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Author Topic: St1a oily exhaust smoke and grade of engine oil  (Read 428 times)

Johnny slab

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St1a oily exhaust smoke and grade of engine oil
« on: May 06, 2019, 01:26:08 PM »
Hi all
Iíve been working on my Davis chain trencher and am wondering what engine oil should be in it- at present Iíve got 15w40 part synthetic but am a little concerned that the exhaust smoke is a bit oily. Any advice?

glort

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Re: St1a oily exhaust smoke and grade of engine oil
« Reply #1 on: May 06, 2019, 03:12:11 PM »

Wrm it up, run it about half throttle and slowly trickle water down the intake till it starts to bog then repeat with  enough water flow till it is just on the edge of Bogging.  Give it a big rev every now and then and put at least 2L of water through it.

See how it goes after that. If tere is an improvement give the thing the water treatment after each use. You are probably getting coked rings. If it does not improve, Might be rebuild time.

Oil is basically inconsequential on these old engine as you are about 150 Grades above anything the designers could have imagined when they built the things.

Johnny slab

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Re: St1a oily exhaust smoke and grade of engine oil
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2019, 08:40:15 PM »
That would be hydraulic lock- I donít think I will try that one.

sirpedrosa

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Re: St1a oily exhaust smoke and grade of engine oil
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2019, 09:45:03 PM »
Hi JS

Maybe is time to take a loock at the piston rings waring...

BR
VP
Bernard 18A - 1968 (mama's water pump - year of my birth)
Petter PAZ1 - Jun 1967, 3HP, sn 416xxxx
Petter PAZ1 - Nov 1979, 3HP, sn 425xxxx

Johndoh

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Re: St1a oily exhaust smoke and grade of engine oil
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2019, 10:39:21 PM »
Glort is a multi talented and knowledgeable individual he's never going to tell you anything that's not true. I was very worried about dripping the water into my engine however it went very well the engine was hot water turned to steam and as you know steam is great at cleaning anything. Glort also has the ability to swear for 15 minutes without repeating himself.
It is better to light a candle than to curse the darkness

glort

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Re: St1a oily exhaust smoke and grade of engine oil
« Reply #5 on: May 08, 2019, 12:34:56 AM »
That would be hydraulic lock- I donít think I will try that one.

And that would be a mistake to believe often parroted internet mantra that is not true.

Unlike most on the net, I am hands on and try and question everything rather than just repeat what the guy before said or did who repeated what the guy before him did without anyone actually thinking about why the hell they were doing it in the first place and how it applied to their circumstance.  I have Shot down endless perpetuated BS on a whole load of things by actually doing what everyone says not to in order to create the fault. So far I have failed every time because these myths are always just that.

  Off the top of my head, I can't think of one thing that did add up in practice to the endless parroted warnings but I can write a long list of what was complete and utter BS everyone took as indisputable fact when it was anything but.

I have been using  WI on my vehicles and other engines, mainly diesels, for about 15 Years now and NEVER hydro locked an engine, had one rust up or any of the other fear mongering problems people have made out were disastrous certainty's. Of course the people that spread the FUD have NEVER even tested what they claim is such a terrible and predictable destruction.  They Fearmonger endlessly and NEVER test a single thing they carry on about.

Like  many other things, WI is a very simple solution to a lot of things which is maligned both in the fear mongering and the typical over exaggeration of the complexity needed to make it work effectively. I can do things with Diesel engines that shouldn't be done and can't be done for long with WI that would kill them otherwise.  These days though there is this mentality on the net that unless something is complicated, expensive and has a bunch of built in failure points, it can't possibly work.

This is probably the biggest hurdle with WI. People seem to be programmed to  think that pouring a slow trickle of water into their running engine has to lead to disaster and no good can come of it. If they ever tried it, they would see the opposite is true but sometimes it's hard to get over the negative brainwashing one has been programmed with no matter how flawed in reality it is.
When I get back to making vids, covering WI and doing a demo of pouring water into an engine might be a good one to cover although it would be good to find an engine other than one of mine which is Typically clagged up so the effect can be shown. 

Many years back I was  telling a friend who had fitted water injection to his vehicle after the great success I had with it, how much to use.  My advise was a dosing rate of 300Ml/ min for his 2 L engine.

He was messaging me saying the thing was bogging down and steam and water coming out the exhaust every time the WI kicked in. I kept telling him the dosage rate was too high and he kept insisting he thought 300Ml  was too much and had set it to only 200ml/ min.

After some back and forth and complaining that the 10L water tank he had ran out in minutes and I pointed out that wasn't possible at 200ml min which would give him 50 Min non stop on a 10 L tank and he MUST be pumping the water in there, he worked out that he misread/ calculated the amount and was in fact feeding the thing 2 LITRES / 2000 ml min!!
The thing was dribbling steam and water out the exhaust but it never hydro locked even at that excessive rate.
After he turned the water waaaaay down and went back to 300 Ml min the thing was fine and already showed an improvement. Little wonder at that rate.

 If one can feed a 2L engine 2L of water a min and it is not damaged, then it's going to take a garden hose to hydrolock one and the fire will have already gone out long before that happens.

If You have say a 2L engine, It's displacement/ cylinder capacity is 2L times the RPM, say 2500 so that's 2000 x 2500 = 5000L per min displacement.
You aren't going to Hydrolock an engine unless you put effort into it at that rate.

6/1 is 1.4L  from memory x 600 rpm is 840L min.  A small trickle of water down the intake and the 2-3L of water I suggested is not going to come near locking that up even if you did dump it all in 1 Minute.  You might be able to get it in that fast but the engine would be complaining and you'd sure know you were over doing it which would lead an intelligent person to back off and slow the amount they were giving it. If the engine is running more or less normally, it's a VERY long way from hydrolocking!

Water injection has been used on every sort or engine out there from aircraft to ships, cars, F1..... You name it.  Still used a lot on ships and BMW use it on current model vehicles.  Well Documented that the Old super Constellation Aircraft would have melted the pistons in the engine on one take off without WI. I have had my head in the wheel wells of one of those and seen the massive water tanks for the WI.

Don't knock it till you try it but if you don't want to try it, by all means pull the engine down and manually clean the rings and reassemble the whole thing.
You may also find the bores are glazed or you have a bad exhaust valve guide.
Your time, effort and cost, not mine so feel free to do whatever you think is best. 

Personally I find it a lot easier to Dribble water into the intake to clean any gumming of the rings which is a classic cause of what you are experiencing than tear the whole engine down when I don't have to.   If there is no improvement after the water treatment, then you know it's worn and pulling it down is not the waste of time doing something that could be done far easier, quicker and cheaper. If there is an improvement, ( and you won't Cure it in one go if it is ring sticking)  then you can do like some people here have and set up a system where the engine gets water regularly/ constantly when it's running which will prevent problems and keep everything clean and free of any build-up.

Up to you of course.

Hugh Conway

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Re: St1a oily exhaust smoke and grade of engine oil
« Reply #6 on: May 08, 2019, 01:15:08 AM »
@ Johnny slab
Have no fear.

As Johndoh said, "Glort is a multi talented and knowledgeable individual he's never going to tell you anything that's not true."  He might run on a bit, but won't give you a bad steer.
I squirt about 1 liter of water into my 6/1 every so often to keep the innards clean.
Been doing it for almost 7 years. Does not even slow it down. I do it when running a fair load on the generator.

It works fine. give it a try.

Cheers
Hugh
JKson 6/1  (Utterpower PMG ) Off-grid
Lister 6/1 Start-O-Matic engine......running with PMG
1978 Royal Enfield (glutton for punishment by Indian iron)
1963 BMW R-27 project

buickanddeere

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Re: St1a oily exhaust smoke and grade of engine oil
« Reply #7 on: May 24, 2019, 05:19:29 AM »
   Oily smoke and soot deposits are products of incomplete combustion.  Engine coolant temp should be 195-210F. straight 40 weight oil is better than 15W-40.  Air filter ? Too small or dirty ? Injection event too late ?