Author Topic: snowed in, again  (Read 569 times)

BruceM

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snowed in, again
« on: January 13, 2019, 04:06:22 PM »
More cloudy and cold stretches this winter than we've had in 20+ years, and last night a forecast 0-3 inch now has turned into 8+ and still snowing this morning.  This just after the last snow finally melted.  I'll be on PV and solar hot water snow removal when/if it stops.  An alarming change after over a decade of milder, warmer winters (and hotter summers).   

Lucky for me a friend brought groceries 2 days ago. There's no county maintenance on our dirt roads here, it's DIY all the way.

11:30
Massive PV to the rescue.  With my additional 1500W, despite heavy overcast (though with snow on the ground assist) I've got plenty of power to charge.  By the time I finished shoveling snow, my main battery bank was up to bulk charge voltage. 


« Last Edit: January 13, 2019, 06:12:46 PM by BruceM »

LowGear

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Re: snowed in, again
« Reply #1 on: January 14, 2019, 09:41:52 PM »
Solar power in snow country.  Who would have thought?
NPR Tipper/Dump Truck
Kubota BX 2230
Witte BD Generator
SunnyBoy 6000 + SolarWorld 245

glort

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Re: snowed in, again
« Reply #2 on: January 14, 2019, 10:17:38 PM »

while Bruce is snowed in, most of the country is facing heat wave conditions here over the next 4-5 Days. Not even close to Feb yet when things start to get really warm.

If only we could send you some heat and you could send us some snow, everyone would be happy.

ajaffa1

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Re: snowed in, again
« Reply #3 on: January 14, 2019, 11:00:30 PM »
I would be delighted to have some snow, used to love skiing, bring it on. The effort would probably kill me but it`s got to be better to die doing something I like rather than die thinking about all the things I would like to be able to do.

South Australia has just issued a red alert for a heat wave with temperatures exceeding 45 degrees. We are only forecast to get to 38 by the end of the week, despite being several thousand kilometers closer to the equator. I guess all my solar power will be diverted to the air conditioner again.

My unlucky Brother in Law flew into Melbourne yesterday, for the week. going to be a hell hole there in the heat, expect the grid will fall over again with all those AC units running.

Bob

glort

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Re: snowed in, again
« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2019, 11:36:31 PM »

I have been following the grid loading or peak demand for a while now and Vic and SA are going to come up several GW short on the predicted Demand. The interconnects are very limited, designed more for balancing when there were coal stations in operation rather than supplying major power.

Of course in the bunrush to be able to get rid of said evil  power stations the greenwashed Gubbermint now soundly kicked out on their arses, didn't bother with the small detail how short they were leaving themselves so now they are in trouble.
Of course they did have the foresight after the whole state went black, twice, to install DIESEL generators to make up for the short fall of the coal stations they got Rid of.  Stroke of Gubbermint Genius there!

Those gennys are nice and economical to run, only using 1 TANKER  load per hour of fuel between them.  I can't really get my head round that. 40K Liters in a standard tanker here and they are sucking that down in an hour?  Can you imagine the flow rate?  My 8 Hp petrol pump wouldn't come near that and I know the flow that thing will do.

Not expected to get as hot here but being Further south than you Bob I wonder how much of our power will be Siphoned off?
I was going to get my play solar setup out with teh batteries and inverter, maybe now would be the right time?  Least I can keep the Fridges running and the computer on.

Heres a site you might be interested in, it shows the generation and demand of the grid and the various states. The max is dependent on what they can move around and what other states are using but I can already see for the non daylight saving time being 9:30 am the demand is already through the roof.

https://reneweconomy.com.au/nem-watch/

This one give a different insight, Shows the power being moved around and the price the grid operators are paying wholesale.
When it gets towards $400, you know they are desperate.  Sa, NSW and VIC are already Nudging $300 when at this time of day they would usually be around 60-70.

https://www.aemo.com.au/Electricity/National-Electricity-Market-NEM/Data-dashboard#nem-dispatch-overview


If you go to the 7 Day forecast tab you can see the allocations and predictions for every state. Lots of Negative numbers there meaning more demand than power available.  Such  brilliant idea closing all those coal stations before there was even a hint of anything to make up for their shortfall. Of course in teh next 5 years things are going to get MUCH worse with more stations set to close and not reliable and dependable substitute supply even being spoken of let alone in the works.
Power co's don't want to invest the money in anything atm and all the talk of cheap solar is just that, talk.

 Think I might go make sure the genny is filled up and run out the extension lead.
I can't see this being a good day or next few being better once everything heat soaks.   Be also interesting to see what the voltage drops to round here.

You should be OK Bob, Qld is doing fine and you would be first in line to get power from them.  Lots of solar farms up there now. then again at night..... Give you the perfect chance to prove to your better half why you NEED a generator.... multiple in fact!  :0)

BruceM

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Re: snowed in, again
« Reply #5 on: January 15, 2019, 12:06:09 AM »
Grid power is for whiny socialist/communist pussies.  Pull the plug. ;)

Seriously, Glort you should think about becoming a distributor of the Ice Bear peak shaving cooling systems.  Your peak power rates are going to get much, much higher.  It's the only way to reduce peak power demands in summer. 

ajaffa1

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Re: snowed in, again
« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2019, 12:22:29 AM »
Oh boy, the numbers are looking very bad again and it`s broad day light, lots of power feeding back into the grid. When that drops off this evening we can probably expect blackouts again. Don`t think the charge in SA`s big Tesla battery is going to last long!

Things are only going to get worse as the population increases and temperatures rise, at some point the idiots in government are going to have to pull their heads out of their arses and put in place some policies that will encourage investment in power generation.

The flows into those diesel generators is frightening, just over eleven litres per second! Guess the oil dealers in Singapore will be having a party this week. No doubt this will lead to a nationwide shortage of diesel, as we no longer have sufficient reserves, allowing the servos to hike he prices. Yet another example of short term thinking by those in charge costing the people money.

My Wife has been in Sydney for the last week and is driving home today, going to be a lot cooler here. Western Sydney forecast to hit 48 today, that`s going to need a lot of AC to cool down.

I`ve got the generators prepped and ready to go at all times due to the shaky grid reliability where we live. Can`t wait for the CS generator to be completed so I can give the bird to both the electric companies and the petrochemical giants not to mention the government.

Stay cool,

Bob

broncodriver99

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Re: snowed in, again
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2019, 12:29:55 AM »
This one give a different insight, Shows the power being moved around and the price the grid operators are paying wholesale.
When it gets towards $400, you know they are desperate.  Sa, NSW and VIC are already Nudging $300 when at this time of day they would usually be around 60-70.

https://www.aemo.com.au/Electricity/National-Electricity-Market-NEM/Data-dashboard#nem-dispatch-overview


WOW. That's a very interesting site. Does AUS have multiple operators or just one that handles the whole country?

ajaffa1

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Re: snowed in, again
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2019, 12:35:17 AM »
Like the Ice Bear idea, wonder if it could be reverse engineered to store solar energy during the day to provide air conditioning at night?  Nice little video of the concept https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4arHI6Ul90

Bob

glort

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Re: snowed in, again
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2019, 12:42:56 AM »

 Western Sydney forecast to hit 48 today, that`s going to need a lot of AC to cool down.

I can't see that anywhere but i hope not.
48 is the most I have ever been in in my life, Twice, and it's no fun.

Problem there is when it gets over about 35, most AC starts falling off it's curve pretty rapidly. So do solar panels well before that.

I have a hose on the back of the AC condenser with some garden water mist Nozzles that throw bit of a fog into the coils and cools the intake air.  Makes a HUGE difference to the exhaust air, goes from distinctly hot like a fan heater to quite warm but maybe 20o or more drop.
Allows the machine to do it's job and also not trip out on heat overload.  Nozzles use like .5L water an hour so well worth the benefit.

Nice and cool in here so far and haven't even touched the air.  Will warm up from now on as the sun hits the back of the house.  I'm definitely thinking of getting some shade cloth and clamping it to the gutter all along the exposed back of the house. I think that would make a very big difference to keeping the place cooler.

Of course Mrs would go into orbit about that like every other thing that upsets the look of the place despite the benefit.

I have done my bit for the wildlife this morning.  Got the birdbath I found in the over grown Bushes and put it right next to the grevillia all the native birds are at all day and I can watch from my window.
Might take them a bit to get used to it but if it gets warm enough i'm sure they will soon put their concerns aside for a splash and a drink.  Dad has one and refills it 4 times a day in the hot weather. they know where to find it and make the most of it so hopefully will do the same here.

glort

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Re: snowed in, again
« Reply #10 on: January 15, 2019, 12:58:25 AM »

WOW. That's a very interesting site. Does AUS have multiple operators or just one that handles the whole country?

We have a load of Generators, distributors and retailers.
Went from gubbermint controlled and perfectly adequate to  being sold off and privatised with the laughable notion of more competition  making for cheaper prices.
Power rates have gone up 4-500% and more in some parts and the whole thing has become a gigantic Cluster fluff.

The political football here is always " Lower power prices" but I think everyone sees through that Crock.  All sorts of stupidity is suggested to bring the prices down but they are completely unrealistic and laughable basis any reductions would come from.
The very thought that greedy contemptuous corporations are going to willingly reduce their revenues and dividends to stockholders and directors is stupidity fed to the ignorant sheeple who have not got the first clue and believe what ever garbage they are fed.

Rather than compete they tend to collude, all in a non incriminating, non proveable fashion of course.
Having 3 levels of providers also means they can Duck shove problems and responsibility endlessly so no one gets the blame or is held accountable for anything.

An upcoming problem here now is our coal stations are aging and are going to be in need of significant maintence and updating. Rather than do that the companies that now own them are making the most of the green sentiment and are going to close them down. They are not however even talking of anything to replace them. The gubbermint is trying to get them to stay open so the lights stay on till there is an alternative source to replace them but of course the Greens and other party monkeys are calling it anti environmental  and spin doctoring the whole thing.

I'd like the names and addresses of some of these clowns so I could go round and have a chat with them when there is no power and half the businesses we have left have moved off shore where they are reasonably sure the lights will come on in the morning and stay on till they go home. Then they will all whinge about our trade deficit and how much we are buying from overseas.

Bruce is right, Grid may not be for Commies so much but it sure is for the suckers and unit dwellers.
I just keep my eyes and ears open and try to learn what I can for the day when I go off grid. 

I'm sure it will come and possibly sooner than I imagine.

BruceM

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Re: snowed in, again
« Reply #11 on: January 15, 2019, 01:32:54 AM »
The right wing mantra of private sector does it better and cheaper has been the power co.s con job since their inception.  It was never true during FDR's time, ala the highly successful TVA project, nor is it true now.

I found it interesting that every country with a national grid has pretty well thought out grounding and safety systems, decent rates considering their countries energy assets. They are mostly planning on migrating to renewables in a rational manner. The US system of patched together private systems is a farce, and the MEN grounding system is an abomination.  Hanging "smart meters" on it makes me think of adding GPS naviation on an Amish buggy. As everywhere else, there was no cost savings to the consumer at all, just more increases.  Only Germany was smart enough to look at the data and say no, thank you to "smart" meters.

If you think power should be provided for everyone, it seems to work out better to nationalize and have central planning and less quarterly profit pressure on management and maintenance. 
 
Given the idiocy of most humans regarding power, that may be the best solution. Most guys here could do off grid easily, but this is hardly representative.



glort

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Re: snowed in, again
« Reply #12 on: January 18, 2019, 02:09:38 AM »

Temp Today revised to 44oC

Wholesale price of power up to $394, Reserve shortage ( significant ) forecast.
Lets see what falls over.

BruceM

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Re: snowed in, again
« Reply #13 on: January 18, 2019, 02:43:34 AM »
A moderate summer high for Phoenix, 44C, 111F.
Except for Tasmania's Hydro, Au is almost all coal and little NG.  Are solar-molten salt plants on the way?  They have good carry over to peak times, though not for more than a day or three, depending on molten salt storage capacity.  Beats the heck out of current battery tech.

glort

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Re: snowed in, again
« Reply #14 on: January 18, 2019, 05:10:49 AM »

I have heard or read of Zero molten salt even being discussed. Everything here is wind, solar PV and batteries.
They are talking about another Big BS battery for SA now. While there is a lot of noise especially from the green motivated about storage, they fail to accept or admit that these "big" batterys can only power a tiny fraction of the homes in one ( small population) state for maybe an hour and aren't even used for that.

The truth of what they are mainly used for is not even grid stability but rather to play our idiotic energy market to make money for the owners.

Our power system is in a shambles atm and on a certain road to get much worse. FF plants are being closed not for environmental reasons ( although the excuse is convenient) and not because they are past use by date or too expensive to run/ maintain.  They are being Closed to further play our energy market and push power prices even higher.

Rather than the outcome the gubbermint promised in lower power prices, the reality has not been competition at all by how to play the system to create Maximum revenue. The power cos are doing this very well.
It is clearly heading down the track of the power cos raping the system by taking all they can get while putting nothing back in till the whole thing is at the point at collapse at which point the gubbermint will have to take it over again, invest billions to repair the whole grid and the private co's will walk away scott free having made untold billions.
Same as has been done before with these privatized services.

The low cost price of solar is going to be a curse here. all the power co's are building solar farms and bulldozing power stations. They can replace their generation with a lower cost supply but the fact it is an intermittent supply is not their problem nor are they obligated to provide one. Some are putting in token wind  but again, the wind does not blow every night nor does it blow completely steady meaning the supply is constantly varying anyway even between generation companies.

There is a very distinct and vocal cry here amoung the green motivated that we must " Urgently" go 100% renewable power but there is a distinct lack of call for thinking it through and putting into place a plan that will allow a smooth transition with a reliable supply at an affordable price.

Their " Urgent" calls really do translate to rushing into something that is going to take decades to do properly and build up to without great detrimental effects and causing hardship for families and driving business offshore to where there is a cheaper and more reliable supply even if it is completely FF powered.