Author Topic: My progress for the day........  (Read 4637 times)

George A

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My progress for the day........
« on: March 05, 2015, 11:44:36 PM »
In my previous post, I questioned whether the lower governor bell crank should give full rack travel if the engine is stopped. Since I just discovered a post on how to adjust the governor linkage I carefully did that, then oiled every bit of linkage and fired her up. We'll soon find out if that governor is working or not. Hey, no guts no glory right?

Because it was cold, it hunted a bit then settled down to a fairly steady beat. Adjusted the speed to produce 125 volts and plugged in a 1500 watt heater. Voltage dropped to 112. Plugged in another heater...1000 watts. Voltage dropped to 105. This was at the limit of my 2500 watt military surplus generator but just for giggles I plugged in a 1/2" drill and pulled the trigger. Voltage dropped to 90-100 with the ammeter showing a 22 amp load.......and the 20 amp circuit breaker didn't pop! The engine was working now but still putting out useable power. I then unplugged one of the heaters........and things started to happen!

The rpms increased rapidly and showed no sign of being controlled, so I hit the fuel cut off and brought everything to a screeching halt....literally.....seems I forgot to grease my generator bearings. Got the grease gun and pumped in several shots so things quieted down. Brand new bearings too........idiot.

Why the lack of governor control though? Well, I had changed out the governor spring based on the post that suggested the ones from Home Depot. The original was still laying in my roll around tool cart, so I removed the new spring and reinstalled the factory one. Backed off the speed control and started it up again. Brought the speed up to produce 125 volts again and started plugging in heaters. First heater dropped the voltage to 115, second one to 108-110. Pulled the trigger on the 1/2" drill and the volts dropped to 100 (the drill can pull up to 7 amps loaded), and I was pulling 22 amps at that voltage. I shut off the drill and then unplugged the first heater. Voltage went back to 115. Unplugged the second heater and the voltage returned to 125. The voltage "wavers" slightly due to the engine pulses, but holds reasonably close. Evidently my engine prefers the factory spring.

I have NO idea what the frequency is because my reed type meter had ALL reeds vibrating! Guess I'd better go to a digital type instead.

These engines are definitely individuals and tinkering is mandatory. That's okay though, as I enjoy fiddling with something until I get it right. I still have work to do on my cooling system and some other minor things but basically the beast produces useable power. I'll tweak and improve it over time. Oh, my I beam frame is a little bit light and I can feel the engine pulses in the concrete garage slab even though it's on heavy casters.

What a machine......I'm hooked!  ;D
« Last Edit: March 05, 2015, 11:54:10 PM by George A »
I've joined "the dark side"....if it has a spark plug, it's obsolete technology.

dieselgman

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Re: My progress for the day........
« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2015, 12:35:46 AM »
Welcome to the brotherhood!   :laugh:

Your experience is a bit of a cautionary tale about making too many changes at once... best to tackle one issue at a time! Sounds like you are getting her tamed!

dieselgman
« Last Edit: March 06, 2015, 12:37:22 AM by dieselgman »
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32 coupe

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Re: My progress for the day........
« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2015, 12:52:47 AM »
Good work !!
We like success stories.

Gary
Metro 6/1 turning a ST 7.5 KW gen head
Changfa 1115 turning a ST 15 KW gen head
Ashwamegh 2/25
John Deere 110 TBL
New Holland TC 30

"I was sitting here reading this thinking what an idiot you are until I realized it was one of my earlier posts !"

BruceM

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Re: My progress for the day........
« Reply #3 on: March 06, 2015, 02:08:10 AM »
My Metro 6/1 didn't like the designated Home Depot spring, either.  I did find a better combination of springs by trial and error.  Too soft hunts and may go unstable, too hard droops with load.  I added a 2nd  very soft spring to another that was just a bit too soft and it came out just right.

If you don't like the voltage drop with load, Central Georgia Generator has some AVRs at good prices. 

Bravo on getting your Listeroid going!

George A

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Re: My progress for the day........
« Reply #4 on: March 06, 2015, 03:06:31 PM »
Thanks for the encouragement everyone.......made my day. I may still play around with various spring settings or combinations. Today I'm going to buy a longer belt and move the generator over in order to get better access to the crankcase door. As mentioned......one change at a time!  :angel:

Bruce, Georgia Generator list AVR's but mentions that they're for brushless generators (?). Mine is probably WWII or Korean War vintage and definitely has brushes, so I assume they wouldn't work.
I've joined "the dark side"....if it has a spark plug, it's obsolete technology.

Hugh Conway

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Re: My progress for the day........
« Reply #5 on: March 06, 2015, 05:22:53 PM »
@ George and Bruce:

Interesting (though not totally surprising) that the Home Depot springs did not work for you. They have however, worked fine in several applications. There were 2 different spring strengths in those posts on the WOK. I have had excellent results with one of those springs. Been using it for several hundred hours run time, still have same results: about 1 to 1.5 Hz difference between no load and 3200W load. Voltage varies from 125  no load down to 115 full load. Very little overshot on dumping the load. I am driving a 3Kw PMG.  Another one of those YMMV situations.......
BTW, using a 92 inch 8 rib belt.

Recently have gotten my Dursley 6/1 Startomatic engine running after rebuild. (Thanks to Gary @ DES and Jim @ Justliveoffgrid for parts)) Still do not have a generator belted up, so cannot say how it works under load with the original or Home Depot Gov spring. Will be interesting to find out!

A Kill-a-Watt meter (or two) is your friend for Hz, W, V, good inexpensive and versatile tool.

Cheers,
Hugh
JKson 6/1  (Utterpower PMG ) Off-grid
Lister 6/1 Start-O-Matic engine......running with PMG
1978 Royal Enfield (glutton for punishment by Indian iron)
1963 BMW R-27 project

George A

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Re: My progress for the day........
« Reply #6 on: March 06, 2015, 06:15:14 PM »
Thanks for your input Hugh. By the way, what brand is your engine? Mine's a Vidhata.

I should have explained that the first time I ran this engine I had no idea that the governor linkage needs to be "set up", that is with the lower bellcrank all the way to the right so the rack fully closes. I simply fired it up with the Indian setting and it jumped all over the place, over and under speeding. When I finally found out how to adjust the linkage (and removed all the slop) I had already replaced the spring. I should have left the original in place before trying it again....one step at a time.

Fortunately, no damage and no injuries as I had my hand on the fuel cut off. It IS a learning process.

Already have my eye on a Kill a Watt also!
I've joined "the dark side"....if it has a spark plug, it's obsolete technology.

Hugh Conway

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Re: My progress for the day........
« Reply #7 on: March 06, 2015, 08:22:16 PM »

Good afternoon George:

My daily driver is a JKSON, They are probably all much the same save the single-sump engines, even then, lots of commonality.
We're all learning here, the help and experience of many of the more experienced guys goes a long way. There is a lot of info buried in these threads, and it is quite interesting to go back to the very early posts when the Indian engines were first being imported into U.S. and Canada.

My biggest heart stopper was not a run-away, but a gib key that fell out at speed. It was the off side flywheel, and fortunately had migrated inward rather than working itself off the crank.   
Big eyes and OH SHIT!!!.
No damage, though I don't like to think of the consequences of an errant flywheel. Would have taken out our truck, then the garage wall, then into and through the house. I can assure you, it would not have been a popular event.........talk of the neighbourhood, I'm sure, but not popular at all!

After that, learned how to properly fit the keys!

Cheers,
Hugh
In the excitement of a new project, it is hard to go slowly!!!!
JKson 6/1  (Utterpower PMG ) Off-grid
Lister 6/1 Start-O-Matic engine......running with PMG
1978 Royal Enfield (glutton for punishment by Indian iron)
1963 BMW R-27 project

George A

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Re: My progress for the day........
« Reply #8 on: March 06, 2015, 11:36:10 PM »
Not to get too far off track but I have a number of antique flywheel engines of various types, most of which I restored over the years (all obsolete gasoline...this is my first diesel). One of the first things you learn in this hobby is to examine the flywheels closely for old damage, cracks, properly fitting keys, etc. Strike them with a brass hammer and listen for the "ring" of a good casting. To run an engine with damaged flywheels is foolhardy at best and forbidden by all engine clubs and shows.

Somewhere I saw an 1890's picture of a lumber mill steam engine whose 12' flywheel "let go" at speed...perhaps 150 rpm. The rim and spokes disintegrated and the resulting imbalance ripped the large engine from its mounting. Bits of the rim were found up to a half mile from what was left of the mill. Yeah, there's a LOT of energy in that rotating mass.

I replaced my too short generator belt this afternoon with a much longer one that places the generator's weight at the opposite end of the frame. Until now it was almost in the middle, close to the Listeroid, and allowed the lighter end to "hop" a bit and also restricted access to the crank case cover somewhat.  I'll start it up tomorrow and see if it helps.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2015, 11:41:09 PM by George A »
I've joined "the dark side"....if it has a spark plug, it's obsolete technology.