Author Topic: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging  (Read 1029 times)

jonnymcc

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Re: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging
« Reply #15 on: December 29, 2018, 11:45:11 AM »
My wiring diagram

oldgoat

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Re: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging
« Reply #16 on: December 29, 2018, 02:04:22 PM »
That is ok the( in) end is strapped to the +24 v end of the resistor below it the out end goes to top tag of the LC2 contact or the yellow wire which should come from it.
Adjust the maximum charging current to 4 amps which is the maximum your ammeter will take.

ajaffa1

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Re: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging
« Reply #17 on: December 30, 2018, 08:51:43 AM »
Hi Guys, sorry I haven`t posted anything for the last five days, we had an internet outage which cut us off from the rest of the world. It also cut off Grafton, our nearest town. The biggest problem with this was that my Wife drove into town to do some shopping only to find that none of the businesses in South Grafton were able to do any online banking transactions, cash only. Not too surprisingly all the ATM`s were either empty of cash or had no internet connection to the bank. Fortunately she had forty dollars in cash in her purse and was able to buy petrol to get home. So much for the government`s dream of a cashless society in which they can demand a cut of every penny spent.

The telecom company responsible for this are not liable for any of the financial losses incurred by local people or businesses. All attempts to get information from their helpline proved fruitless as they have contracted all these services to India, Pakistan and Indonesia, while laying off all the Australian workforce that used to do this work. I am told that one of their internet routers required a re-boot (switch it off and then turn it back on again). Apparently they no longer employ anyone with the skills to push a button twice, a remote re-boot was not possible as the overseas technicians do not have that level of access. What a fu*ked up system! Hope all the executives that were responsible for this choke on their own vomit on New Years Eve.  >:(

Rant over for now back to business: Jonny, Oldgoat is absolutely right about the wiring connecting to LC2, I am a little concerned about his suggestion that you should adjust things to run at 4 Amps. Mine runs 3 amps on high charge and a fraction over 1 amp on low charge, but I guess this could vary depending on how big and old your battery bank is. A much better solution is to buy a couple of 800 milliamp battery trickle chargers. These should be wired into a mains outlet, these will guarantee your batteries are fully charged when you get a blackout. If you fit a crossover switch in your fuse box, they will also charge you batteries, through the same outlet when you have to run on generator power. Probably a good thing that your fuel control solenoid no longer works as it pulls about 2 amps on start up and about 1 amp when running.

As for the cause of the burned out resistor, I suspect that someone has fed the 240 volt side of things to the fuel control solenoid and this has back fed through the charging circuit and the batteries, should have been quite a bang, wish I had been there to see it!  :laugh:

Bob

jonnymcc

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Re: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging
« Reply #18 on: December 30, 2018, 01:45:29 PM »
Sorry to hear of your recent troubles!! Sounds hectic! We had an issue recently where one of our banks systems went down and loved out bank machines, cards and internet banking. People were not amused.

On the charging front, I hear what you are saying regarding the trickle chargers, a much better charge too, but i hate to admit defeat.

However, i have traced continuity in the circuit right from the charger resistor the whole way to the battery positive terminal, by manually operating the main contractor with the batteries disinfected. If i manually operate the contractor with the batteries connected, engine stopped, the ammeter drops fully up the minus. I'm not sure whether this is to be expected or indicates a short.

I did find one wire conected which isn't on the diagram, from the White wire to the LCC rectifier. Photo attached. Might try disconnecting that and seeing if it makes a difference. Could the charging windings have failed in the alternator??

See attached, cheers, Jonny

ajaffa1

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Re: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging
« Reply #19 on: December 30, 2018, 10:30:56 PM »
Hi Jonny, the charging side of the brush alternator also works as the starter motor. When the control panel tries to start the generator the ammeter should show a discharge of around 4 amps. Once the generator is running some of the 240 volt output gets rectified and fed into the solenoid coil causing the line contactor to change over from start mode to run mode. Once this happens the DC side of things should charge the batteries and show a positive charge on the ammeter.

Bob

ajaffa1

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Re: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging
« Reply #20 on: December 30, 2018, 10:50:05 PM »
Hi jonny, what you show in your picture is a relay. Radio Spares (RS) did not exist when your unit was built so this is a later addition to the setup. It will contain a diode to rectify 240 volt AC to DC to feed the solenoid coil. It would help to know where the wires go.

Bob

jonnymcc

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Re: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging
« Reply #21 on: December 31, 2018, 03:52:52 PM »
I did wonder about that, as it says relay on it, and it looks like a relay, but is plugged into the rectifier space......

I'll check where the wires go and let you know. But that white wire comes from the output from the ammeter and is the charge feed to the batteries....

Cheers,

Jonny

jonnymccni

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Re: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging
« Reply #22 on: February 07, 2019, 07:46:32 PM »
Hi all,

Still haven't got the charging issue sorted, bit of a mystery as anything checks out. But on a side note, i have a brand new genuine lister/petter wire wound resistor, think its 47 ohm from memory, free if its of use to anyone, just cover postage.

Cheers for the help so far!

Jonny

oldgoat

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Re: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging
« Reply #23 on: February 08, 2019, 12:27:46 PM »
Contact LC2 which is a changeover contact is supposed to short out the ammeter until the contactor operates this removes the short and charging current flows through the ammeter.

jonnymcc

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Re: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging
« Reply #24 on: February 10, 2019, 04:12:27 PM »
Ok, here are my latest findings:

I am using the set in "push button start" mode. Is battery charging supposed to work in this mode? I note that my main contractor LC does nothing; yet still i have 240v working fine? Does the auto/manual switch bypass LC when set to manual by any chance?

Strangely, when using the set in manual with push button start, the decompressor solenoid does work.... I did not expect this and in fact the manual says you must manually operate the decompressor in this case?

Ok another note, got the selenium diode D1 replaced with a modern equivalent. Seems to relate to the detection circuit.

All help appreciated,

Jonny

ajaffa1

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Re: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging
« Reply #25 on: February 11, 2019, 08:19:48 AM »
Hi Jonny, when you say that your line contactor does nothing are you saying that it does not move? If that is the case then some silly bugger may have disconnected it and replaced it with the RS relay shown in your photo. Could you please post a photo showing what you have left in your wall mounted control box.

The decompressor solenoid is driven directly from the generator top box, as the brush head starts to generate it activates the solenoid engaging compression. When you shut down the generator this releases the solenoid and a spring pulls the decompression levers back into the ready to start position.

Bob

jonnymcc

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Re: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging
« Reply #26 on: March 18, 2019, 09:05:24 AM »
Hi all,

So this problem is solved, and the result is rediculous...

My set doesn't charge the batteries if you set the control box to "push button start". This setting bypasses the main contractor. On automatic, it charges grand. I'm not sure why you wouldn't want to charge batteries when using push button start, but i suspect it's more to do with hand cranking.

My only problem now is the main contractor chatters a bit... But i see someone has bypassed the resistor that i believe it's supposed to prevent that.... Resistor tests ok, I'll maybe try reconnecting it....

Thanks for all your help so far!!

Jonny

ajaffa1

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Re: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging
« Reply #27 on: March 18, 2019, 10:27:51 AM »
Hi Jonny, sorry not to get back to you sooner. I have had exactly the same problem with chatter on the main relay. I like to start my SOM with just a single light bulb, I then allow it to get up to full voltage before throwing the main crossover switch in the distribution board. These were designed to auto-start with a load of around 60 watts. old fashioned 60 watt light bulbs are difficult to come by here so I have had to use 40 watt bulbs, thus the chatter, get a decent load on it and the problem should go away. The DC voltage that opens and closes the main relay is rectified from the 240 volt ac system, however the other smaller relay which initiates start up is maintained from the back EMF created in the wire wound toroidal core. In standby mode there is a 24 volt potential which, when fed through a 60 watt load, is sufficient to engage this relay and initiate the start cycle. Once running the toroidal core produces a small AC voltage which is rectified and used to keep the relay powered. Once the load is turned off the back EMF in the toroid vanishes and the relay opens instigating shut down.

Bob

jonnymcc

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Re: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging
« Reply #28 on: March 19, 2019, 08:07:50 AM »
Hmm, thanks for the response Bob.

I believe I am using a 60w bulb; its one thats been around here since the 70s!! I'll see if i can find another but as you say, they are hard to come by. I have a massive 150w bulb about here too, but it produces far too much heat for any of my fittings!

Any thoughts on that resistor that has been bypassed?

Cheers,

Jonny

ajaffa1

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Re: Lister SL2 Startomatic Battery Charging
« Reply #29 on: March 19, 2019, 10:15:48 AM »
Hey Jonny, if the resistor tests OK try putting it back in circuit, it can`t do any harm it will just drop the voltage and current, I struggle to understand why they took it out in the first place.

Bob