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Author Topic: "Code talkers"  (Read 18720 times)

Jukebox

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"Code talkers"
« on: February 18, 2006, 11:24:03 PM »
My  new 20/2

Arrived with main fuel line crushed.
All tappets concave.
Tappet guides and tappets painted
Cotton wick, fuel filter, in a rusted can.
Rust under painted surfaces.
Fuel leaks every where. Lines were under fabrication stress.
Timing on one cyl was 0 deg tdc, the other was 10 deg btdc.
Engine looks to have been painted with a mop. All linkages had to be cleaned as they were painted immovable.
No sand in engine sump. (Metal shavings.)
Bolts (threaded studs) were bent to line up with mating parts.

Received service manual that did not apply to the engine.
Contacted seller about this problem and nothing as of yet.(4 weeks have passed)
I contacted mfg company and never heard from them.

POWER SOLUTIONS ENGINE

We import products from CHINA and pay a representative to make sure
that everything is in order and that it arrives in our hands properly. She does
what the Chinese call "code talking". There need to be some "code talkers" in India.

rpg52

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Re: "Code talkers"
« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2006, 12:24:25 AM »
Hi jukebox,
Sorry to hear of the sad state of your 20-2, if it is a Power Solutions I assume you got it either from Joel or George?  If so, I am surprised you haven't had a response.  My PS 6-1 certainly wasn't perfect, but the minor flaws I found were what I expected, and none of them required more than a cleaning.  I did have some problems with delivery, and both George and Joel contacted me at different times to try to make things right.  If they were the sellers, I would urge you to contact them again with your list of problems to give them a chance to correct them.  They both seemed to stand behind their products, in my experience at least.
Ray
PS Listeroid 6/1, 5 kW ST, Detroit Diesel 3-71, Belsaw sawmill, 12 kW ST head, '71 GMC 3/4 T, '79 GMC 1T, '59 IH T-340

Ironworks

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Re: "Code talkers"
« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2006, 12:36:34 AM »
I have had some issues with my 6/1 powersolution I recently got from Joel and I can't seem to get a response from him by email.   My cam lobes are severely off center of the tappets.  The crank handle was turned inwards during transit and it banged the hell out of the cam shaft cover and end of the cam. I haven't run the engine yet or even put fuel in it because of sand contamination in the crank case (typical).  I went straight to the tear down.  These should be called hit or miss engines....lol.  You either hit a good one or you dont.

Jukebox

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Re: "Code talkers"
« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2006, 01:46:27 AM »
Bought from Joel.

Mentioned bent bolts to Joel and the painted linkage----he informed me that he didn't
bend the bolts and the standards are not to USA.

?????????

kyradawg

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Re: "Code talkers"
« Reply #4 on: February 19, 2006, 02:18:00 AM »


Peace&Love :D, Darren
« Last Edit: August 03, 2006, 04:30:40 PM by kyradawg »

wldhoss

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Re: "Code talkers"
« Reply #5 on: February 19, 2006, 03:01:30 AM »
Sounds like you bought and got a Listeroid. You didn't order a lister. Remember these engines are for the DIYer.  My engines have to some degree many of the issues you mentioned. I expected that because I spent time reading this forum before I bought from PS. You have been reading this forum for awhile and should have known what to expect.  Joel and George are good guys but are old and ornery and won't take shit from anybody. Be reasonable and they will treat you fair. 

Ironworks

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Re: "Code talkers"
« Reply #6 on: February 19, 2006, 03:13:43 AM »
Thanks for clearing that up for me Darren.  That really sets my mind at ease.  I thought something was way off.

hotater

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Re: "Code talkers"
« Reply #7 on: February 19, 2006, 03:19:37 AM »
Well said, Hoss--

With all Listeroids it's the *degree* of crudeness that matters.  It sounds like you got a good-un!

I assume you got the utterpower.com Lister Longivety CD??  If not, that'd be the first step to understand how to best utilize what amounts to an "assembled kit".

The vendors are golden and a wealth of great information.
7200 hrs on 6-1/5Kw, FuKing Listeroid,
Currently running PS-Kit 6-1/5Kw...and some MPs and Chanfas and diesel snowplows and trucks and stuff.

rocket

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Re: "Code talkers"
« Reply #8 on: February 19, 2006, 03:30:03 AM »
i have had good dealings with joel , but 4 weeks is alot of time. i suggest contacting who you bought it from again and keep us posted please

BruceM

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Re: "Code talkers"
« Reply #9 on: February 19, 2006, 04:11:31 AM »
It would be great if we could get Listeroids made in Taiwan, though even there I'm sure a code talker is needed.

Jukebox- all your problems are the common ones.  As long as you have the hard line from the IP to the injector still OK, I'd say good riddance to the rest.  The fittings and filter, even the petcock on my (made in 2002) Metro all leaked badly, and even the IP banjo bolt was defective (hairline crack- weeped fuel and air).  I was very happy with the quality and price of the Utterpower Mico fuel filter unit, and George's banjo fuel fitting makes neat work of connecting to any fuel line fitting.

The concave tappets with very rough surfaces are also standard.  I hand honed the deep scratches out and polished mine (flat) and recut the oil groove in one, but George at Utterpower has replacement ones made in the USA by a good machinist for $40. I'd go that route if I were doing it over... one tappet has a spot where it almost hangs up (but does still rotate).  Check your rocker arm alignment and rocker/cap surfaces, check your valves, definately check head clearance with some lead (little chance of that being right). Every single item in the Utterpower manual.

At least someone made an attempt to line something up (bent bolts)!

Bruce M
« Last Edit: February 19, 2006, 04:41:20 AM by BruceM »

kpgv

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Re: "Code talkers"
« Reply #10 on: February 19, 2006, 06:03:18 AM »
Ditto to Jack and Hoss,
There are "Code Talkers", AND there are "Code Listeners".
Any time spent on this list, or on any other HONEST site dealing in this stuff will let you know that this is DIY, not plug and crank.
I think it's imperative to do a "tear down" before you run, if only for self education. This is YOUR BABY!!!
The guys I have chosen to buy from make NO illusion about the possible "issues" with these. I chose the same source as you, BUT I EXPECT, and intend to completly dissassemble, clean, inspect, replace, polish, tweak, etc., before use. If none of the big parts are broken, and all I need is lines, bearings, rings, etc., I'm Happy!!! IMPO, once you work out the small issues, and start producing BTU's, KwH's, GPM's or whatever you intend, you'll forget all about the fact that this thing cost less than ~20% of what it would go for if still made "On the Island" or here. The PS guys, IMPO, are first rate, old time, NO BS (from them OR you) guys.

Kevin 

Ironworks

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Re: "Code talkers"
« Reply #11 on: February 19, 2006, 12:29:37 PM »
I'm not sure where BS got brought into this. I'm not giving anyone shit about anything.  I think if I pay a premium price for something I should at least get a response about concerns I have.  I knew I was basically buying an assembled engine that would need to be tore down thats why I didnt bother to even fuel it up to see if it ran at all.  Once I found the infamous casting sand it came apart.  I didnt realize that the cam lobes were suppose to be offset from tappets.  I dont see anything in Georges cd about that anywhere maybe I overlooked it.  I guess if I have to ruffle some feathers to learn  thats how its going to be. 

kyradawg

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Re: "Code talkers"
« Reply #12 on: February 19, 2006, 02:18:54 PM »


Peace&Love :D, Darren
« Last Edit: August 03, 2006, 04:29:12 PM by kyradawg »

Joe

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Re: "Code talkers"
« Reply #13 on: February 19, 2006, 02:57:43 PM »
I’ve read George’s CD at least a half dozen times and each time I look at it something new comes up to my attention. It’s the Lister bible as far as I am concerned …you simply cannot find more detail that addresses problem areas anywhere else….
I’m suspect some of the rust usually on sub component assemblies was from those parts being assembled prior to the actual engine build. Also, a very wet /humid Indian climate I’m sure is a contributing factor.  A mounted wire wheel has been my tool of choice in this project. So far every thing has cleaned up well.
I spent some time working with all the fluid lines yesterday.  I just began the process of identifying the treaded ends so that at some time in the future I’d have the means for homebrewed replacements …if necessary.
So far it looks like oil lines ends and suction strainer are BSP and the high-pressure fuel lines ends are metric.

Have Fun
Joe

Nothing is easy...if it were...anybody could do it.

2005 Power Solutions  6/1-ST5

BobH

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Re: "Code talkers"
« Reply #14 on: February 19, 2006, 03:53:11 PM »
I have purchased a 12/2 & 14/1 form Joel, neither purfect.I understood the woulden't be. Joel has returned my meany calls and has offered great service. The fun thing about these engines is what you can make out of them, not what you buy.

Go to work.