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Author Topic: Which oil? (uk based)  (Read 6921 times)

sb118

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Which oil? (uk based)
« on: February 27, 2006, 08:09:46 AM »
I've been reading that i should be looking for non-detergent based oils etc. I have NO idea which oils in the UK are the right thing for my engine.

Anybody know what brands i should be looking for? Could i chuck some plain 5/40 in there for 8 hours to flush out any crap which has been standing since i bought it? (only fired it up long enough to damage myself since i got it home!)

cheers

steve
First love - 1975 Lister SR1, gone to a better place (running a saw bench actually ;))

True love - unknown vintage CS6/1 with SOM flywheels

linkie to the project so far --- http://jestersltd.com/pics/index.php

Lister owners do it at 650 strokes a minute ;)

hotater

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Re: Which oil? (uk based)
« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2006, 01:13:31 PM »
I'd bet whatever the London cabbies are feeding their long-lived diesels would be perfect for the Lister.

I switched to Chevon Delo 400 (from non detergent 30W)  not long ago and see a MUCH cleaner engine now, but consumption is up slightly over 30w.
7200 hrs on 6-1/5Kw, FuKing Listeroid,
Currently running PS-Kit 6-1/5Kw...and some MPs and Chanfas and diesel snowplows and trucks and stuff.

GuyFawkes

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Re: Which oil? (uk based)
« Reply #2 on: February 27, 2006, 02:06:27 PM »
petrol car oils are non detergent oils.

*most* diesel oils are detergent based.

cold starting apart, once a lube oil is up to temperature its cleanliness (filtering / changing) is more important than its weight

I very much doubt you can buy a grade of oil too low a spec for a lister.

castrol agri power 15w40 is available at any farm supplier (the ordinary agri, not the plus ones) and will work fine

Agri Power
Engine oil
________________________________________________________________________________

Applications; Applications

Suitable for use in older machinery or those operating under moderate operating conditions


________________________________________________________________________________

Features / Benefits; Features / Benefits

• Good protection for agricultural engine


________________________________________________________________________________

Specifications / Performance; Specifications / Performance

API CF-4/CF/SG
ACEA E2/B2
MB 228.1
MAN M3275


________________________________________________________________________________

Storage; Storage

All packages should be stored under cover. Where outside storage is unavoidable drums should be laid horizontally to avoid the possible ingress of water and the obliteration of drum markings. Products should not be stored above 60°C, exposed to hot sun or freezing conditions.
; All packages should be stored under cover. Where outside storage is unavoidable drums should be laid horizontally to avoid the possible ingress of water and the obliteration of drum markings. Products should not be stored above 60°C, exposed to hot sun or freezing conditions.

;


________________________________________________________________________________

Health, Safety and Environment; Health, Safety and Environment

Health, safety and environmental information is provided for this product in the Materials Safety Data Sheet. This gives details of potential hazards, precautions and First Aid measures, together with environmental effects and disposal of used products. ; Health, safety and environmental information is provided for this product in the Materials Safety Data Sheet. This gives details of potential hazards, precautions and First Aid measures, together with environmental effects and disposal of used products.
Castrol (UK) Ltd. or its subsidiaries will not accept liability if the product is used other than in the manner or with the precautions or for the purpose/s specified. Before the product is used other than as directed, advice should be obtained from the local Castrol office.; Castrol (UK) Ltd. or its subsidiaries will not accept liability if the product is used other than in the manner or with the precautions or for the purpose/s specified. Before the product is used other than as directed, advice should be obtained from the local Castrol office.

________________________________________________________________________________

Typical Characteristics ; Typical Characteristics
________________________________________________________________________________

   Test Methods; Test Methods   Units; Units   Value: ; Value:
________________________________________________________________________________

         SAE 15W-40


Density at 15ºC   ISO 3675 / ASTM D1298   g/cm3   0.885
Viscosity at 40ºC   ISO 3104 / ASTM D445   mm2/s   112
Viscosity at 100ºC   ISO 3104 / ASTM D445   mm2/s   14.7
Viscosity Index   ISO 2909 / ASTM D2270   -   135
CCS -20ºC    ASTM D5293   mPa.s   6700
Base Number   ASTM D2896   mgKOH/g   9.7
Flash Point (COC)   ISO 2592 / ASTM D92   0C   230
Pour Point    ISO 3016 / ASTM D97   0C   -36
Sulphated Ash   ISO 3687 / ASTM D874   %m   1.3
--
Original Lister CS 6/1 Start-o-matic 2.5 Kw (radiator conversion)
3Kw 130 VDC Dynamo to be added. (compressor + hyd pump)
Original Lister D, megasquirt multifuel project, compressor and truck alternator.
Current status - project / standby, Fuel, good old pump diesel.

EVguru

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Re: Which oil? (uk based)
« Reply #3 on: February 27, 2006, 09:59:32 PM »

petrol car oils are non detergent oils.


Where do you get this stuff?

They are 'detergent oils', diesel oil is typically 'high detergent'.

Any engine with a full flow filter is going to use a detergent oil. The purpose of the detergent is to hold contaminents in solution until they can be captured by the filter. Designs without filters relied on sludge traps where the contaminents could settle out and be removed from the flow. The down side of course is that you have to clean the traps out periodically, rather than just dumping a filter.

Read; http://www.realclassic.co.uk/techfiles/oil030319.html

A bypass filter is an even better idea, since it removes much smaller particles.

GuyFawkes

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Re: Which oil? (uk based)
« Reply #4 on: February 27, 2006, 10:13:49 PM »

petrol car oils are non detergent oils.


Where do you get this stuff?

perhaps I just pull it out of my ass

or perhaps I had to know the specifications of exotic and incredibly rare lube oils like SAE30 which was used in incredibly exotic and rare diesels like detroits.
--
Original Lister CS 6/1 Start-o-matic 2.5 Kw (radiator conversion)
3Kw 130 VDC Dynamo to be added. (compressor + hyd pump)
Original Lister D, megasquirt multifuel project, compressor and truck alternator.
Current status - project / standby, Fuel, good old pump diesel.

trigzy

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Re: Which oil? (uk based)
« Reply #5 on: February 27, 2006, 10:29:41 PM »
On our side of the pond, virtually ALL oils are detergent oils.....


Non-detergent oil has to be purchased specially......


These specs have greatly changed overtime.....be careful not to confuse indepth investigation of oils in the 60's-80's with today's lubricants.

Steve

Power Anand 24/2, Brushless 20kW, some other antique iron.
Vendor of AVR's, Small Clones of Yanmar Diesel and Honda Gasoline Engines

Tom

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Re: Which oil? (uk based)
« Reply #6 on: February 27, 2006, 10:30:43 PM »
Tut, tut Guy, don't get your knickers in a twist.  ;D
Tom
2004 Ashwamegh 6/1 #217 - ST5 just over 3k hours.

Doug

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Re: Which oil? (uk based)
« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2006, 01:29:16 AM »
Steve is right oils have advanced a long way since the CS was new....
You can get way with old fasion oil in a Listeroid, but why when you can extend the life of your engine by keeping it cleaner and having an easier starting engine with multi viscosity oils. Not to mention all other good stuff in todays oils, anti wear additives and the like. I wouldn't waste the money on a synthetic, just change your oil often.

Doug

Halfnuts

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Re: Which oil? (uk based)
« Reply #8 on: February 28, 2006, 05:04:08 PM »
Guy, there's no reason to go ballistic every time someone disagrees with you.  You've been wrong before, just like the rest of us. 

I used to sell oil in the parts store during college.  Valvoline had a line of non-detergent oils then for engine break-in and for old car buffs (not that the buffs were old, the cars were).  We sold 20W and 30W in a blue and white can that had "NON-DETERGENT" written in large friendly blue letters.  All the other oils, even back then in the 1970s, were detergent oils.  You had to specify non-detergent oil if you wanted it.  Perhaps oils in the UK were/are different.

I do know for a fact, though, that the level of detergent in lube oils meant for diesel use are much higher than that for petrol engines.  So much so, that the manufacturers rep. cautioned us to make sure customers didn't use the diesel lube oil in gas engines because the added detergent sometimes caused piston rings in older gas engines to leak, causing increased oil consumption.

Halfnuts

SHIPCHIEF

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Re: Which oil? (uk based)
« Reply #9 on: February 28, 2006, 07:08:51 PM »
Detergent, dispersant, sulfated ash.... just how many ways are there to suspend dirt in oil so the filter can get it?
Which damages ported two stroke diesels? (high ash) which damages catalytic perverters? Why do airplane engines use ashless dispersant?
Not so fast in the slings and arrows department, OK? Oil is complex.
Scott E
Ashwamegh 25/2 & ST12
Lister SR2 10Kw 'Long Edurance' genset on a 10 gallon sump/skid,
Onan 6.5NH in an old Jeager Compressor trailer and a few CCK's

rpg52

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Re: Which oil? (uk based)
« Reply #10 on: March 02, 2006, 02:17:55 AM »
A really interesting (and fairly short) link about motor oil is at:
http://www.atis.net/oil_faq.html
One section is by a guy who worked for a Swiss company that made diesel engines for locomotives.  The second section is by a chemical engineer who works for the Univ. of Nevada research station.  More than you ever wanted to know about motor oil
Ray
PS Listeroid 6/1, 5 kW ST, Detroit Diesel 3-71, Belsaw sawmill, 12 kW ST head, '71 GMC 3/4 T, '79 GMC 1T, '59 IH T-340