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Author Topic: Converting 6/1 to 8,10,12 / 1  (Read 7103 times)

Ray C

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Converting 6/1 to 8,10,12 / 1
« on: December 06, 2006, 12:00:55 AM »
Hi Folks,

I'm wondering if anyone has experience in converting a 6/1 to an 8 or 10 or 12 / 1?  Right now, I'd like to use a Lister-type to generate standby electricity and occasional heat. For this, a 6/1 might be a little shy of power.  Longer term, I'd like to put some of the house on DC/Inverted power.  A 6/1 would be fine in that role.  In the further distant future, I plan to live on my wooded property which at the current time, has no power or other utilities.  In that case, an 8, 10 or 12 makes more sense...

Given this, what things generally need to be done to convert a 6/1?  Obviously, this is not something I plan to convert back-and-forth on a frequent basis.  -The option of doing it though, is very appealing.

The  piston and cylinder would need to be changed... What about the flywheels, heads et. al.?


Regards

Ray


PS.
I live in a semi-wooded area where we often lose power for 5-7 days at a time because, tall trees knock down the power lines down.  Those $500 home-depot generators don't last very long!
 

Quinnf

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Re: Converting 6/1 to 8,10,12 / 1
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2006, 12:12:26 AM »
You probably won't find anyone who has done so because an 8/1 or a 10/1 aren't simply 6/1s running at 850 or 1000 rpm.  The governors are different, the cam timing is different and most important, the flywheels are different.  Run a spoked flywheel faster than about 800 rpm and you're risking it coming apart and killing someone.  The faster fllywheels are built heavier and have thicker rims to take the tension that the faster rotation develops.  The 10/1 also sometimes has an aluminum piston.  So buy what you need. 

Quinn
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Stan

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Re: Converting 6/1 to 8,10,12 / 1
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2006, 12:13:25 AM »
Getting more power out of a 6/1 means running it faster.  Look on this site for threads warning people about turning their flywheels faster.  If you want what you say, get both a 6/1 for limited power needs and a 12/2 for heavier duty stuff.
Stan

biobill

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Re: Converting 6/1 to 8,10,12 / 1
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2006, 01:31:14 AM »
 Hi Ray

Quote from: Ray C
I live in a semi-wooded area where we often lose power for 5-7 days at a time

I see posts about loosing power for 4 or 6 hrs. and I think "man, that's just a flicker where I come from". Times like those I see friends I haven't seen for a long time. You're not with National Grid by any chance? They bought a decent system here in NY and are just running it into the ground.

                                                      Bill
Off grid since 1990
6/1 Metro DI living in basement, cogen
6/1 Metro IDI running barn & biodiesel processer
VW 1.6 diesels all over the place
Isuzu Boxtruck, Ford Backhoe, all running on biodiesel
Needs diesel lawnmower & chainsaw

Ray C

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Re: Converting 6/1 to 8,10,12 / 1
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2006, 02:11:58 AM »


I live in in Maryland, due south of Baltimore a good long ways.  Our power company is BGE (Baltimore Gas & Electric).  We have lot's of tall trees and the power lines run through (or along-side) miles and miles of wooded areas.  By law, the power company is not allowed to cut down any tree that is in falling distance of a power line.  They can trim the trees but, can't cut them down -even if it's a dead tree.

For the past seven years, my house/neighborhood has lost power at least twice a year; each time averaging 5 days.  If it ain't hurricanes, it's ice storms.  The longest was 15 days (ice storm).   I'm a little off the beaten path and only 20-30 homes are usually effected; thus, we're low priority on the fix-list.  I don't mind losing the power in the summer but, hate when the fish tanks freeze-over in the winter.  My three tropical birds don't fancy cold temps...


Regards

Ray


binnie

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Re: Converting 6/1 to 8,10,12 / 1
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2006, 05:08:47 AM »
Ray,
You seem to know what you need and may need in the future plans. Instead of thinking of a 6/1 straining & risking to do what is not designed to ...why not get a 10/1 or 14/1 and run it now at a slower speed for limited use..with potential for the future.
As Stan suggested, I have a 12/2 for peak use...a 6/1 for limited output and am planning a battery bank for eve. quiet use should I ever have to be off grid. I plan one day, when the system is all set up and running to use it with WVO and keep the grid connected for back up only, should the engines be down, or I plan to be away on a trip.
Think about it. Straining a 6/1 will only limit its' life span & may end yours. binnie (see the thread on "run-away flywheels" for picts.
Listeroid 12/2 Jkson with 10kw head, for backup now on diesel. Future interests: WVO, bio,  Cogen - Heat exchangers - solar.

agroot

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Re: Converting 6/1 to 8,10,12 / 1
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2006, 12:14:08 PM »
Depending on the inverter that you use, the 6/1 may be all you require.  It can produce about 80 KWH / day.  Xantrex has inverters that will run in the generator assisst mode, allowing a max load of 11KW or 240V 45A.  I think that unused capacity can seamlessly be used to charge the battery bank.  I'd need to take another look at the specs to be sure.

Tony

xyzer

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Re: Converting 6/1 to 8,10,12 / 1
« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2006, 02:28:13 PM »
Not only the flywheels and piston different but the crank is internaly balanced. If the 6/1 dosn't have and oil pump it will need one for the rod oil slinger. I would recommend or as already stated you buy an 8/1 or whatever and adjust the rpm to your needs. Pulleys are cheap and a easy fix. Getting into finding the parts and converting will be one big job.
Dave
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listerdiesel

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Re: Converting 6/1 to 8,10,12 / 1
« Reply #8 on: December 06, 2006, 03:13:40 PM »
Hi Folks,

I'm wondering if anyone has experience in converting a 6/1 to an 8 or 10 or 12 / 1?  Right now, I'd like to use a Lister-type to generate standby electricity and occasional heat. For this, a 6/1 might be a little shy of power.  Longer term, I'd like to put some of the house on DC/Inverted power.  A 6/1 would be fine in that role.  In the further distant future, I plan to live on my wooded property which at the current time, has no power or other utilities.  In that case, an 8, 10 or 12 makes more sense...

Given this, what things generally need to be done to convert a 6/1?  Obviously, this is not something I plan to convert back-and-forth on a frequent basis.  -The option of doing it though, is very appealing.
The  piston and cylinder would need to be changed... What about the flywheels, heads et. al.?
Regards Ray

I cannot talk for the clone engines, but the Lister engines have major differences in the flywheels, piston, injection equipment and running speed.

It's not worth the hassle to change over, just look for a 12/2 or 16/2 engine in the first place.

The block and head are basically the same, but there is no compression change-over on the 8/1.

Peter

cujet

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Re: Converting 6/1 to 8,10,12 / 1
« Reply #9 on: December 06, 2006, 03:57:56 PM »
I purchased de-rated engines from GTC. They have all the features of the larger HP engines, including the larger bore. Yet they run at a slower speed. My engine is a 1000RPM engine set up to run at 850 or 600 RPM. But not 1000 due to the extra heavy and large diameter flywheels.

I have a dual pulley setup that gives me the choice of RPM's. Mike Montieth was kind enough to make the pulley for me, and it is a beauty!

Chris
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MeanListerGreen

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Re: Converting 6/1 to 8,10,12 / 1
« Reply #10 on: December 06, 2006, 07:46:15 PM »
I dont know alot about the variant engines, but why couldn't you just get a 12/1 and govern it down?
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xyzer

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Re: Converting 6/1 to 8,10,12 / 1
« Reply #11 on: December 07, 2006, 02:05:42 AM »
I dont know alot about the variant engines, but why couldn't you just get a 12/1 and govern it down?
You could. I know a guy with a 10/1 running WMO over driving an induction motor dumping about 2000 watts back into the grid and the 10/1 I believe is only turning a slow 650 RPM. It seems to do fine.
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