Author Topic: WMO load test  (Read 35484 times)

draganof

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WMO load test
« on: January 07, 2008, 01:59:21 AM »
I just did a 4 hour load test of my 195 with an ST10  on 15-40 WMO today. Nothing fancy, started on diesel and when the engine temp got to 185 degrees  I changed over to WMO. No pre-heat. Oil temp was at 70 degrees. No smoke at all until I reached 9kw then it was a light gray up to 10kw where it started to turn black. The engine seemed to like it. Less noise. Engine temp at 10kw was 210 degrees. I switched back to diesel for 30 minutes prior to shutdown. I think the WMO makes more horsepower than diesel. On diesel the HZ is 62.5 unloaded and 56.0 full load. On WMO the HZ is 62.5 unloaded and 59.3 full load. Not very scientific but educational for me.

John
Changfa 195 and ST10
8kw Yanmar/Kohler

draganof

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Re: WMO load test
« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2008, 03:02:59 AM »
It goes through an FG1000 Racor and then to a Cat 2 micron fuel filter. All of the WMO I get is from controlled sources and I have the lab test results so I know exactly what is in the oil. Some oil I get is so clean it looks almost new. I would like to get a large storage tank and keep it heated so the moisture content would remain low.

John
Changfa 195 and ST10
8kw Yanmar/Kohler

draganof

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Re: WMO load test
« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2008, 03:52:36 AM »
There are thousands of emergency standby generators in Washington State. Some of these sites must pay to have their WMO disposed of. I have sources that donate their oil to me. I don't even charge them for it!

The answer to would I use oil that is of unknown quality? Only during WTSHTF times. But then any oil will be like gold.

I will say this. If I found a source of WVO I would not use WMO. And I would not make BioDiesel out of it. I would filter it and use it as is.

John
Changfa 195 and ST10
8kw Yanmar/Kohler

rbodell

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Re: WMO load test
« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2008, 02:00:06 PM »
I just did a 4 hour load test of my 195 with an ST10  on 15-40 WMO today. Nothing fancy, started on diesel and when the engine temp got to 185 degrees  I changed over to WMO. No pre-heat. Oil temp was at 70 degrees. No smoke at all until I reached 9kw then it was a light gray up to 10kw where it started to turn black. The engine seemed to like it. Less noise. Engine temp at 10kw was 210 degrees. I switched back to diesel for 30 minutes prior to shutdown. I think the WMO makes more horsepower than diesel. On diesel the HZ is 62.5 unloaded and 56.0 full load. On WMO the HZ is 62.5 unloaded and 59.3 full load. Not very scientific but educational for me.

John

I have used wmo in my engine up to 50%. At almost 500 hours I had the head off and found little coking, no corosion and no cylinder damage.

I run my wmo through a dieselcraft centrifuge filter. I do run it a lot longer than necessary, about three hours for around 7 gallons. I process about 7 gallons at a time. I am still running my original Goldenrod 10 micron fuel filter on the engine. I check the PH by taking a little oil and adding some distilled water and shaking it up and let it settle, I then check it with litmus paper. I bring down the PH by adding some Sodium Hydroxide and water and letting it recirculate. Before I found a source of Sodium Hydroxide, I used draino.

I have had no problems so far.
The shear depth of my shallowness is perplexing yet morbidly interesting. Bob 2007

mike90045

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Re: WMO load test
« Reply #4 on: January 07, 2008, 02:25:25 PM »
Quote
Before I found a source of Sodium Hydroxide, I used draino.

That's lye in my book !  USA grocery stores carry granular Red Devil Lye, in the same locations as liquid Draino, at half the price.

biobill

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Re: WMO load test
« Reply #5 on: January 07, 2008, 02:46:25 PM »
Mike,
  You can still buy Red Devil Lye? It's off the shelves in my area (upstate NY) presumably because it's used in meth labs. However you can still get all the Na02 you want at chemical supply houses with no signature or anything. Your government at work >:(       Bill
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6/1 Metro IDI running barn & biodiesel processer
VW 1.6 diesels all over the place
Isuzu Boxtruck, Ford Backhoe, all running on biodiesel
Needs diesel lawnmower & chainsaw

rbodell

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Re: WMO load test
« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2008, 02:48:51 PM »
Quote
Before I found a source of Sodium Hydroxide, I used draino.

That's lye in my book !  USA grocery stores carry granular Red Devil Lye, in the same locations as liquid Draino, at half the price.

Not recently. I used to use it for something else but they don't carry it any more. Something to do with national security LOL. You can still buy it in large quantities though DAHHHH????
The shear depth of my shallowness is perplexing yet morbidly interesting. Bob 2007

rbodell

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Re: WMO load test
« Reply #7 on: January 07, 2008, 02:52:14 PM »
I just did a 4 hour load test of my 195 with an ST10  on 15-40 WMO today. Nothing fancy, started on diesel and when the engine temp got to 185 degrees  I changed over to WMO. No pre-heat. Oil temp was at 70 degrees. No smoke at all until I reached 9kw then it was a light gray up to 10kw where it started to turn black. The engine seemed to like it. Less noise. Engine temp at 10kw was 210 degrees. I switched back to diesel for 30 minutes prior to shutdown. I think the WMO makes more horsepower than diesel. On diesel the HZ is 62.5 unloaded and 56.0 full load. On WMO the HZ is 62.5 unloaded and 59.3 full load. Not very scientific but educational for me.

John

I have used wmo in my engine up to 50%. At almost 500 hours I had the head off and found little coking, no corosion and no cylinder damage.

I run my wmo through a dieselcraft centrifuge filter. I do run it a lot longer than necessary, about three hours for around 7 gallons. I process about 7 gallons at a time. I am still running my original Goldenrod 10 micron fuel filter on the engine. I check the PH by taking a little oil and adding some distilled water and shaking it up and let it settle, I then check it with litmus paper. I bring down the PH by adding some Sodium Hydroxide and water and letting it recirculate. Before I found a source of Sodium Hydroxide, I used draino.

I have had no problems so far.


I forgot to mention that I found some white powder up in the combustion chamber around the injector. Does anybody know what that is from?
The shear depth of my shallowness is perplexing yet morbidly interesting. Bob 2007

mike90045

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Re: WMO load test
« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2008, 06:19:32 PM »
Quote
  At almost 500 hours I had the head off and found little coking 


Quote
  I forgot to mention that I found some white powder up in the combustion chamber around the injector. Does anybody know what that is from?

coke or hash ? 

draganof

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Re: WMO load test
« Reply #9 on: January 07, 2008, 07:36:50 PM »
I just did a 4 hour load test of my 195 with an ST10  on 15-40 WMO today. Nothing fancy, started on diesel and when the engine temp got to 185 degrees  I changed over to WMO. No pre-heat. Oil temp was at 70 degrees. No smoke at all until I reached 9kw then it was a light gray up to 10kw where it started to turn black. The engine seemed to like it. Less noise. Engine temp at 10kw was 210 degrees. I switched back to diesel for 30 minutes prior to shutdown. I think the WMO makes more horsepower than diesel. On diesel the HZ is 62.5 unloaded and 56.0 full load. On WMO the HZ is 62.5 unloaded and 59.3 full load. Not very scientific but educational for me.

John

I have used wmo in my engine up to 50%. At almost 500 hours I had the head off and found little coking, no corosion and no cylinder damage.

I run my wmo through a dieselcraft centrifuge filter. I do run it a lot longer than necessary, about three hours for around 7 gallons. I process about 7 gallons at a time. I am still running my original Goldenrod 10 micron fuel filter on the engine. I check the PH by taking a little oil and adding some distilled water and shaking it up and let it settle, I then check it with litmus paper. I bring down the PH by adding some Sodium Hydroxide and water and letting it recirculate. Before I found a source of Sodium Hydroxide, I used draino.

I have had no problems so far.


I am a little confused on why you would adjust the ph in WMO? Adding lye to the oil doesn't seem right to me. And also where do you get litmus paper for WMO?

John
Changfa 195 and ST10
8kw Yanmar/Kohler

mike90045

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Re: WMO load test
« Reply #10 on: January 07, 2008, 07:51:52 PM »
Quote

I am a little confused on why you would adjust the ph in WMO? Adding lye to the oil doesn't seem right to me. And also where do you get litmus paper for WMO?

I think he adds only water for testing, and if it's too acidic, adds both Water & Lye for adjusting and , and uses ordinary everyday litmus paper to test the water.   When the water tests fine, he de-waters the fuel.  At least that's how I'm understanding his process.   WMO tends to acidify while it's in use in the engine (combustion byproducts)

Doug

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Re: WMO load test
« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2008, 09:01:08 PM »
Anyone ever try this trick to clean oil for burning?

I went snooping around for some rope just so I could try it myself....

http://www.endtimesreport.com/cleaning_engine_oil.html
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Quinnf

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Re: WMO load test
« Reply #12 on: January 07, 2008, 09:03:12 PM »
What he's describing is a common application of the organic chemistry laboratory called water extraction.  Same idea as bubble washing your biodiesel to get rid of the excess methoxide, or free sodium hydroxide and methanol.  Sodium hydroxide (lye) isn't soluble in oils, but it dissolves readily in water.  Any acidic component of WMO such as acidic combustion byproducts will dissolve in the water in preference to the oil.  So by circulating water containing a base or a buffering agent like sodium bicarbonate (baking soda) in contact with the oil, you'll trap and neutralize the acidic "bad guys" from the waste oil.  The water can be separated, unless you created an emulsion by mixing too vigorously, and discarded, leaving you with WMO that has had its acidic components removed.

Not to pick nits, but you add acid to bring the pH down, and bases like lye to raise the pH.  I think he meant to say that if the water sample in the initial test indicated acid was present, then adding sodium hydroxide to the wash water would bring the pH up, not down.

Quinn
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ronmar

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Re: WMO load test
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2008, 09:39:22 PM »
Anyone ever try this trick to clean oil for burning?

I went snooping around for some rope just so I could try it myself....

http://www.endtimesreport.com/cleaning_engine_oil.html

I have used capilary action/siphon to remove liquid from not so easy to access spaces and places where it collects instead of dropping to a deck drain.  A rolled up paper towel or napkin will do this same thing, although using a cellulose material will absorb any water present and may impede the oil transfer if the fibers become waterlogged.  Cotton would move the water along with the oil and like moving any oil, this process will probably go faster if the oil is warm.

Ron
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rbodell

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Re: WMO load test
« Reply #14 on: January 09, 2008, 11:34:00 AM »
I just did a 4 hour load test of my 195 with an ST10  on 15-40 WMO today. Nothing fancy, started on diesel and when the engine temp got to 185 degrees  I changed over to WMO. No pre-heat. Oil temp was at 70 degrees. No smoke at all until I reached 9kw then it was a light gray up to 10kw where it started to turn black. The engine seemed to like it. Less noise. Engine temp at 10kw was 210 degrees. I switched back to diesel for 30 minutes prior to shutdown. I think the WMO makes more horsepower than diesel. On diesel the HZ is 62.5 unloaded and 56.0 full load. On WMO the HZ is 62.5 unloaded and 59.3 full load. Not very scientific but educational for me.

John

I have used wmo in my engine up to 50%. At almost 500 hours I had the head off and found little coking, no corosion and no cylinder damage.

I run my wmo through a dieselcraft centrifuge filter. I do run it a lot longer than necessary, about three hours for around 7 gallons. I process about 7 gallons at a time. I am still running my original Goldenrod 10 micron fuel filter on the engine. I check the PH by taking a little oil and adding some distilled water and shaking it up and let it settle, I then check it with litmus paper. I bring down the PH by adding some Sodium Hydroxide and water and letting it recirculate. Before I found a source of Sodium Hydroxide, I used draino.

I have had no problems so far.


I am a little confused on why you would adjust the ph in WMO? Adding lye to the oil doesn't seem right to me. And also where do you get litmus paper for WMO?

John

Waste oil is usually acid. The Sodium Hydroxide is base to counter the acid.

The litmus is plane litmus. I got the Litmus Paper  through the Internet. The prices vary a lot but I got mine for 99 cents for 100 sheets. I tear a sheet in half to get two tests per sheet.

I add some water to a sample of oil. The acid collects in the water. When it settles I take some water off the bottom and test that with the litmus. To get the water off the bottom I use one of those bottles that have the pull up top like water bottles. After adding the water and oil I set the bottle upside down for ten minutes. Then keeping the bottle upside down I open the top over a bowl for just a second to get a few drops to test.

I mix the lye with water because the lye doesn't dissolve in oil. Once it is desolved, the water will evaporate leaving the lye. Just enough water to dissolve it is all it takes. I use a stainless steel container to dissolve it in because it gets really hot when you have a lot of lye and a little water and will melt plastic or break glass.

I add an once or two at a time. If I get too much I add some more waste oil.

SODIUM HYDROXIDE (LYE) IS DANGEROUS, IT WILL BURN HOLES IN YOUR SKIN, BLIND YOU AND PERMANENTLY DISFIGURE YOUR FACE TO THE POINT YOU NEED PLASTIC SURGERY.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2008, 01:53:40 PM by rbodell »
The shear depth of my shallowness is perplexing yet morbidly interesting. Bob 2007