Author Topic: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications  (Read 291373 times)

EdDee

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Re: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications
« Reply #390 on: September 23, 2016, 12:26:27 PM »
Hey all ye "Learned Fellows" out there....

Here's an interesting one.....

If you look at the previous post, a small mystery to me....

I tightened up the valve clearances for a trial yesterday, and lo and behold.... After the run and before today's run, with the smaller clearances, a LOT less sump oil was used....Coincidence? I don't know....? Has anybody had similar?

Too early for me to tell as yet, need to run a few days with loose/tight settings to see if its a ripple in the matrix, or if it forms a trend.... But.... I would appreciate a comment or two from you gents out there.... Maybe I am missing something....

Keep it oiling...

Regds
Ed

PS - Just for sh!ts and giggles, to settle a heated discussion on the combustibility of WVO, I pushed about 1/2L or so through the engine while the "non-believer" was present and standing with saucer-sized eyes.... What I was reminded of while doing it, is that WVO is way more suited from a combustion/cleanliness/smell point of view to WMO.... Just wish I could get lots of it!! (The ladies tend to get a bit edgy when the the chip fryer suddenly empties itself..... I blame evaporation of course..... But I think they might be onto me now....)
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dieselgman

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Re: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications
« Reply #391 on: September 23, 2016, 03:35:21 PM »
I would tend to want a reading on crankcase vacuum under both valve adjustment conditions to diagnose the oil consumption question with any degree of "scientific" method.

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EdDee

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Re: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications
« Reply #392 on: September 24, 2016, 09:48:08 AM »
Hey Glort,

Just had a client arrive with a 308 that needs some attention... so much for my lazy start to the day.... but that's another story....

What did transpire is that he mentioned to me that he has a few ibc"s worth of lard, the commercial grade stuff, that he has to dispose of... this could be quite interesting indeed... comes from some local emporiums in the fast food line, ex chip fryers.... I have asked him for a sample, which he says he will hack out and get to me next week.... I see another heat exchanger in my immediate future for getting this stuff into a liquid to stuff down the ip to make more fun.... Have you had any experience with this stuff yet?

A LONG time ago, many years, I processed similar stuff with heating and drying, and stuck it through an engine... If I remember correctly, it worked fine, but was a PITA to do on a micro/small scale... to do occasional runs on it, of small qtys less than 20L at a time, the time overheads and additional heating requirements made it a non-worthwhile endeavour....but.... with around 5000 L of the stuff looking for a home, this might just be worthwhile.... Your thoughts?

In fact, I can already see a bit of exhaust plumbing heading to a heating tank.... I must be insane... its not like I actually enjoy making work for myself, is it?

I checked the oil level of TM, it was a little down, but not majorly... I did fill it to the max mark, which is slightly over full, so let's see how it pans out.... At least the beast runs mechanically quieter with tighter tappets... one bonus...

As I sit here typing, TM is thumping away in the background, hauling around 3.5kw electrical, pumping out around 5kw heat and, above all, stopping about 30L of sludge from being released into the environment in a less "friendly" way..... damn Glort, you better watch out, looks like I am becoming a greenie.....

The venting to the inlet for me is a much easier(read that as lazy) way of keeping things in the gen shed cleaner... the shed is well ventilated, to put it mildly, with about a 300mm gap from ground level to the bottom of the sides all the way round, with the exception of the back wall, which is part of the house... While that makes for a nice airy and drafty enclosure, it also makes for a lot of dust, which adheres to any mildly oily or damp surface, and is an absolute pain to keep clean... particularly as anyone arriving onto the premises, parks literally within spitting distance of the beast.... Given that the doors are 2x1m glass, everything is pretty exposed, so the "showcase" has to be kept presentable... Way easier to clean a bit of pipe on the inside, than wipe down an entire genset every couple of days... and... NO.... I don't spend the weekend with a tiny paintbrush painting the names on the tyres either!!

I might still take you up on the veg oil... do you think they will allow a few ibc as hand luggage?

I have adjusted the visco a bit on this batch of gunk, I am now running on a 25% parrafin to 75% of 50W or so gunk, seems quite a bit better at starting and running so far. So far, the combustability seems more dependant on viscosity than content, if that makes any sense, on a daily basis. I have found that on a very hot day, thick fuel works just as well, if not better than dino, but as air temperatures drop, so does the heat content of the compression stroke, so the heavier oils tend to soot up a bit more... thin them out, allowing them to atomise a bit better, and away you go...

I have put a wee bit more thought into the semi automated WI heavy dose cycling and don't think it will be worthwhile in the long run, not with the varying types of gunk I feed the beast.... If I had a large batch of gunk, of uniform nature, automation becomes more viable... Yes, I can install a variable dose pump with pinpoint egt and knock monitoring, but that will be just a few more things to go wrong in the long run... I gonna keep it simple... want water, open tap... want power, start gen.... have smoke, mix fuel thinner... not quite idiot proof, but certainly more "visual" and simple for a fool like me to understand....

My thinking and dumb way of explaining the oil consumption/cc breathing in relation to valve clearances is probably way off track, but here it goes anyway... Less clearance means the valves open and close slightly before and slightly after they would with larger clearances. The exhaust starts venting a little earlier, the inlet valve overlap is a little longer, there might be less "vacuum" in the cylinder due to this (the exhaust gas has a fair momentum in a long exhaust run)  ... this might just cause a little less oil to be drawn past the piston on each stroke... Who knows? Probably all BS anyway and it is all due to crappy worn bore, shitty and stuck oil control rings, and, above all, due to the fact I tripped over a black cat while walking under a ladder...

Again I ramble...

Keep it chugging...
Cheers
Ed
12/1 750RPM/9HP Roid 5kVA- WMO Disposal/Electricity & Hot Water Gen
12/1 650RPM/8HP Roid 4.5kVa - Demon Dino
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EdDee

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Re: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications
« Reply #393 on: September 27, 2016, 03:50:38 PM »
Keep it spinning old boy!!

Been on Listeroid power+WMO since around midday today... It's already almost 17h00... Looks like some miscreants have probably thrown a chain over the 22Kv line feeding the premises and have shorted out the local area... Saw the supply boys a few hours ago, but nothing has come down the wires since, with the exception of a brief 2 minute or so burst of electrons.... just enough time to shut down TM, walk back to my office, and then return to TM to get him started again...

Well, if nothing else, he is gonna get a good run because he was due to do the evening shift anyway.... Lets see what transpires....

I am currently trying out a bit of 10% thinning on the 50W gunk.... He is a bit smokey on it.... Tomorrow I will go back to the 20% thinning and see if there's any improvement... But then again... This is another drum of gunk, so the rules might will have changed anyway!!

Keep it spinning!!

Cheers
Ed

PS and BTW.... The jury is still out about oil consumption vs valve clearances.... But I am gonna add another variable to the mix... How about fuel combustibility influencing it too?
« Last Edit: September 27, 2016, 03:53:17 PM by EdDee »
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EdDee

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Re: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications
« Reply #394 on: September 28, 2016, 09:10:56 AM »
Hey Glort,

Sounds like the fattystuff is indeed a plan worth pursuing! I will indeed!!

From what I remember, it was quite easy to dry and filter as well, nothing overly difficult at all. You have confirmed this... Filtering, if I remembrer, was more a case of removing "crispy bits" than super micro-fine stuff like you get in WMO. The WMO is a bastard to filter - one batch will filter beautifully, the next (from the same drum at a slightly different level) will clog 2 or 3 socks in a row.... Get past it, and it filters fine after that again... Very disconcerting!! (Yep, I know, I am not letting my gunk settle for long enough before filtering, but thats another saga all on its own..)

What I have found very worthwhile, is to let the "storage drums" for the gunk settle for at least 2-3 days before tapping off the usable stuff... I pull from around 4" above bottom and then drain the dregs for later processing when empty.

With the addition of the fat burning system, the fuel supply is going to become interesting. I am going to try and keep the existing dual fuel setup and add the additional system to it... Looks like its gonna get a tad crowded to say the least... I am in two minds as to whether I use a heatex from the coolant, the exhaust, or...no make that three minds... just heat it electrically ex the genhead.... Probably electrical would be the easiest, certainly in the beginning, that would allow me to even preheat it using utility power before a run... (Starting to ramble again....)

Right, let me give the lads a shout and see if they've got the IBC's of waste into an accessible area...

Keep it cooking...

Cheers
Ed

Edit: A little bit of feedback - 21hrs Run on WMO, Sump oil Consumption around the 4 to 500ml mark or so... A bit heavy, but liveable at the mo... Oil consumption seems erratic, it appears as if the oil control rings are a little gunked up....
« Last Edit: September 28, 2016, 11:26:06 AM by EdDee »
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EdDee

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Re: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications
« Reply #395 on: September 29, 2016, 11:24:00 AM »
Hey Glort....

Welcome to the rag-tag world of WMO handling.... Its vile, disgusting, horrible, toxic, smelly, dirty stuff that is best contained in a totally enclosed metal container....Like a sump! (Or laser toner/inkjet cartridges)

There is a certain knack to handling the stuff - Assume, without a doubt, that there will be spillage whenever you decant, pipe, filter or process it - It ALWAYS happens - What I do is use one of those old "Fire Hose Reel Covers" - a glass fibre clamshell type design, around 3' or so square but separated diagonally from front to back along the sides... They make awesome trays to work or stand your kit in while you are pouring or processing. They have caught many a minor spill and allow for quick cleanup afterwards.

Cleanup once it gets into anything absorbent is easy - use black paint.... You wont notice any stains afterwards.... but seriously though, If you can find something that is cheap and easy to lift this shit out of cement, you will become a millionaire very quickly!!

My thinking on settling - a particle of dirt in diesel takes on average 24hrs to travel 1m under gravity - obviously, metals a little quicker, sand a little slower... the average drum is about 1/2m diameter.... so around 1/2 a day for most of the crap to settle out (assuming around 10 to 15w viscosity)... now, I know, the laws of settling and other black magic type things are not linear, but, at 50w, we can assume around 3 to 4 times longer settling will be required for heavy-ish solids in suspension(the nasty sh!t that chews pumps and rings etc)... so, in heavy fuel oils, around 3 days or a bit longer to settle a meter... The drum is about 1/2 a m so in heavy stuff, I need to settle a minimum of 2 days to be safe.... I try and allow at least double that.

The settling times I am allowing, seem quite successful so far... After two fills on a drum, with their respective settling times and used off over a period of around 20days average each per fill, I eventually, carefully canted the drum forward to allow the sludge to roll forward to cover the exit hole for removal. I left it canted forward for most of the day and started tapping off the shit at the bottom. What I got was in the region of 10L worth of what can best be described as "Effluent" .... Extremely fine, almost muddy, horrible greasy stuff.... Now bear in mind, the oil was filtered down to around 5-7mic on its way into the drum, so there is no obvious sand or rough stuff, just very fine almost carbonaceous type material present... I wasn't going to put it under my microscope, too much cleaning involved!!

I have, for quite a while now, been putting some choice bits aside, to build up a mini centrifuge... Nothing fancy, no automation, just a good old manual thingy to run some oil through... Still need to find a torque converter to fit the pressure cooker that went missing from the kitchen a couple of months ago....... Damn, these women are careless.... how do you lose a pressure cooker.... Strange enough, I have a similar unit that I have in my workshop, been there for years... ... ... ..

Utility power for heating.... I know its blasphemy, but.... So much easier... It will only be for the odd occasion that the thing bungs up and goes solid on me because it wasn't dino/WMO flushed before shutdown.... I am kinda resistant to taking a blowtorch to the piping to get things flowing...

I am staying away from battery power as much as possible, I loathe the things... mainly because in this part of the world, the miscreants will break into vehicles and even gate motor units to steal the batteries... Too much temptation I guess....

Summer temps hit up to about 40C and winter goes down to around 0C on the very, very odd occasion... Normally around 4C in the workshop overnight and up to about 35C average max.... Solidification will be a thing to deal with, but not too bad I reckon....

I will attend to TM's thirstiness for sump oil...eventually... Just need a bit of time to get to it...no rush... I have been tempted to put in a float system, but I am pretty sure that the problem of oil consumption is more due to the dipper being a little too large/long and just oiling things up a wee bit too much... I will make a change there when I get around to it too.... (Also, I tend to keep his oil at weir level which is a bit high anyway....) Bear in mind, he has around 2500 hrs on "not the best of fuels" and the cylinder is a bit worn....

Enough rambling....Yet Again....

Keep it slurping!!
Cheers
Ed

12/1 750RPM/9HP Roid 5kVA- WMO Disposal/Electricity & Hot Water Gen
12/1 650RPM/8HP Roid 4.5kVa - Demon Dino
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EdDee

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Re: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications
« Reply #396 on: October 01, 2016, 09:40:20 AM »
Hey Girls.....

Eventually got round to getting the compressed air powered pump up and running... here's a little video of it pumping some 45W-ish  oil through a sock filter...

http://www.warriorpaintball.co.za/private/Dirty Oil Piston Pump 20160930

Its nothing fancy, just a slow old chugger to get the job done... no chance of fire, no electrics, can set pump pressure easily, no chance of damage if the flow is stalled, to stop it, you can either turn off the air supply or close the output valve....simple and safe...it can be left running unattended without a chance of burning the place down...

I still need to find a single spring large enough to do the return stroke, the gaggle of springs to pull the ram back and draw in the oil are a temp measure until I can get off my butt and measure the actual tension required.... all in all around 200kg I reckon....

Right, time to put some tools away and tidy up the workshop a bit... once that's done, some legs to put on the filter unit and a batch of gunk to filter... isn't this so much fun!

Keep it pumping...
Cheers
Ed

Edit: A few hours later.... Tools still not put away....

Right, Picture the scene.... A minor snafu in the gunky non-return valve department, on the inlet side of the pump, handling the incoming side of the dirty oil..... A small piece of plastic, a' la the type used in the lids of the disposable 500ml plastic containers of oil got sucked into the non-return valve (The pickup strainer is still not installed yet..) and caused a bit of non-pumping to occur... (This happened last thing last night when I left it running on residual air from the compressor...) No Problem, whip the top off the little valve, remove said gunk and screw the top on again... quick and easy, that's why I am using this style valve...

All going according to plan, even lifted the pump up and put it on an empty 200L drum so I don't even have to disconnect the oil feeds, the system will drain back to the tank as soon as I open the valve.... Wonderful... Works like a charm... There's the gunk, sitting under the valve flap... where's the leatherman? .... got it...nope....got it....slipped again....got it....Tug/Pull/Wiggle.... problem solved!!

When....

All of a sudden...

Whoooooosh!!

1.5L of airborne sump Shite!!

Duhh.....

I turned on the compressor on the way into the workshop.... It took a couple of minutes to get to the 30PSI pressure to trip the control valve and cycle the cylinder.... Whereupon, you guessed it.... One face full/ceiling full/workshop full of not so finely atomized sump crap decided to leave the pump at a rather large dose of speed as there was literally nothing holding it back except a rather large 20mm cover hole....

What an asshole!! I now have a yellow bulldozer with black spots, a floor with a not-so-even coating of oil, in fact, pretty much everything in a 3m radius needs a liberal wiping down... even the ceiling!

I am now going to go and hit the shower, continue cursing my stupidity, kick back in front of the screen and watch Star Trek... The old stuff...

In among the emergency bit of "do I really have to clean this cr@p up" actions, I at least put the pressure regulator on the pump on the cylinder air feed side of things, now the control circuitry can run at high pressure and the pumping pressure can be regulated independently...I suppose, looking on the bright side... Another small step forward....Just a very, very, very messy step at that....(Oh, and BTW Glort, remember me telling you about that drip tray I use.... Well, I lifted the damn pump out of the tray onto the drum to work on it, then carefully slid the tray out of the way so I wouldn't fall over it.... Yep, you guessed it.... most of the oil, on its return journey to ground level landed right where the tray used to be....Fuggit!)

And.... I still haven't put the legs on the oil filter unit so it can recline safely out of the way... Stuffit!! It can hang on the gantry a few days longer while we clean this mess up....
« Last Edit: October 01, 2016, 02:32:47 PM by EdDee »
12/1 750RPM/9HP Roid 5kVA- WMO Disposal/Electricity & Hot Water Gen
12/1 650RPM/8HP Roid 4.5kVa - Demon Dino
Chinese Yanmar - Silent Runner with AutoStart
Classic Komatsu 1963 Dozer/Fergusson 35 Gold Belly ...
Bikes,Cars,Gunsmithing & Paintball...Oh yes, a 5Ha open air Workshop to play in!

EdDee

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Re: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications
« Reply #397 on: October 04, 2016, 04:35:35 PM »
Hey Glort,

We have the odd rat problem over here too... mostly over winter when food becomes a bit scarce... They tend to become(or try to become) house rats... Nothing a 12ga/308/30-06....or .22 doesn't sort out... Plays hell with the paintwork though.....

Oil spills are a bit of a pain, but nothing that can't be "lived with" or catered for on a daily basis... I generally try and process less than 200L at a time for this very reason... But, invariably, the small spills occur during setup or knockdown... Very little gets spilt during the processing itself.

The pump is a slow cycler for sure.... Intended to be so, the net result is very little, if not nothing in the line of emulsification during transfer or filtering... I have got a few, in fact more than a few, other types of pumps to use for transfer and filtering, but tossed out the ideas after thinking what the nett effect would be in the grand scheme of things...

My next target drum of gunk is a 200L batch that has had all the tailings from the last year or so go into it... All of the really bad stuff that was in small quantity and didn't warrant individual attention.... Its gonna be interesting for sure!! (I think I will pump the bottom out of the drum first, that should be mostly water, then the slime and sediment...This will all go towards fire lighting and pole painting... Once I get to the better stuff, I will raise the dip tube a bit and then push it through a filter to see what comes out.....Could be interesting, if nothing else!!)

Caustic soda works a treat on the oil spills... I always have a fair amount on hand - Its part of a recipe I use for gun blueing - and there is always a bit of concentrated and old chem from the blueing tanks to be re-purposed to driveway cleaner... Basically the mix is part Na-OH and KNO3... A bit of a waste of good saltpeter... Always better for the saltpeter to be used to make the "Holy Black Powder" that is getting so hard to get hold of these days if you are into that sort of thing... Interestingly, the old blueing salts, when watered down a bit, make AMAZING fertilizer....

Was promised another 200L of gunk today... Still waiting for word on the IBC's of fat to materialize though, hope that it doesn't fall through....(In the interim I did pick up 210L of mildly contaminated diesel...)

Oh yes... After more than a year of running, I finally managed to put a "Sludge Drain" tap on my day tank... Another "Lazy" addition.... Now I don't have to wash out the tank at service time....or....maybe even....I can just use a little from the tap every so often to top up the oil can I use for the valves and push rods... There's probably way less dirt in solution in the bit of sludge that accumulated in the day tank than gets blown onto the engine proper during a 24hr period, and, ...water....what of it? Nothing that a bit of heat from the cylinder head wouldn't dry out in short order...

Again I ramble....

Keeeeeeeep it spinning!!!

Cheers
Ed
12/1 750RPM/9HP Roid 5kVA- WMO Disposal/Electricity & Hot Water Gen
12/1 650RPM/8HP Roid 4.5kVa - Demon Dino
Chinese Yanmar - Silent Runner with AutoStart
Classic Komatsu 1963 Dozer/Fergusson 35 Gold Belly ...
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EdDee

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Re: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications
« Reply #398 on: October 05, 2016, 10:00:53 AM »
Hey Glort,

The stuff I play with can be difficult, or easy, to get depending on the quantity in mind... Larger quantities come available, but I don't have the facilities to store and process the big batches - I was offered a 5Kl metal storage tank for free the other day - It is quite a nice unit, uses compressed air to pump the contents out - I think it originates from a motor manufacturer - It was used apparently for bulk storage of ATF for their assembly line... I am still considering it, but am not wild about having an immovable object of that size on my property....

Around this part of the world, there is a drive to keep WMO and the like out of the environment... As to its success, I am not so sure... The net result is that most of the smaller garages and the like are tied up with the WMO disposal lads and smaller qty's are not too easy to get hold of(unless its pretty fetid stuff). The bigger concerns normally do have a bit of excess that they could probably pass my way, but, they are in qty's too big for me to handle and transport. I pretty much just keep a lookout for the 200L and smaller batches and process them as they come along. So far, because TM is not part of the critical day to day running of the place, I run him for longer when fuel is available and less when it becomes scarce... Barring maybe 2 or 3 days over the last few months, he has run a minimum of 3hrs a day and up to 15hrs a day on a few occasions...

As to the quality of the stuff... Its pretty ghastly, in the circles I get the stuff from, it appears that the vehicles are serviced when they don't run anymore... I have, on more than one occasion, found quite a serious amount of bearing material in the oil... not to mention dead geckos and rats too!! (Definitely fossil fuel in the making!!)

I think that I probably could be choosy about the fuel if I really wanted to, but where would be the fun in that? Virtually everybody, everywhere, on every forum or bit of research I have done, has had major problems when running WMO in a diesel system. I will admit, it is a challenging environment, but at this point, for me anyway, it does not appear that the problems are insurmountable. Difficult and tedious to manage, but not impossible. It does cost a bit in the line of "School Fees" to get the system into place, but so far its been quite a bit of fun. (Probably raised a few eyebrows here as well!!) - And definitely is a talking point for the petrol-heads that drop by around here every so often...!

Its actually quite amazing to see how the small, really small time hobbyists in the motor world respond to seeing TM thumping away and disposing of the sludge in a very, very, environmentally friendly way. I am talking about chaps that wouldn't bat an eyelid to leaving a drum of goop on the side of the road (at best) to be mixed up in the weekly rubbish collection. (I think their consciences are probably catching up with them..) We are talking about the gung-ho absolute opposite of bunny-hugger class of person here... Not long after they see what I am doing, and a couple of small drums of goop are dropped off when they are next in the area...(Sometimes even with a bit of a challenge - "I bet you cant use this stuff" - Needless to say, on occasion, when there is a beer or two in the wager, a wee bit gets processed immediately and a small run is done for them...with the wager being settled of course!)

Its all fun, and learning of course!! (and making roundworld a little better off in the process...)

What have I learned overall...I mean really learned in this escapade? Simple - Make sure the insides of the beast are mechanically sound and in spec, feed it anything that burns as long as it doesn't have gravel and chunky bits in it, keep water pouring into the inlet to keep carbon down, keep the ass-end clean as possible so it can breathe out, balance the bastard as well as you can, and, in my case, take as much time as you can with settling the fuel.... That's just about all!! (Oh yes, think lazy!! Don't be ashamed to bolt something on or together to make your life easier... The easier things are to use, the more you will use them!) There are probably a good few other things mentioned along the way, each probably important in its own way, but most of them fall into the "lazy" thinking way of things...

Again, I ramble....

Keep the crankshafts cranking, the tappets tapping and the pistons pis ......working too!!

Cheers
Ed

PS - Hey Glort, how about a micro version of a Star Trek Transporter? "Hey Scotty: beam 10 microns of white metal onto the journal when you get a chance... The warp coil is getting a bit knocky...."
12/1 750RPM/9HP Roid 5kVA- WMO Disposal/Electricity & Hot Water Gen
12/1 650RPM/8HP Roid 4.5kVa - Demon Dino
Chinese Yanmar - Silent Runner with AutoStart
Classic Komatsu 1963 Dozer/Fergusson 35 Gold Belly ...
Bikes,Cars,Gunsmithing & Paintball...Oh yes, a 5Ha open air Workshop to play in!

EdDee

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Re: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications
« Reply #399 on: October 11, 2016, 09:54:17 AM »
Hey Glort,

Agreed... Simple is very often best... Not for everybody though - There will always be some price to pay for using "sub-standard" fuel, ie a fuel in an engine that it was not designed for... In my case, the crap I am feeding it seems to be giving the IP a few problems - this is probably due to water as all I am currently doing is settling and filtering, no actual thermal de-watering anymore.. I have pushed around 800L of "non-cooked" oil through it so far, it is a little hard to start, due to ip and injector wear, but still runs fine... A bit smokey on occasion, but grab the magic mirror, the black cat and do a solstice dance and things clean up in an hour or two.

I have seen quite a bit of "over-injection" with the gunk I have been getting from one of the lads and I have found a way to minimise the problem, or at least manage it to a large extent.

My roid doesn't have an over-fuel stop on the IP rack. The other day I noticed that under overload conditions, the rack was wide open and TM was belching smoke like a steam train. The overload occurred shortly after startup, before he got to operating temp. When TM is still cold, depending on fuel mix used, he can either easily make electrical target current or easily not make it if the fuel is bad. With a bad batch of fuel, if he doesn't make target current, the electrical safeguards don't get a chance to kick in and he doesn't "unload" under high current...

What I found was that if I manually closed the rack slightly and limited the overfuel condition, he picked up revs and made slightly better power (and way less smoke)... He was so overfueled that he was actually dropping off of his power curve and "flooding" a bit... I tightened up the cable that actuates the shutoff lever to the house and am using that as a rack stop. It does mean that he is a tad harder to start, but with the 220v starter its not a major biggie.

It will be interesting to see what or how it affects fuel consumption (if at all) .... Considering that most of the time we run him in the evenings, he is under full load/near overload condition..... (I did note that sudden loads would allow him to go full-rack on the odd occasion for a couple of secs..)

Enough rambling....

Keep it chugging...

Cheers
Ed
12/1 750RPM/9HP Roid 5kVA- WMO Disposal/Electricity & Hot Water Gen
12/1 650RPM/8HP Roid 4.5kVa - Demon Dino
Chinese Yanmar - Silent Runner with AutoStart
Classic Komatsu 1963 Dozer/Fergusson 35 Gold Belly ...
Bikes,Cars,Gunsmithing & Paintball...Oh yes, a 5Ha open air Workshop to play in!

EdDee

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Re: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications
« Reply #400 on: October 13, 2016, 09:31:53 AM »
Hey Glort,

Hmmm.... Turbo.... Nitro.... Roots Blower.... Titanium Conrod.... Aluminum casing.... Whitewall Flywheels.... Common Rail(on a single?)....
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Naah....Will save those mods for my hi performance aluminum Aero- Lister, you know, the one I am going to fit into the Sopwith....
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Then again.... Maybe a matched pair in a Chinook would save me building a runway....


Lol...

Ed
12/1 750RPM/9HP Roid 5kVA- WMO Disposal/Electricity & Hot Water Gen
12/1 650RPM/8HP Roid 4.5kVa - Demon Dino
Chinese Yanmar - Silent Runner with AutoStart
Classic Komatsu 1963 Dozer/Fergusson 35 Gold Belly ...
Bikes,Cars,Gunsmithing & Paintball...Oh yes, a 5Ha open air Workshop to play in!

EdDee

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Re: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications
« Reply #401 on: October 14, 2016, 09:42:10 AM »
Hey Glort,

There is a "knack" to starting an engine.... Particularly with a crank handle!

There have been a few wagers made on the premises here too.... Particularly in the line of "I bet you couldn't start that thing by hand" - Easily won I might add, cheating a bit I suppose... Once TM has been running for a few minutes, he is VERY easy to start! I can even start him without using the de-compressor - beat that!! (There is a trick to it of course: Walk the flywheels back to about 1/4 way into the previous compression stroke, or bounce between compression strokes and really put your back into the full 1 1/2 turns of the crank to get him over the business stroke and away you go!) You have to "commit" to it and not approach it lightly...(Kinda like the the Bacon and Eggs breakfast...The Chicken is involved, but the Pig is committed!)

This was a skill that I had to acquire years back when visiting one old farmer... He removed the de-compressor on a CS to prevent his workers from starting the beast... Another boring story, but that being said, he showed me the way to get it going and it never fails to amaze folks who try to do it themselves!!

Never had a bounce back that I couldn't cope with either.... Except for the one time that some silly bugger had about 1/2 L of petrol poured into the air intake to try and get things going... There were a few cartwheels involved if I remember...but...sometimes its difficult to remember when you get flung across a barn and into the wall....What it does make you remember, is to carefully check for "foreign liquids" before you even think of grabbing the handle....

Keep it cranking...

Cheers
Ed

12/1 750RPM/9HP Roid 5kVA- WMO Disposal/Electricity & Hot Water Gen
12/1 650RPM/8HP Roid 4.5kVa - Demon Dino
Chinese Yanmar - Silent Runner with AutoStart
Classic Komatsu 1963 Dozer/Fergusson 35 Gold Belly ...
Bikes,Cars,Gunsmithing & Paintball...Oh yes, a 5Ha open air Workshop to play in!

mike90045

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Re: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications
« Reply #402 on: October 15, 2016, 07:52:46 AM »
I think I'm too old to try the bounce method,  I'll stick to the de-compressor
 Yow !!

carlb23

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Re: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications
« Reply #403 on: October 15, 2016, 12:33:07 PM »
While i have no issues with starting my lister with the de compressor i will not attempt to try to start it without it for fear of breaking my arm or something else.  That being said we only use our lister for backup and i have an air starter on mine and 100 gallons of compressed air on hand at all times.

BruceM

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Re: The Listeroid Chronicles-WMO and Other Listeroid Modifications
« Reply #404 on: October 15, 2016, 06:28:22 PM »
Amen, Carl.  Gast 4AM with rubber roller has been doing the job for me for the last 10 years of regular use.  Still on the original roller.