Author Topic: New Lister 16/2 - unlikely discovery, inspection questions  (Read 20624 times)

binnie

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Re: New Lister 16/2 - unlikely discovery, inspection questions
« Reply #15 on: February 06, 2007, 10:45:12 PM »
No Jinx's here Todd,
 and  we are all pulling for a nice surpriise ! Take picts of what ever you see....I have seen some disasters turned into show winning modles with a little effort & expense. Don't keel over at the sight of a little rust. Iron rusts with time but can be brought back to life with effort & a little  Passion....like anything else. binnie (keeping my fingers crossed)
Listeroid 12/2 Jkson with 10kw head, for backup now on diesel. Future interests: WVO, bio,  Cogen - Heat exchangers - solar.

jtodd

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Re: New Lister 16/2 - unlikely discovery, inspection questions
« Reply #16 on: February 11, 2007, 06:47:31 AM »
OK, so this is better than I thought.  I had an inkling that this was a good find, but I had to confirm it before I got too hopeful in my previous posts...

This is a *brand new* 16/2 Lister, still on what appears to be the original packing dolley.  Never run, except maybe at the factory.  Kept in a generator shop, very dusty but otherwise well-oiled and turns smoothly. Wow.  I think this has been in this shop for several decades, waiting for me to buy it.  After 20 hours on the road, I'm back home with it, and in the next few weeks I'll try to find the time to get it started after some preliminary dis-assembly to ensure no surface rust on the innards.  Darn this day job!  I'd start on this tomorrow if I knew I could get it done in one day, but this will probaby be a three-day project so I'll bide my time for a few more weeks.

The serial number is different than I reported, but the build plate is in the pictures.  Now the big question is: I do keep perhaps the last remaining factory-new 16/2 in it's pristine condition, or do I use it for my project?  I'm torn.  I think I'll use it, but it's always hard to put into production something like this that has been kept "in the wrapper" for so long and that may be the last of it's kind. 

http://www.loligo.com/listeroid/new-16-2/pictures/

More pictures later after I clean it up a bit with some light degreasing and dusting.

So... how did I find it?  I obtained a Lister CD (the engine, not the shiny round disc kind) at an estate sale a while back, and I've been on the hunt for various parts (gaskets, filters, etc) to restore it for a "project" engine.  Lots of calling around and turning over rocks finally put me in touch with a gentleman at Lister-Petter who was kind enough to point me in the direction of some people who might know things about those long-discontinued engines.  I mentioned that I was working on building a generator assembly for a 12/2 using an Indian clone, and I lamented the lack of a "real" Lister to use in my project.  He paused for a moment, and said:  "You know... I think I recall seeing one a number of years back in a warehouse in Phoenix... it's been a long time, though, and it's probably gone.  It had been sitting there for a number of years when I saw it last, and that was a LONG time ago."  So he gave me the name of the generator shop, and I hunted down the number and cold-called them.  After a few "Uh... I dunno" answers, I got forwarded to the shop foreman who knew the engine.  "Yep, been sitting here for as long as anyone can remember.   Ordinarily, it wouldn't be for sale since it belongs to the owner of the business, but he died a few weeks back and I think his son is starting to look at selling some of the weird engines that have been sitting here forever.  Let me ask."   A week or so later, I called back and they were indeed interested in selling the engine, so presto-chango, it's now in a truck out front after a lot of driving.   Persistence + luck = success.

JT

Geno

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Re: New Lister 16/2 - unlikely discovery, inspection questions
« Reply #17 on: February 11, 2007, 11:28:11 AM »
That is truly an incredible find. I hope the internals are as nice as the externals. Since it’s been inside and in a dry climate their probably OK. As far as running it is concerned I’d use it at home as much as possible. You don’t want to be one of those “gentleman collectors”  ;)

Don't forget to check for sand ;D

Thanks, Geno
« Last Edit: February 11, 2007, 11:38:11 AM by Geno »

wrightkiller

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Re: New Lister 16/2 - unlikely discovery, inspection questions
« Reply #18 on: February 11, 2007, 01:47:11 PM »
JT  what a find !  Good Luck ....What other kind of engines did he have there??

binnie

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Re: New Lister 16/2 - unlikely discovery, inspection questions
« Reply #19 on: February 11, 2007, 01:47:37 PM »
jtodd,
Bloody Amazing! I bet there was a pretty fast heart beat when you saw it for the first time. Beyond all expectations. I am happy for you. Keep the picts coming. I am saving them all to a file for future reference. Big ques. Did you sleep well last night? Great find! binnie
Listeroid 12/2 Jkson with 10kw head, for backup now on diesel. Future interests: WVO, bio,  Cogen - Heat exchangers - solar.

rmchambers

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Re: New Lister 16/2 - unlikely discovery, inspection questions
« Reply #20 on: February 11, 2007, 03:49:41 PM »
Wow, it's like you've hit the holy grail of Dursley built products!  I'm amazed that it sat that long without someone realizing what it was and I'm very jealous  ;D but also very glad that it has found a home with someone who will love it and use it the way it was designed.

Please keep us supplied with Lister porn photographs!

Robert

Ironworks

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Re: New Lister 16/2 - unlikely discovery, inspection questions
« Reply #21 on: February 11, 2007, 06:10:34 PM »
I'd feel pretty safe saying that is one of a kind.  I would imagine an engine collector would pay a pretty penny for an unran engine like that.  Congrats.  So no one has asked, so I will.  What did it cost ya?  ;D

jtodd

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Re: New Lister 16/2 - unlikely discovery, inspection questions
« Reply #22 on: February 11, 2007, 06:30:48 PM »
I'd feel pretty safe saying that is one of a kind.  I would imagine an engine collector would pay a pretty penny for an unran engine like that.  Congrats.  So no one has asked, so I will.  What did it cost ya?  ;D

I'll abstain from quoting a price because it will get me in trouble two ways:
  1) Some people will hold their heads and cry that I've paid too much for an engine that is 30? years old and that can be had more cheaply by buying an Indian clone.
  2) Some people will hold their heads and cry that I've paid far too little, and I wouldn't want to cause undue jealousy.

So:  I paid more than I would have for a similar Indian clone, but less than I probably should have paid for this engine.  Of course, everything is for sale at the right price, so I'd consider selling the engine but I think that the starting bid for trade would be something in the "Ariel Atom" class.  (http://www.arielatom.com/) since of course I'd want only to trade English iron for English steel.

In answer to the other question: they didn't have any other engines for sale (I asked) though there were a few older Onan and Kohlers (one was 1947) that were being kept by the owner.   You can see one in the background of one of the pictures.

JT

mobile_bob

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Re: New Lister 16/2 - unlikely discovery, inspection questions
« Reply #23 on: February 11, 2007, 10:39:18 PM »
if you have an original, that has virtually no hours, and the mounting base etc... i would first do a fairly exhaustive search to see what it is worth
you may be pleasantly surprised or downright shocked!

would be a shame to use one that might have some serious value to a museum or collector with deep pockets.

last year there was a guy who bought on ebay for a by it now on a southbend light 10 lathe, 35 years old but never used and fully equipped he resold it for about 8 times what he paid for it. southbend guys go insane for new old stock, and all that

i would suspect there are lister guys that go just as insane on new old stock engines etc.

might be like buying a hemi cuda with 100 miles on it from an estate sale and makeing a family car out of it :), then find out later it was worth 200k at barrett jackson in it as found condition and before you drove it for a couple of years..

just a thought... its yours now to do as you will with...

bob g
otherpower.com, microcogen.info, practicalmachinist.com
(useful forums), utterpower.com for all sorts of diy info

Ironworks

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Re: New Lister 16/2 - unlikely discovery, inspection questions
« Reply #24 on: February 12, 2007, 10:04:42 AM »
I'd feel pretty safe saying that is one of a kind.  I would imagine an engine collector would pay a pretty penny for an unran engine like that.  Congrats.  So no one has asked, so I will.  What did it cost ya?  ;D

I'll abstain from quoting a price because it will get me in trouble two ways:
  1) Some people will hold their heads and cry that I've paid too much for an engine that is 30? years old and that can be had more cheaply by buying an Indian clone.
  2) Some people will hold their heads and cry that I've paid far too little, and I wouldn't want to cause undue jealousy.

So:  I paid more than I would have for a similar Indian clone, but less than I probably should have paid for this engine.  Of course, everything is for sale at the right price, so I'd consider selling the engine but I think that the starting bid for trade would be something in the "Ariel Atom" class.  (http://www.arielatom.com/) since of course I'd want only to trade English iron for English steel.

In answer to the other question: they didn't have any other engines for sale (I asked) though there were a few older Onan and Kohlers (one was 1947) that were being kept by the owner.   You can see one in the background of one of the pictures.

JT


Hmmmm thats no fun.....Well I'll tell ya what I think it's worth.  $10,000 easy.    You should buy a lottery ticket cuz you're one lucky guy.

I read this story last week http://www.oldengineshed.com/twinhistory.html and I thought "Wow that was a one time thing, I'll probably never see anything like that again"
Now this....Man!  I am really excited about this.  I hope you can find some time to document this so people can see what a treasure you have uncovered. 

Use or don't use?  Well I would be in the same delima if it were mine.  I think I would lean towards non use and polished often. But thats me.  I have what I consider to be a fairly rare engine and I run it.  It's risky because I know I probably won't be able to get parts for it should one break. Good thing I know some old machinists.  You can probably dig up spares here or abroad.  Any chance you can make a sound file when you first fire it up?  I'd sure like to hear that baby run. 

twombo

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Re: New Lister 16/2 - unlikely discovery, inspection questions
« Reply #25 on: February 13, 2007, 02:42:25 AM »
JT

I know your dilemma!!  I walked away from an absolutely pristine 67 122 Volvo 2 door with only 4000 original miles a while back. I could afford the entry price for a car to drive but not to keep as a collector piece. I felt that it would be a mortal sin  to tear up such a one of a kind survivor. Better to drive my nice, but tatty about the edges, drivers and enjoy the ride.

Best of luck on whatever route you go, there WILL be some soul searching I'm sure!

Best regards

Mike

jtodd

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Re: New Lister 16/2 - unlikely discovery, inspection questions
« Reply #26 on: February 14, 2007, 07:50:43 PM »
So, the decision is that I'm going to run it in production.  A brief conversation with David Edgington indicates that there isn't much price difference between a "new" engine and an engine that has a large number of hours on it, and I'm not the kind of guy that keeps museum pieces around anyway.  This engine will have a cushy life as far as maintenance and environment goes, even if it ends up running a lot of hours.  (I'm the kind of guy that will keep it cleaned with a rag, toothbrush, and kerosene every week to the point where I can't see oil desposits on the bolt heads or seams.)

I'm going to keep it as original as I can ,though I may replace the fuel tank and fuel filter system for a better quality setup (no, sorry, I'm not selling them. ;-)  Everything else will be "add-ons" that don't change the nature of the engine itself.

So, on to the next steps...

JT

CD in BC

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Re: New Lister 16/2 - unlikely discovery, inspection questions
« Reply #27 on: February 17, 2007, 05:10:39 PM »
Well your karma must be very good indeed. ;D  I'm sure we'd all still like to hear more about the 'how' if not the 'where'...I know from personal experience that when you want something enough, it almost seems to generate a magnetic pull and 'things turn up'.  (Take heart those still unfulfilled!)

I don't see why you shouldn't run the engine and still be able to keep it in pristine condition.

All you need a NOS Stamford 8-10Kw head to go with it!

Dursley Dave

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Re: New Lister 16/2 - unlikely discovery, inspection questions
« Reply #28 on: June 01, 2007, 11:57:37 PM »
Far be it to rain on your parade, but That engine looks like it has had a coat of paint, the other thing that raises my suspicions is, the oily nature of the engine breather and the amount of oil around the base...........maybe it isnt quite as new as you think, I hope it is..I would still give it shed space without a second thought!
                                                                                 Nice engine, nice find. 
"Quality remains long after the price is forgotten"
Henry Royce (Rolls Royce)