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Author Topic: Which Lister Model?  (Read 11495 times)

Mikofox

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Which Lister Model?
« on: March 10, 2006, 05:26:44 AM »
Hi,
glad to have found this place!
My family lives in a remote setting in Canada's Yukon. My interest in Listers or slow RPM engines got sparked recently when we had two generator engines fail within a few month. One was a B&S Vanguard 16 HP, the other a DEK F420 Chinese Diesel. None really suitable to run our operation on a day to day basis.
Now I'm looking either to find an original Lister or buying a Listeroid from India. If it only were so easy as ordering them in Canada. So far I have had no luck.
On my travels through our region I have seen many old Diesels in Mines and abandoned buildings. So they are around.
Even a neighbor has a variety of Diesels spread around his yard. Unfortunately all of them are missing parts.
I was hoping that some of the experts here could help me out and identify the engines and maybe even tell me if it's worth working on them.
One is a 3HP Lister CS with the cylinder head missing. The Label reads 3HP - 600RPM - CS60788 - Spec 208|13.
Except for the missing head, the engine still looks very nice. This one is really too small for us, but it would make a nice engine to start out with.
He showed me another engine which was taken apart by another owner, but then one box of parts went to the landfill before my neighbor rescued the remains of the engine. The flywheel is still there, but not mounted.
I'd like to show two photos here, if the link works.
I would appreciate if someone could provide me with the Model Type and related info, and expert advise if it would be a worthwhile rebuilding project.




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Mr X

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Re: Which Lister Model?
« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2006, 04:52:49 PM »
There is a fellow in Lethbridge who sais he is bringing in a few roids

Greg
« Last Edit: March 10, 2006, 04:54:20 PM by Mr X »
6/1 PS Jkson soon to run WVO,  3 hp Petter, 3 Honda 5 hp, 1 weed eater, Live off grid, Now a dog farmer

t19

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Re: Which Lister Model?
« Reply #2 on: March 10, 2006, 09:08:54 PM »
Welcome fellow Canuck!!!!  JohnF sells them here in Ontario, but that does not help you very much.
There is plenty of room for all of Gods creatures... right next to the mashed potatoes...

Halfnuts

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Re: Which Lister Model?
« Reply #3 on: March 14, 2006, 03:42:05 PM »
You might try asking the question on the www.smokstak.com forum.  There are several experts on original Listers there.  Most of us here own the Indian variety.

Nice to see someone from the land of my favorite poet:

The summer -- no sweeter was ever;
  The sunshiny woods all athrill; 
The grayling aleap in the river,
  The bighorn asleep on the hill.
The strong life that never knows harness;
  The wilds where the caribou call;
The freshness, the freedom, the farness --
  O God! how I'm stuck on it all.

(I gather the winter's altogether different)

Halfnuts
 

trigzy

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Re: Which Lister Model?
« Reply #4 on: March 14, 2006, 05:07:56 PM »
May I ask what caused your DEK F420 to crap out?  (I might be able to get you some replacement parts/manuals/instructions if interested)

Steve
Power Anand 24/2, Brushless 20kW, some other antique iron.
Vendor of AVR's, Small Clones of Yanmar Diesel and Honda Gasoline Engines

Mr Lister

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Re: Which Lister Model?
« Reply #5 on: March 14, 2006, 07:27:25 PM »
Mikofox,

I have not yet been able to identify the Lister engine from your pictures.  It looks a fairly modern one. Are there any markings or serial numbers?

The 3 hp CS  engines are getting fairly rare for spare parts,  I have a couple and there is one on ebay UK right now.

I suggest that you convert the 3 hp to 6hp or 8hp by fitting Indian cylinder, piston and head, provided that the engine is still good in the downstairs department (main bearings, cam, crankshaft etc). This could be an economical rebuild.

Perhaps if you contact George at Utterpower.com (Oregon) and ask him about a top end rebuild.



Ken

London


Stan

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Re: Which Lister Model?
« Reply #6 on: March 14, 2006, 07:34:17 PM »
Ken...What do you know about Petter AVA1's.....A nice chap from nearby has one in the 6 hp range.  They turn at 1800 rpm I believe and are diesel, direct injection.  Are parts available/reasonable?
Stan

Doug

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Re: Which Lister Model?
« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2006, 07:41:28 PM »
I look into this Stan....

The Petter AV and AVA went out of production around 1970. Ask Lister Petter for parts and they look at you like your from the moon. At least here they tell me fat chance for parts but who knows maybe the guys in the UK can find some NOS parts. I did find a Piston for an AV on Ebay it was a 87.5 mm bore no rings...

Doug

Mr Lister

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Re: Which Lister Model?
« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2006, 08:09:06 PM »
Stan,

Sorry I don't know jack-shit about Petter AVA 1 engines.   I think they may be air cooled and loud!

India is building a load of "Petter type" engines.  I will try to find out which model these were based on.  If it's AVA1 then parts should be relatively straight forward to get hold of.

Ken

Mr Lister

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Re: Which Lister Model?
« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2006, 08:22:19 PM »
OK Stan,

The Indians are building engines based on the AV1 and the AVA1. Peter Forbes came up with this info:

>A question for you.  I ran into a water pump from India.  I'm told its
>an Indian design based on a clone of a standard Petter engine but
>modified for cost and efficiency.  [Note - the cam shaft end is not
>exposed and the fly wheel location has been moved] The idea being it's
>to become a standard for third world countries.   I'm not a guru on the
>subject and was wondering which Petter does it look to have come from?
>There are two models, 2.6 and 3.5 hp both which look the same.  [1100
>and 1500 rpm]

It was the AV1 and the AVA1 engines, originally sold by Kirloskar as
agents for Petters, then they started making them themselves when the
licencing agreement ran out. Same with the Lister engines but a
different agency handled them.

AV1 was water-cooled, AVA1 was aircooled.

Check  out Google for Kirloskar and "Petter type engine"

Anand enterprises  (remember them) make spare parts for the Petter type engines.

http://www.anandenterprise.com/delight13.htm

http://autopartsasia.com/Search/product_details.asp?prcode=EN69118




HTH,



Ken




Mr Lister

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Re: Which Lister Model?
« Reply #10 on: March 14, 2006, 08:34:50 PM »
Stan,

Kirloskar stil make the watercooled AV1 which shares a lot of parts with the AVA1

http://kirloskarapps.kirloskar.com/kirloskar/web/16$214.html?M2

This my 99th post, so I will post again to celebrate my full membership  (only taken 6 months  ;-)


Ken

Mikofox

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Re: Which Lister Model?
« Reply #11 on: March 14, 2006, 10:16:34 PM »
May I ask what caused your DEK F420 to crap out?  (I might be able to get you some replacement parts/manuals/instructions if interested)

Steve

Thanks for the offer, but there was just too much damage to the engine to justify a repair. The engine was still running when my scared 12 year old heard the bang, investigated and tried to shut it down. The inside of our generator shed was all covered in oil and smoked out.
No idea what caused it, but I suspect the balancer shaft was the first thing to go. Looking at the three pieces of this shaft I wonder how this design can hold together. No idea how fast this shaft turns, but it looks rather imbalanced to me.
The whole generator was a nightmare from the start.
Deteriorating rubber fuel lines, motor mounts and every rubber used. Air filter fell apart. Solenoid burned out. Muffler fell apart.
No offense, but I'm cured with high RPM Chinese engines for a while.
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Mikofox

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Re: Which Lister Model?
« Reply #12 on: March 14, 2006, 10:30:37 PM »
Mikofox,

I have not yet been able to identify the Lister engine from your pictures.  It looks a fairly modern one. Are there any markings or serial numbers?

The 3 hp CS  engines are getting fairly rare for spare parts,  I have a couple and there is one on ebay UK right now.

I suggest that you convert the 3 hp to 6hp or 8hp by fitting Indian cylinder, piston and head, provided that the engine is still good in the downstairs department (main bearings, cam, crankshaft etc). This could be an economical rebuild.

Perhaps if you contact George at Utterpower.com (Oregon) and ask him about a top end rebuild.



Ken

London



Thanks for the reply Ken!
As soon as the snow is gone I'll go and have another look at the engine and take some better pictures of the other stuff my neighbor has in his yard. There were some numbers on the engine, but it looked more like a serial than model number. There's probably too much missing on this one.
The idea of converting the three HP is interesting. I'll look into this.
I'll see if I can manage to import a 12/2 Listeroid from India. If there are any Canadian Importers here I'd appreciate to hear from them.


 
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emerald

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Re: Which Lister Model?
« Reply #13 on: March 15, 2006, 12:01:52 AM »
I believe the 3HP CS has a smaller crank diameter than the 6HP. Converting one will shorten the crank life. Doubt its worth converting unless you really want to pump money into it. They are worth more than the 6HP CS to collectors. The 6HP were very common.

Emerald

Mr X

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Re: Which Lister Model?
« Reply #14 on: March 15, 2006, 01:45:36 AM »
Mikofox I guess u didnt get together with Troy Erler From Lethbridge He sais he is importing engins I will tell to contact u through the forem.

Greg
6/1 PS Jkson soon to run WVO,  3 hp Petter, 3 Honda 5 hp, 1 weed eater, Live off grid, Now a dog farmer