ve been looking for. It has the huge advantage that, in the event of a controller failure (usually due to lightening strikes around here), it would probably only take about ten minutes to reinstate the original governor and be back up and running.

Bob


glort

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2977
    • View Profile
Re: ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit
« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2019, 10:35:15 AM »

 That IS a good price. I have been looking at these things for years on alliexpress and Bangood and they were a good bit more than that, early 300's if memory serves.

A 250KW Motor?? Wow! I have a 5 Cyl, 3.0L diesel engine out my first merc  sitting here I haven't been able to part with, same as what Bruce has.  Even that wouldn't be able to drive the thing to full output.  I have a 12 Kw I have been working with ( thought it was bigger :0( ) and that weighs 170 Kg. I reckon a 250 KW must be 2-3 tons.  Not going to able to move that round with my Modified engine crane... ned a decent forklift to that thing.

One of those Governors would be good for putting on my 13 or 30 Hp diesels to drive the IMAG.
I wonder how they would go when the IMAG was hooked to a  Solar GTI ?  The MPPT of the GTI's tends to make the engines hunt as they ramp up and down trying to find the sweet spot for the power production.  Be interesting to know if these electronic governors could be set up to over come that.

Would be a big ask and very impressive if they could combat it even partially.

old seagull man

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 112
    • View Profile
Re: ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit
« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2019, 11:56:39 AM »
Thanks Guys, the most expensive part of the setup is the actuator.
Bob i have see the units as cheap as 60-70 Dollars.
So you could almost afford a spare if you needed it to be bomb proof.

glort

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2977
    • View Profile
Re: ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit
« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2019, 04:55:52 AM »

I have often thought of using the old Cruse Control for Vehicles as a governor. they used to be available as kits.
You put a magnet on the tail shaft and a sensor nearby and it basically tried to keep the shaft turning at the same rate I guess.  Couldn't see why it wouldn't actuate a throttle on a stationary engine the same way off a flywheel.

old seagull man

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 112
    • View Profile
Re: ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit
« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2019, 12:48:30 PM »
Thought the same thing, put one on dads holden statesman, years ago.
Most of the ones you can get these days have a vacuum operated servo, so no go.
« Last Edit: June 01, 2019, 05:23:36 PM by old seagull man »

glort

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2977
    • View Profile
Re: ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit
« Reply #8 on: June 01, 2019, 01:07:50 PM »

I wonder how much air/ vac they would use?
Might be possible to vac down an old BBQ bottle and use that as the Vac source.

EdDee

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 744
    • View Profile
Re: ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit
« Reply #9 on: June 03, 2019, 11:02:43 AM »

I wonder how much air/ vac they would use?
Might be possible to vac down an old BBQ bottle and use that as the Vac source.

Run a alt off a diesel ute - 12v charging plus a small vaccuum pump that normally gets routed to the brake booster....
12/1 750RPM/9HP Roid 5kVA- WMO Disposal/Electricity & Hot Water Gen
12/1 650RPM/8HP Roid 4.5kVa - Demon Dino
Chinese Yanmar - Silent Runner with AutoStart
Classic Komatsu 1963 Dozer/Fergusson 35 Gold Belly ...
Bikes,Cars,Gunsmithing & Paintball...Oh yes, a 5Ha open air Workshop to play in!

old seagull man

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 112
    • View Profile
Re: ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit
« Reply #10 on: June 03, 2019, 01:01:21 PM »
Brilliant idea, looking on fleebay now.  :) ;D

glort

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2977
    • View Profile
Re: ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit
« Reply #11 on: June 14, 2019, 03:10:10 AM »

Have you looked into the speed controller or the cruise control any more OSM?

old seagull man

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 112
    • View Profile
Re: ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit
« Reply #12 on: July 16, 2019, 12:51:37 PM »
Yes and no. The unit uses a proximity sensor to count the teeth on the prime power flywheel. To monitor the engine speed.
The mighty Shifing is hand started so the flywheel has nothing to count. An one of the boys decided they needed it for a job they were doing so, I'm out of luck.

EdDee

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 744
    • View Profile
Re: ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit
« Reply #13 on: July 16, 2019, 03:16:32 PM »
As usual, I'm jumping in half way with no clue whatsoever...

What about putting the prox adjacent to the blades on the genhead pickup.... Don't forget to set up some sort of safety for belt breakage etc that would rev the guts out of the system when it thinks its at low/0 rpm....

Otherwise, an internal mount in the sump to pick up rpm from the cam gear teeth.....(Or maybe a hole drilled in the case?)

Just spitballin'...

Cheers
Ed
12/1 750RPM/9HP Roid 5kVA- WMO Disposal/Electricity & Hot Water Gen
12/1 650RPM/8HP Roid 4.5kVa - Demon Dino
Chinese Yanmar - Silent Runner with AutoStart
Classic Komatsu 1963 Dozer/Fergusson 35 Gold Belly ...
Bikes,Cars,Gunsmithing & Paintball...Oh yes, a 5Ha open air Workshop to play in!

glort

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2977
    • View Profile
Re: ESD 5500E engine speed controller unit
« Reply #14 on: July 16, 2019, 11:43:33 PM »
Yes and no. The unit uses a proximity sensor to count the teeth on the prime power flywheel. To monitor the engine speed.

Have you bought one yet?
Just talking with no knowledge or experience but are you sure it needs teeth?

I looked up the manual and the standard range of the Pick up is 7000 Hz. That's not going to be a lot of teeth especially on a motor doing normal RPM.
If you were to place 4 magnets on the flywheel, at 600 RPM that would be 2400 Hz which should be plenty for this to work from.  If you did 8 magnets that would be 4800 and have to be enough for a sensor that has a normal range of 7000Hz. I can't see a lower limit so I'm thinking that a single point may also be enough.

As there is not settings on the controller for the number of teeth on the flywheel, it's just counting the interruption frequency and calculating from there. It says in the manual it sets idle speed at 600RPM from 1000 Hz. From that, would seem to me that on a 600 RPM engine you'd only want a single pick up point to tell the controller to throttle back otherwise the thing is going to think it's idling when the engine it's on is going to be flat out. Watch out if it decides to go to working speed!

In my non existent knowledge of engine control, counting teeth is usually done for timing purposes, so the computer knows where the engine is in it's rotation for fuel injection, spark, variable cam timing etc.
As this thing is only controlling speed, I would suggest a much lower frequency would be fine and from what I can see, it is.
I have a little electronic Tach from flea bay and that uses a small neo Magnet you just stick on the fly wheel and it counts from that. The pickup looks like what I see in these Speed controller Kits. I would be just sticking on 4 magnets as evenly paced around the flywheel as you could and I'd be more than certain that would work.

 I know beans about these but seems odd they would need an 80 tooth gear or whatever to count just for rpm and if they did, I'd imagine it would be in the kit.  In any case if they do need a gear which from the manual, I highly Doubt, what about just getting a ring gear ( or flywheel)  off a car engine and bolting that to the  engine or even the gen head Pulley. Shouldn't make any difference where you put it. 
If you need a ring gear let me know and I can probably acquire you one.

I would definitely encourage you to buy some little Neo magnets though and try them. I get the feeling one may be enough but would be pretty certain from what I'm reading you'd easily get away with 4. You could probably glue strips of  fridge magnet on the flywheel or pulley and it would work off that as the signal the pickup needs is very low and pretty much just an interruption. 
From what I can see, I wouldn't be surprised if these things would run off the keyway of the engine or generator shaft with no magnets at all or if the woodruff key protruded from the flywheel or pulley and you could sense off that. The key or Keyway   would be doing 1500 RPM/ Hz on the alternator and should be well in the frequency range of the sensor like that even if it were not fast enough on the engine. I think it would be though.