Author Topic: Thermostat needed (?) for 3.5 HP Petter  (Read 10182 times)

listeroidsusa

  • Guest
Re: Thermostat needed (?) for 3.5 HP Petter
« Reply #15 on: June 24, 2006, 03:33:24 AM »
One thing some of you might be overlooking regarding the Petter type engine is WHERE the engine cooling water enters the engine. This has a direct relationship to its warming up. For example, when the petter is cooled by run through water, the water is not put into the engine at the base of the cylinder. The Indian petters have 2 water ports on the head, a high one and a low one. For the run through cooling system the bottom port on the cylinder is capped and the inlet goes to the lower head port. The water surrounding the cylinder is out of circulation except by convection currents. This would allow it to warm up and still not overheat since the head is being cooled and the cylinder water could "thermosiphon" up to the head area. This might be something to try and see whether it helps with a thermosiphon cooled engine. It would take mounting thermometers in each of the ports to really see what is happening. Or possibly one of the new infrared thermometers.

Mike

sid

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 630
    • View Profile
Re: Thermostat needed (?) for 3.5 HP Petter
« Reply #16 on: June 24, 2006, 02:33:03 PM »
remember to drain that lower part of the engine in the fall// it holds enough water that it could have some  freeze damage.  sid
15 hp fairbanks morris1932/1923 meadows mill
8 hp stover 1923
8 hp lg lister
1932 c.s bell hammer mill
4 hp witte 1917
5 hp des jardin 1926
3 hp mini petters
2hp hercules 1924
1 1/2 briggs.etc

listeroidsusa

  • Guest
Re: Thermostat needed (?) for 3.5 HP Petter
« Reply #17 on: June 24, 2006, 09:51:04 PM »
As far as 3 port thermostat housings go, I've been building them for several years. I sold out last week but will be building a batch of 50 after the 4th of July weekend if I can get caught up. The housings I build allow the engine to thermosiphon the water from the head to the lower block until it reaches the thermostat's opening temperature and then allows flow until the temperature drops below the thermostat setting. It then repeats the cycle. With this setup very little cooling water is needed. I cool my 6/1 with a 2500 watt load all day on 5 gallons of water. At 180-195 degrees the engine radiates enough heat that little flow is needed. The 6/1 runs at 180 degrees and the thermometer in my cooling tank rarely gets over 150 degrees. These housings will also adapt to the petters by fabricating a flange to bolt onto the water port instead of the hose connection they come from the factory with.

Mike

hotater

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1557
    • View Profile
Re: Thermostat needed (?) for 3.5 HP Petter
« Reply #18 on: June 27, 2006, 03:35:24 PM »
I quit using a thermostat in anything.  It's much simpler to install a gate valve on the top hose.   A Listeroid generating about 1800 watts uses five gallons of water an hour.  A MP uses about two gallons an hour.  It's just a bare trickle of 195 degree water coming from either one.   For extra loads or hot weather a T in the hose between the valve and the engine with a pop-off valve will work, but I've not needed it, yet.

IF I was running anti-freeze and a closed system I would install a thermostat, for sure.

Ronsmith----   You have to drill a hole in the rim of the thermostat to allow the water to bypass it while closed.  Otherwise there's a bubble trapped in the engine that can't escape.
7200 hrs on 6-1/5Kw, FuKing Listeroid,
Currently running PS-Kit 6-1/5Kw...and some MPs and Chanfas and diesel snowplows and trucks and stuff.

ronsmith

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 116
    • View Profile
    • Bentleybranch studio
Re: Thermostat needed (?) for 3.5 HP Petter
« Reply #19 on: June 28, 2006, 05:09:28 PM »
Thanks for the info hotater. I am going to install the gate valve on the upper hose and try that. I am using a 40gal tank sifon feed w/ antifreeze. The tank is vented so its not closed.

Andre Blanchard

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 373
    • View Profile
Re: Thermostat needed (?) for 3.5 HP Petter
« Reply #20 on: June 28, 2006, 05:39:19 PM »
<< snip >>
For extra loads or hot weather a T in the hose between the valve and the engine with a pop-off valve will work, but I've not needed it, yet.

IF I was running anti-freeze and a closed system I would install a thermostat, for sure.
<< snip >>

???
A pop-off valve implies pressure relief but with an open system you are never going to get any significant pressure.  Unless you also have a check valve in the lower hose to the engine.
So I assume you are referring to a T&P valve like on a water heater.
Is not the temperature function of a T&P valve the same as that of a thermostat?  With maybe some hysteriesis built in so that it snaps open and stays open longer.  I am not sure they will work very well in a low pressure system anyway.  Seems it would be better to just use a thermostat that will open just enough to maintain a constant temperature.
Or do you want this pop-off valve for "WHEN" you forget to open the manual valve enough. ;)
______________
Andre' B

hotater

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1557
    • View Profile
Re: Thermostat needed (?) for 3.5 HP Petter
« Reply #21 on: June 28, 2006, 05:47:36 PM »
Andre'--

Pop-off was the wrong term.  All that's needed is an escape route for water that can't get past the gate valve fast enough.  A 'T'  between the valve and the head with a three foot hose running up the wall serves just fine.  If you see a geyser from the tube, open the gate a little!
7200 hrs on 6-1/5Kw, FuKing Listeroid,
Currently running PS-Kit 6-1/5Kw...and some MPs and Chanfas and diesel snowplows and trucks and stuff.

Andre Blanchard

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 373
    • View Profile
Re: Thermostat needed (?) for 3.5 HP Petter
« Reply #22 on: June 28, 2006, 06:43:13 PM »
Andre'--

Pop-off was the wrong term.  All that's needed is an escape route for water that can't get past the gate valve fast enough.  A 'T'  between the valve and the head with a three foot hose running up the wall serves just fine.  If you see a geyser from the tube, open the gate a little!

Well then take opens up some possibilities.
How about point that tube into a bucket, at a tangent so the geyser can spin down and stay in the bucket.  Hang the bucket from a rope, rope up over a pulley down to a long lever duck taped to the valve handle.
Bucket fills up, rope pulls on handle opening the valve.  :D :D :D
______________
Andre' B

hotater

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1557
    • View Profile
Re: Thermostat needed (?) for 3.5 HP Petter
« Reply #23 on: July 07, 2006, 03:44:59 AM »
Andre'---

Actually I have a ten gallon propane tank for a water tank (For Listeroid),  but it has a toilet valve and float in it.  As water is used and runs to waste fresh water is pulled from the tank and it's replenished automatically by way of the toilet float valve.  I have a capacity of 40,000 gallons of water with gravity feed, so running out of water or losing pressure is not a problem.
7200 hrs on 6-1/5Kw, FuKing Listeroid,
Currently running PS-Kit 6-1/5Kw...and some MPs and Chanfas and diesel snowplows and trucks and stuff.

Doug

  • Guest
Re: Thermostat needed (?) for 3.5 HP Petter
« Reply #24 on: July 07, 2006, 06:25:59 PM »
Flush-o-matic !!!!


Doug

ronsmith

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 116
    • View Profile
    • Bentleybranch studio
Re: Thermostat needed (?) for 3.5 HP Petter
« Reply #25 on: July 08, 2006, 03:08:42 AM »
I installed a gate valve on the upper hose on my petter. I also wrapped tubing around my exhaust and ran my fuel through it. Between choking down the hot water hose and heating the fuel I have seen a huge reduction in smoke. I used aluminum gas thermostat tubing for the heater and it bends real easy. From what I can tell my petter head temp was way too cold and the hyd. oil I was using for fuel was way to thick and was causing incomplete combustion and thus smoke.Much better now, thanks for the gate valve tip.