Author Topic: I GOT IT!!!  (Read 2572 times)

glort

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Re: I GOT IT!!!
« Reply #45 on: August 19, 2018, 07:09:37 AM »

If your battery is not fully up to power, You'll have bugger all chance of starting  diesel. Seem this even on Cars.  You can turn them over but if the starter is lazy due to the battery not putting out enough amps, you can make problems for yourself.

A guy I knew " flooded" his engine from cranking with crap batteries. I did not think it were possible to flood a diesel but it seems it is as I have seen it a couple of times now.  I Pulled the GP's on my mates engine and turned the thing over watching fuel spray out the holes. When the fog stabilised I put the GP's back in and connected the batteries out my own vehicle.  Think fired up smartly although chugged for longer than I expected on the 2 Cyl I couldn't  get the plugs out easy so left them. They cleared and the thing was fine.  If the battery is tired or has a weak cell, you can be really chasing your tail.

One thing that's always amazed me with the cranking amps it Draws in my Harley.  Motor is stock and relatively low compression but that amps that thing pulls is crazy.  I have jumper leads that will turn V8's and small diesels over no problems but you can fry them with that thing if it does not light within about 10 sec.  Even when it does everthing is hot.  Have had it checked and it's fine, they are all the same apparently.

If you are not sure about the battery you are using and you have GOOD jumper leads ( if they say " 100 amp" throw them to the shithouse and get PROPER ones) have the vehicle running so it is bringing the voltage up to where it needs to be and jump your engine that way. On a less than perfect battery having the volts up and that extra 80A or whatever from the alternator can make the difference between an easy start and wasting your time.

Of course hooking 2 batteries up to give you the 24V the starter wants would be an even better way to do it!   :laugh:

lastlaugh

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Re: I GOT IT!!!
« Reply #46 on: August 19, 2018, 11:59:10 PM »
Well glort, I decided to stop being a cheapskate and go get 2 marine deep cycle batteries today. I wired tehm in series, and also replaced the old rotted terminals coming out of the gen box. I tested for continuity all the way to the slip rings, and everything appeared ok. So, I hooked it all up, and flipped the start switch.

It started like the day it was made! Crank very easily and putted right along. I tested the 110v outlet connected to it, and it was putting out right at 115v. I'm not sure how to check the total watts being put out, but everything seems to work perfect. One thing I did notice tho is that I'm not getting any current back on the terminals while the engine is running. Once it was running, I disconnected the batteries and tested the terminals. barely 2volts and 2.5Amps. This isnt enough to charge the batteries back, so I'm guessing that portion of the SOM isnt working.

Is my line of thinking correct or am I forgetting something??

Also, I really need a fuel tank for this thing. I'm currently using an old coffee can that I drilled a hole in the bottom of, inserted a grommet, and inserted the fuel line. It spilled today making a mess. Anyone know where to get a fuel tank for an ST2?

dieselgman

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Re: I GOT IT!!!
« Reply #47 on: August 20, 2018, 01:44:13 AM »

Also, I really need a fuel tank for this thing. I'm currently using an old coffee can that I drilled a hole in the bottom of, inserted a grommet, and inserted the fuel line. It spilled today making a mess. Anyone know where to get a fuel tank for an ST2?
Lister ST fuel tanks and ALL other L/P parts are stocked in Kansas. Contact Gary - gsj@gci.net

dieselgman
Ford Powerstroke, Caterpillar 3304, Cummins M11, Too many Listers to count...

glort

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Re: I GOT IT!!!
« Reply #48 on: August 20, 2018, 02:05:54 AM »

Congrats on your engine!
Good batteries always make a difference.  The correct Number of batteries does not hurt either!   :laugh:


Once it was running, I disconnected the batteries and tested the terminals. barely 2volts and 2.5Amps. This isnt enough to charge the batteries back, so I'm guessing that portion of the SOM isnt working.


With the batterys disconnected, you may be just measuring the residual voltage and current in the circuit.  Some alts will show high voltage but I suspect the circuit here is a tap off another winding and needs to be stimulated as it were.

When you disconnect them batteries the alt and voltage regulator has nothing to work against and in detecting an open circuit may just revert to the small output to save keeping on upping the output till it finds resistance and in finding none, cooks itself in the process.

 It may not be working but you need to test differently. I assume you don't have a DC clamp meter so connect the batteries through an amp meter and short that out to start the engine. One the engine is running remove the terminal and see what your amp meter reads.  Preferably make it a 20-30 A amp meter.  You could also connect a load across the batteries and meter the amp draw on that and meter the voltage at the same time. Amps should drop and voltage should come up when you remove the load, provably very quickly if you are only running a little load like 10-20 A because the output from the genny should take care of that in real time.

For voltage just measure the voltage across the batteries after the engine has been running a while. You want around 28.5V but check what it says on the batteries themselves because different types want to run at different levels.  The batteries could take some time to fully charge and equalise so don't worry if they are still coming up 10 min after you start the engine.   2 Hours would be a different thing BUT, it still could be the way the genny is set.

If the voltage is not what you want, there may be provision to adjust the output. The beauty of that old stuff in all it's complication is it can often be adjusted.  In any case there are plenty of options to charge your start and any other batteries.

lastlaugh

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Re: I GOT IT!!!
« Reply #49 on: August 20, 2018, 03:12:36 AM »
Thanks for the reply. I do have a DC clamp meter but I didn't even think to use it!

I wondered the same thing about disconnecting the batteries. If I removed the load, the generator would no longer supply voltage to charge. I'll start it up again tomorrow and see what it looks like with the clamp meter.

lastlaugh

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Re: I GOT IT!!!
« Reply #50 on: August 20, 2018, 03:13:51 AM »

Also, I really need a fuel tank for this thing. I'm currently using an old coffee can that I drilled a hole in the bottom of, inserted a grommet, and inserted the fuel line. It spilled today making a mess. Anyone know where to get a fuel tank for an ST2?
Lister ST fuel tanks and ALL other L/P parts are stocked in Kansas. Contact Gary - gsj@gci.net

dieselgman

I emailed gary yesterday about the ST2 parts. He's getting back with me on prices. Thanks

ajaffa1

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Re: I GOT IT!!!
« Reply #51 on: August 20, 2018, 09:57:14 AM »
Well done Lastlaugh, finally got her running! :)

Had to fire mine up today, I really should do it every month. Very big bush fires near me will probably take out the local electricity grid this evening. Can`t fight fires without electricity as all my water pumps are electric.

Probably got 70,000 liters of water in the tanks and ten times that in the dam, despite the drought. Would be a real pisser to loose the house to a bush fire because the genny wouldn`t start.

Neighbors as close as 5 k from here are being evacuated (top end of my road). Could be in for a long night, hoping the wind will die down giving the fire service a breather.

Spent the afternoon with a weed eater removing every possible flammable piece of grass from around the house paddock, feeling reasonably secure, wish us luck.

Bob

glort

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Re: I GOT IT!!!
« Reply #52 on: August 20, 2018, 03:05:27 PM »

Your Next investment Bob should be a diesel or electric pump.

I have a couple of mates in fire prone areas.
One has only been there 2 years but has put in massive above ground tanks.  He's on bit of a hill and the tanks are higher than the house.  He's put in a 4"  Pipe that runs down to the house and feeds sprinklers that go around and on the house roof.  He's also got several Fire pumps and hoses now.

Other mate is in a bad spot at the top of a very steep gully that levels out a bit before it gets to him but as it's national park, the thick scrub stops about 50M from the back of his house.  He wanted to cut down a couple opf big trees in his yard but the council kept refusing.  The neighbour/ mate over the road is the captain of a fire station so he wrote him an order that the " fire hazzard" had to be removed.  mate took that to the council and there was no way they could refuse that so the trees came down.

Because he lives on the end of a point where there is only one fairly small mains water feed and the same for the power, there is no way he'll have either during a fire.  Some years back I gave him an old rusty trailer I had and we fitted it with an IBC, a petrol  fire pump and a couple of proper fire hoses.  Adapted the pump so it can also pump  from his tank and pool and refill the IBC or pump direct.

He also came across a high pressure water pump they were throwing out from his work so he has that in a shed attached to a 8000L tank and some batteries and an inverter.  He was worried about motors not working due to lack of oxygen in the air which may be a problem due to the updraft  where he is.  He has sprinklers around the house and garden and a lot on the roof this pump Powers.

He can flick the switch and the thing waters the house with no need for an engine at all.  A pretty clever setup all in all.  He keeps the batts charged with a small solar cell normally that is enough to float the batteries.

I was up on the shed roof today checking my panels from the weekend gale winds and saw that yet again, the gutters are full of damn leaves.  have to get up and clean them, again, but even though I am on an acerage estate, I'm going to keep a tank full and a pump at the ready as well.  At my last place in the middle of surburbia with no bush for 20 KM we had the place covered in ash and bits of charred leaves etc and it's not hard to Imagine a fire in any of the MUCH closer bust  round here, less that 1KM as the crow flies, dropping burning embers.

ATM, it would take just a spark to light my lawns up they are so dry and dead despite the water I have been pumping into them.  Ground may have some moisture but on the top the wind  has been drying everything.

I know this much, If I were anywhere near bush I'd be as over the top with pumps, hoses and tanks as I am with solar panels!
I'm trying to put some pumps and tanks in at my Dads place but he's of the opinion if a fire comes ( which it did a couple of years ago) he's not up to fighting it with his asthma so he's just going and if it burns, it burns.  I like the little I have and my memories especially so I'd hate to loose anything.

Hope it all is well for you Bob and you never get close to any danger.


mike90045

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Re: I GOT IT!!!
« Reply #53 on: August 20, 2018, 05:49:49 PM »
Last year, wildfires pushed by winds, swept into Santa Rosa, California, and because of the wind, the flames went through suburban neighborhoods, shopping malls with acres of blacktop parking lots, and business parks.
 It's tough to armor against that happening.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tubbs_Fire

newspaper, with before & after aerial photos
http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-me-northern-california-fires-structures/

ajaffa1

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Re: I GOT IT!!!
« Reply #54 on: August 21, 2018, 12:33:40 AM »
Hi Guys, thanks for the support. We got through the night OK and the wind has died down. The road is still closed and I have never seen it so busy, a continuous stream of fire fighting equipment heading to Buccarumbi.

Gives me the shits that this fire was lit by the rural fire service as part of a hazard reduction burn and now covers 3000 acres of forest and is destroying peoples homes, livestock and property.

I do have a very powerful fire fighting pump (petrol) sadly I lent it to my neighbor when her pump failed. That was nine months ago and she`s still got it. Don`t feel right going and asking for it back as she is a pensioner living on her own.

I always keep the gutters clean as all our potable tank water comes off the roof of the house or shed. Thankfully the weather forecast is giving rain coming in on Friday so we just have to hope the wind stays calm till then.

I do have a plan to build another dam in the valley behind the house. It will flood the boundary fence so I will need to discus it with my next door neighbor but in light of the drought and fires I think he will probably agree, especially if I pay for it and he gets access to several mega liters of water. I might even put some fish in it. Nothing better than a free feed now and then. :)

I do have plans for putting a water main around the house paddock, this would be great for fire suppression and also for irrigating the fruit trees and vegetable patch. I`m not going to try digging a half kilometer trench until we get some rain, the ground is just too hard at the moment.

Bob

glort

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Re: I GOT IT!!!
« Reply #55 on: August 21, 2018, 01:43:20 AM »

The suburban Fires are scary but also logical.  When one house goes up and the winds are strong, it's bound to set the next door place going. Always a worry with any house fire.

The pics are reminiscent of what I saw here maybe 20 Years ago in our Ash Wednesday Fires.
It's one thing to see a fire on TV, it's quite another to stand there and look it in the face. Was a life lesson for me I have and never will forget.
I remember standing on a road side watching a fire blow through a national park at night in the distance. Was at least 5KM away and I ( and others who stopped to watch/ be horrified) could feel the heat and hear the sound.  The speed was amazing as it blew through the treetops and then the ground fire followed.  We pretty much saw about 150o radius on the horizon burn in maybe 10 Min.

I still had media Connections then so went out and did some freelance pics.  Unbelievable to go to a suburban Neighborhoods several streets back from the bush and see the majority of homes wiped out but others still standing completely untouched with even the lawn still OK bar the ash  and char that had been deposited.  One of the pics I took of a car still sitting in a burnt out garage became bit of an Icon of that fire but still gives me an uneasy feeling remembering what was there.  I drove down a road I knew well very shortly after the fire had blown through and it was still well alight  but just burning the bigger material in small flames but it was a carpet of fire. 

I thought it would be an interesting setting to do a shoot with a model and have the black over her body and contrast the beauty and devastation.  Went back 2 weeks later and we both got burnt from ashes and coals still alight in or under the ground.  I remember kicking a stump  which broke and opened up a hollow I could have crawled inside that instantly started to glow then burst into a small but hot flame.  there was nothing around but ash but this had been burning for weeks. I'd heard of that but never really thought it possible till then when I saw it first hand.

I spose here on an acreage estate I could be safest of anyone.  None of the houses are near close enough to set another on fire, in suburbia they would have built a house between and still had wider than normal clearance.  Not enough tree density to jump  one to the other but it confirms my already decided position to knock them all down to ladder trimming height and not let them get away.


Bob, I understand what effectively is donating your fire pump to your Neighbor.  That's what you have done and you are not going to get it back so stop thinking you already have  one  and get yourself another.  It's a very good thing you have done but it's not good to leave yourself unprotected.
I bought one of these Cheapies as a second that actually had nothing wrong with it, just a broken wire that the companies Idiot " technicians" obviously couldn't find.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/NEW-WARTON-8HP-1-5-1-Petrol-High-Pressure-Water-Transfer-Pump-Fire-Irrigation/381802715543?epid=1991721810&hash=item58e5371997:g:Y~cAAOSw9Q9bdju2

I use it for watering the garden from My Biocycle pump out and have racked up a lot of hours on the thing over the last year.  It starts easily and throws down a ship load of water and can easily run 2x  3/4" hoses at full pressure same as 1. Yesterday I was watering the fruit trees up the back and put a 12mm nozzle on the hose and it was throwing water a good 10m  from a 3/4" hose and I didn't even have the thing dialed up.

 You could lay down a LOT of water with the thing with a 1" hose that's for sure.  I only have mine at fast idle most the time but when I want to get rid of weeds,  I crank it up and blow them clean out the dirt. A mate has one of these on his fire fighting trailer. We tested it with 2x 3/4 hoses and it was clear that with 2 people it would be easy to lay down enough water to protect a house.  My diesel one was slightly better but for 3 times the price you'd expect that but it wasn't even double as good let alone 3x.
I have about 8 of these engines on different things and they have all been annoyingly reliable.

For a cheap Pump I have to say I'm very pleasantly surprised with the thing.  Well worth you spending a couple of hundred on and getting my friend. I'm keeping an eye out for another one. I have 3x 36M proper fire hoses so have what I need bar a piece of 1.5" pickup pipe to set them up anyway.

The thing with the fire getting away from a back burn is not at all new.  One of the real big fires a few years back I think down south was caused by the same thing.  It's a tough call.  they can  check the conditions and do it all right and then the wind come up out the blue and away it goes.
Easy to scream incompetence but it's happened before and I'm pretty sure they are sensitive to it by now but you never know if someone did do something stupid anyway.  I think often the problem is all the do gooders scream and whine at the suggestion of burning anything and then you get 10 years build up and when it goes, there is no stopping it.

Guarantee all the do gooders that oppose the back burning are all latte sipping LGBTXYUKNW dole bludging uni dropout inner city dreadlocked 30 somethings that have never held a job in their lives nor been further than 10KM from the CBD.  They scream  loudly about things they have no clue of reality but want to stick to ridiculous trendy ideas. I see this so much living in the " city" ( just) and going to stay with my Dad in the country.

Anyway, stay Vigilant and invest in some pump and hose.  Tell the Mrs even if you hopefully never need it, you need the thing for health reasons to let you sleep better at night.  Works for me and I don't have the need you do nor have to justify it to anyone bar myself.

BruceM

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Re: I GOT IT!!!
« Reply #56 on: August 21, 2018, 02:08:10 AM »
Best wishes with your fire ordeal, Bob.  Arizona has had a dozen 50,000 acre fires in this White Mountains area that started as ''controlled burns'' in the last 30 years. Idiocy and incompetence are things you can count on, globally.

I'm in a swath of overgrazed high desert grassland (clumps with open dirt between) with very few junipers that extends up into the Petrified Forest.  No risk of brushfire here, the cattle even keep the sagebrush nibbled to the woody stub.  We do get plenty of smoke and combustion gasses. Big much promoted and federally funded program to do much more burning, calling it "natural".  It's much cheaper (not counting medical costs and excess deaths) than grazing goats.

ajaffa1

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Re: I GOT IT!!!
« Reply #57 on: August 21, 2018, 11:24:37 AM »
Thanks again for the support. About an hour ago we had the firemen come to our home to tell us that the fire was out of control and coming our way. Worse than that the weather forecast says that the wind will pick up and blow the fire towards us. I think my wife and I will stand and fight the fire rather than running and hoping the fire service will save our home and belongings. I have very severe concerns for my neighbors property as they are on holiday in Japan. I would like to try to save their home but don`t know if I can handle two properties at the same time.

We have water and R A Lister power if the grid goes out. We also have a very clear area around our home so we should be OK. The next 24 hours will be very taxing, I have prepared cans of diesel with 10% gasoline with the intention of back burning the bush around us so it never gets to us. Last time this happened there were 70 foot high walls of flame but the property survived. Fingers crossed we can do the same again.

Bob

 

glort

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Re: I GOT IT!!!
« Reply #58 on: August 21, 2018, 01:02:21 PM »

I'll be thinking of you tonight mate and hoping all goes well for you.

lastlaugh

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Re: I GOT IT!!!
« Reply #59 on: August 21, 2018, 03:00:12 PM »
Damn, hope all goes well for you. Please update us when you can.

(I wasnt aware Australia had this problem with wildfires)