Author Topic: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter  (Read 13515 times)

dieselspanner

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Re: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter
« Reply #15 on: March 18, 2017, 08:18:12 PM »
Ty,

For a cheap and accurate rev counter search the site, and the web, for details of using a cycle computer as a rev counter, I posted up and the found I'd been preempted by 8 years or so!

Once you know what the flywheels are spinning at you'll have somewhere to start, you'll also be able to see the droop more easily.

Cheers Stef
Tighten 'til it strips, weld nut to chassis, peen stud, adjust with angle grinder.

38ac

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Re: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter
« Reply #16 on: March 18, 2017, 09:19:04 PM »
That's interesting Listeroil, I wonder if the SOM sets had different weights than the standard engine or if at some point Lister lightened the 8/1 weight?  The only 850 RPM engine have have near at the moment is a VA that I mentioned earlier.
Collector and horder of about anything diesel

tyssniffen

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Re: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter
« Reply #17 on: March 20, 2017, 06:53:17 PM »
I have an off-grid 48v Outback Power single FX inverter/charger set up with all the typical charge controller.   

here's a redo on the load test:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjn8SiU2Qd0

first looking at the Alt where you can see the AVR
then glancing at the spring modification
then checking the cleaned linkages

then running through a load test where the gov doesn't bring back the RPMs.

the little space heater I'm using for a load test basically creates the same problem I'm having with the house; the load seems to be too great for the gen to recover from... making the governor the probable problem.
I'm exploring changing the settings on the house, so that it doesn't do as big a load...but it's pretty sad I can't get the listeroid to take a load my loud little gasser can.

I've explored changing the spring, but don't really understand what sort of spring to swap in.   Besides my original one seeming fine to my eye (it bends, it springs, it seems strong)
if I go to the "spring store" what spring would be the right one to ask for?

Tys
6/1 with 2 tank for WVO.  pushing power into off-grid house battery bank, in winter.

Samo

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Re: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter
« Reply #18 on: April 15, 2017, 10:49:46 AM »
Hi Tys,

In my (limited) experience, that's pretty much the standard for the governor of a listeroid... fine for chopping chaff but not so reliable for generating power. In the end I went for a home brew governor assistant in the form of a arduino controlled servo. That's the only solution that has worked reliably for me...

details here:
http://listerengine.com/smf/index.php?topic=7696.msg87179#msg87179

Samo
Lister CS 12/2 & JKSON 10/1 Listeroid

tyssniffen

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Re: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter
« Reply #19 on: April 24, 2017, 05:33:11 PM »
I think I asked this before, or someone has already told me, but

if I set up my ST3k to do 240v/60h  and then set up a transformer to step it down to 120v/60h right in front of the inverter, would that help? 
6/1 with 2 tank for WVO.  pushing power into off-grid house battery bank, in winter.

BruceM

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Re: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter
« Reply #20 on: April 24, 2017, 07:39:36 PM »
Unless you have a long wire run with wire too small, a step up/down transformer isn't useful and only adds more load since there will be a loss in conversion.  It won't clean up your waveform or make your inverter any happier.

tyssniffen

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Re: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter
« Reply #21 on: April 24, 2017, 09:56:10 PM »
I don't have voltage drop due to skinny wires, that's for sure.

I'm really frustrated by all this, even though I've told myself I'd work hard on this thing this year so I'll be ready for next December.

Actually started to put the old stover (smaller diameter) wheels back on to see if somehow this thing would work better at a higher RPM  - also chasing down the idea that the gov weights are specifically sized for the stover wheels -  and even with a wheel swap going relatively smoothly, I now remember why I got the wagon wheels.  the thing started jumping around so bad I have to go back to square one to even get the thing to sit on the bolts.

If I could reasonably buy my way out of this issue, what would I do?  get some other sort of alternator?   If I do pull the camshaft and stare directly at the gov weights... can I buy different ones?  from where? 

I'm an extra set of wheels and a second alt into this (extra $500?) and haven't had more than 10 hours of successful power pushing on this thing.  (it does power simple power tools fine, but I don't run those but 6 times a year for a few minutes)

hell, if I could hire someone to come solve my problems, I would. 
6/1 with 2 tank for WVO.  pushing power into off-grid house battery bank, in winter.

Samo

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Re: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter
« Reply #22 on: April 25, 2017, 12:12:16 AM »
Hi Tys

Got a couple of questions after watching your video again, the voltage out of your alternator isn't that steady, I was surprised because my single phase alternator is rock solid from around 45hz to 55hz, never see the voltage vary. So in my case I've only got to worry about HZ accuracy.

What type of AVR are you using?

I'm working on a modular arduino based governor, I'll sent you one to try when it's done... it will be a bit of a wait though, the parts won't arrive here until end of May.



John
Lister CS 12/2 & JKSON 10/1 Listeroid

Samo

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Re: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter
« Reply #23 on: April 25, 2017, 02:05:42 AM »
Sure Glort,

I built my own voltage / frequency sensing circuit for the unit I use on my setup. This time I'm going to try a simpler path - so others can more easily copy it - ordered a couple of these to try out. It will certainly give me line voltage and I expect I'll also be able to find a low voltage AC waveform and sniff the HZ value from that. Once I've got that the remainder is pretty simple.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/2mA-Active-Module-Single-Phase-Voltage-Sensor-AC-Voltage-Transformer-For-Arduino-/311683408404?hash=item4891c76214:g:j3QAAOSwV0RXvA5s

Samo
Lister CS 12/2 & JKSON 10/1 Listeroid

veggie

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Re: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter
« Reply #24 on: April 25, 2017, 08:01:53 PM »
Tyssniffen,

Your video looks pretty much standard for many Listeroids.
I have to set my no load rpm at 62 hz in order to get 60hz at 2.5 kw. (When driving my AC Generator).

Veggie
- 6/1 GM90 Listeroid - Delco 33si Alternator
- Changfa R175 - Lease/Neville Alternator
- JiangDong R165 Air cooled - 2 kw
- Changfa S195 (Waiting for a project)

tyssniffen

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Re: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter
« Reply #25 on: April 25, 2017, 10:05:44 PM »

Got a couple of questions after watching your video again, the voltage out of your alternator isn't that steady, I was surprised because my single phase alternator is rock solid from around 45hz to 55hz, never see the voltage vary. So in my case I've only got to worry about HZ accuracy.

What type of AVR are you using?

I'm working on a modular arduino based governor, I'll sent you one to try when it's done... it will be a bit of a wait though, the parts won't arrive here until end of May.

the AVR that came with the ST3k that I got from Georgia power. I've shown Tom -the owner- that video and he doesn't think there's a problem with it.   he's told me to do some checking with no load.  I was surprised by that variability as well.   Now I have the flywheels off, so I have to build things back up before I can even get back to where that video was made.

gonna have to start getting mail delivered to gen shed I'm in there so much lately.
6/1 with 2 tank for WVO.  pushing power into off-grid house battery bank, in winter.

tyssniffen

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Re: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter
« Reply #26 on: April 25, 2017, 10:06:31 PM »
Tyssniffen,

Your video looks pretty much standard for many Listeroids.
I have to set my no load rpm at 62 hz in order to get 60hz at 2.5 kw. (When driving my AC Generator).

Veggie

yeah, I've re-done the test starting at 62h with no load and I still see those drops.   
6/1 with 2 tank for WVO.  pushing power into off-grid house battery bank, in winter.

BruceM

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Re: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter
« Reply #27 on: April 25, 2017, 11:02:56 PM »
Your engine RPM variation is normal.  Your AVR appears to have failed. You should never see more than a few volts variation from the set voltage level, with no change based on load.  Since it was grossly over voltage at no or light load, it is not just a harmonic winding problem, the AVR is NOT WORKING.  These cheap AVRs do have a high failure rate.  If you are going to use them, have a spare.  You can get them direct from China fairly cheap. 





« Last Edit: April 25, 2017, 11:05:23 PM by BruceM »

Samo

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Re: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter
« Reply #28 on: April 26, 2017, 06:19:22 AM »
Thanks for the backup Bruce, I agree it's not right and requires replacement.

Tys, here's my vid, rock solid voltage regardless of the change in Hz and Load

https://youtu.be/ljwmsc6MLuQ

Samo
Lister CS 12/2 & JKSON 10/1 Listeroid

Samo

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Re: testing governor, voltage regulator: video of meter
« Reply #29 on: April 26, 2017, 06:21:13 AM »
Glort,

Glad I could help, makes a change, mostly it's the folks on this forum helping me :)

I'll share my next gen Governor once all the parts come in...

Samo
Lister CS 12/2 & JKSON 10/1 Listeroid