Finally brought home a roid

[sixoklok]

Hi all, from Manitoba.

I picked up a GTC a couple weeks ago, after wanting one for about 8 years. Location, spouse, and money were the problem factors discouraging my purchase. These important considerations have been addressed and she(he?) is sitting in my barn waiting to be mounted up.

I poked around in the crankcase (unpainted) with a strong light and found it to be clean. It was recommended by the seller to specifically check around/behind the cam; reaching my fingers in as best I could, it seemed good too. Dabbing small pieces of white cotton up there showed only oily residue. Oiled and fueled, she started easily and I ran it for about 1 minute, then drained the oil. That's about all the time I can spend on this til late fall/winter, but it was a thrill for Dad (83) and me too.

And if anyone is curious, it was fairly smooth -more up/down than side motion- mounted on a heavy angle and C-channel frame with wheelbarrow tires. The wheels were really to bring the engine into the barn; they will be removed when the frame goes onto concrete pad (16"thick).

I have found good information in the archived posts and look forward to contributing if I can. I don't get into politics or arguments online.

Good day folks

[38ac]

Hello and welcome!
Hope things go well with the GTC, I have no experience with that exporter so I can only generalize.
The issue with sand is bit more complicated that what can be wiped up or easily seen. The crankcase coating material is not very good to begin with and it is applied over loose grit.  When combined with vibration it causes bits to flake away during operation. Not trying to tell you how to run your engine, just being sure that you are aware of known pitfalls. My advise would be to change the oil often the first 100 hours if your going to run it as-is and drain it though a white rag so you can catch whatever drains with the oil.
  There will always be some movement in the engine because the straight line movement of the piston is being countered by a revolving counterweight. In general a lot of up and down movement ( a hopper) is caused by too little counterweight and sideways movement (a scooter) is caused by too much counterweight. An engine that has differences side to side in amount or location of the weight will move in some sort of circle, either turning around the axis or walking in ac ircle.

[LowGear]

Fulfilling dreams has got to be one the very best parts of life.  A couple of photos would be great.

Word has it that you can burn your used oil but $12 a gallon is pretty expensive fuel.  How much oil do these units hold.  I wonder if a pressure washing would dislodge the sand?

Best wishes.

[BruceM]

Once you have committed to grinding out the interior of the crankcase, you find that as 38AC explains, the paint is just slopped over all sorts of flaws and sand filled voids and such. An incredible amount of sand is just below and in the paint. The paint is of low quality.  You have to wonder how long before some bits of paint let go and sand is introduced into your running engine. 

I would highly encourage a complete re-do of the crankcase interior for an engine intended for a long service life. The red electrical varnish (generic Glyptol) is available in spray cans and did work very nicely  for my neighbor's engine.  A friend who did the crankcase work found that a large carbide burr in a die grinder was his preferred tool. He was not that impressed with my needle scaler.

Fight the urge to believe in fairy tales; all the Rajkot products need a complete tear down and inspection, and a full rework of the crankcase is one of those must dos.  They really are just a kit.

[sixoklok]

I did expect to see lots of crap in the bottom and was glad to see the inside is NOT painted. The engine is equipped with an oil filter, for what that's worth. I will blast the inside with a shop air varsol gun and check/dismantle a bit more when farm stuff slows down in fall. Thanks BruceM, I've gotten over the initial giddiness of hearing her in person, so I will probably end up dismantling everything around October.

Regarding burning wmo, it's the main reason I got interested in acquiring one of these many years ago. I have read much about it and am partial to glort's philosophy of keeping it simple in regards to oil cleaning and processing. Even though this is tractor country (average 3500ac), I've since come into a good steady supply of wvo which make's things somewhat simpler yet. I have lots of time to let oil settle because I have a good supply fuel stockpiled .

Some will drool: I spent some years helping out part-time at an auto scrap yard, moving cars around with a big forklift. This was a Cat diesel, but the manager refused to run the diesel fuel that they recovered from vehicles' tanks. It was more convenient to have me take it for nothing, so I eventually accumulated around 300 gal. of it (still have it). Then the owner noticed and decided it was worth buying a large tank and using it.

The GTC will contribute to a grid tied inverter with solar panels and be plumbed to help heat the greenhouse on the 2nd floor of the barn.

LowGear: Yes, fulfilling dreams is most satisfying. This dream has been drawn on paper for many years and the puzzle pieces are slowly coming together. Pictures will come when things are more 'presentable'.

 

[BruceM]

No paint is nice!  My Listeroid had a problem with continued sand scoring of the crank bearings- showed most on the upper bearing shell. I searched and could not find the source while going through many sets of bearings. Ended up finding gob of hard black grease mixed with casting sand put under the crown of the piston. It was not visible until the wrist pin and con rod were removed from the piston.  It was clearly intentional and well hidden.

So this is part of why I say, do not trust the Rojkot assemblers and parts inspection...take it to bits, inspect carefully.  It's a lovely, very simple engine and with 38AC's great article it's not mysterious or terribly time consuming to do it once, right.

[veggie]

Welcome.
I had a GTC. They are one of the better Listeroids in my opinion.
Same as you...the crankcase was very clean and the engine did not need any attention.
I would not hesitate to recommend the GTC engines.

Veggie

[BruceM]

I think the preponderance of evidence is that while every "Brand" assembler in Rajkot has made some good engines, they have also made some incredible bloopers.  All the parts come from the same Rajkot suppliers, so the whole concept of "brands" and some being better and having what would pass for reliable QC has proven to be fairy dust. 

Some pre-ban importers put a tremendous effort and expense to try and get consistently better quality from Rajkot... and found it was just not possible.  One container load would be better, but then the next was a disaster.

Better to just accept the reality and be your own QC.  Most can be made into good, smooth reliable runners without a fortune in parts.

38ac's guide is fabulously done and will assure you no problems down the road.

[listard-jp2]

I searched and could not find the source while going through many sets of bearings. Ended up finding gob of hard black grease mixed with casting sand put under the crown of the piston. It was not visible until the wrist pin and con rod were removed from the piston.  It was clearly intentional and well hidden.

That's bad when you have to contend with intentional sabotage, on top of the raft of usual Rajkot problems. Would the assembler have known that this engine was destined for a USA based customer, or was it just bad luck that you happened to end with this nasty surprise.

[LowGear]

I still don't get how they can be used in their home countries the way they are. Surely the farmers and people that buy what must be an expensive piece of equipment don't tare them down and rebuild them before they use them?

Me too.

Perhaps they only mess with the ones destined for export?

[mikenash]

These motors work in dirt-poor rural India doing things like irrigation pumping, grain-threshing etc

I think the locals' expectations of reliability are pretty low; often mechanical sympathy is non-existent; and the local-supply parts are as cheap as the labour of the local handyman who keeps the thing running

[mikenash]

Some of you guys have probably seen this one?

Kinda QED

Cheers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zY4hgSj3bAw

[guest23837]

Some of you guys have probably seen this one?

Kinda QED

Cheers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zY4hgSj3bAw

Not a great cooling system!

[BruceM]

Sharp eyes Johndoh, I missed the non-cooling system entirely myself.  A marketing video, no doubt.

[mikenash]

Yep.  Although the kinks in the "cooling loop" aren't reassuring

Check this fellow out . . . . from my experience in industry I know that the only environment harder on equipment than sawmills is mining/quarrying

So these guys have the old CS puttering away in the granite dust environment - check out the air cleaner . . .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxxrZpevlCI

I think the point is that their expectations of output from their machines is quite low, and, i suspect, they are philosophical about the need for repairs from time to time

Just an opinion, of course