Author Topic: What's the story on rings??  (Read 8285 times)

Stan

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What's the story on rings??
« on: November 24, 2006, 02:17:03 AM »
I did a search and found a couple of interesting posts but they don't answer my main question.  What's the story on rings?   I know there are two different types of cylinders, chrome and cast.  Obviously different rings are needed for each of these types of cylinder.  Which is which and why?
This is one place I think the theory is needed, at least for me.
stan

rcavictim

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Re: What's the story on rings??
« Reply #1 on: November 24, 2006, 05:28:32 AM »
Stan,

Rings are round, pie are square.  ;D

Take a look here at the Hastings manufacturing site,  This page gives a lot of technical info, some may answer your curiosity.

http://www.hastingsmfg.com/techtips.htm
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Stan

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Re: What's the story on rings??
« Reply #2 on: November 24, 2006, 05:31:25 AM »
Thanks, a great site and a positive answer to my question.  Never use chrome rings in a chrome cylinder.
Got it.
Stan

cujet

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Re: What's the story on rings??
« Reply #3 on: December 01, 2006, 04:25:04 PM »
There is some very interesting ring technology available today. While good ol chrome faced rings provide all the life you are ever likely to need, there are alternatives that may be better. TiN coated rings show promise in some applications, as do moly faced rings.

For instance, a setup that is unlikely to ever wear out is Nikasil bore with chrome faced rings. Yet, this can be trouble for diesel engines with sulfur in the fuels, as the sulfur tends to break down the Nikasil coating. The new ULSD fuels should eliminate this problem. Antoher great point is that Nikasil and Chrome tends to break in very rapidly.

Cast iron rings, like the ones the Listeroids come with are the shortest life ring made, there is no lower quality available. Yet they live for many hours in a Listeroid. In fact, it may be a good thing, as the engine needs carbon removal at set intervals anyway.

The trick would be to have a long life ring and bore combo, coupled with a fuel that burns clean and an oil that prevents ring land deposits and the subsequent ring sticking.

Chris
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Stan

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Re: What's the story on rings??
« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2006, 06:44:28 PM »
And peace on earth and good will to all men
Stan

Doug

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Re: What's the story on rings??
« Reply #5 on: December 04, 2006, 07:38:58 PM »
I have chrome faced rings rings in my Petter with an iron bore. I thinks its possible many people my have crome rings in their roids and not noticed unless they did a strip down.

Doug

rcavictim

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Re: What's the story on rings??
« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2006, 08:31:39 PM »
The replacement ring set I got from Hastings for my PJ-1 Petter (listed on their website) has a solid chrome top ring, the 2nd and 3rd rings are normal cast iron and the oil scraper ring is the usual type of thing, two split washers with a serpentine spacer between them.

The ring set I removed from my engine during replacement has a chrome faced top ring, two cast below and the usual oil scraper ring.
-DIY 1.5L NA VW diesel genset - 9 kW 3-phase. Co-gen, dualĀ  fuel
- 1966, Petter PJ-1, 5 kW air cooled diesel standby lighting plant
-DIY JD175A, minimum fuel research genset.
-Changfa 1115
-6 HP Launtop air cooled diesel
-Want Lister 6/1
-Large DIY VAWT nearing completion

Stan

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Re: What's the story on rings??
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2006, 08:47:13 PM »
Yes, according to the Hastings (ring) people you use chrome rings on an iron cylinder or iron rings on a chrome cylinder but never put iron with iron or chrome with chrome.
Stan

cujet

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Re: What's the story on rings??
« Reply #8 on: December 10, 2006, 01:56:01 PM »
It is truly OK to use cast rings on a cast iron cylinder. This is how American cars were made for 70 years.

Chris
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Stan

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Re: What's the story on rings??
« Reply #9 on: December 10, 2006, 05:35:57 PM »
You are absolutely right Chris, I should have said "never chrome on chrome" and stopped there.
Stan

SHIPCHIEF

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Re: What's the story on rings??
« Reply #10 on: December 11, 2006, 04:45:00 AM »
So what did Lister use for rings in the Listhard bore? Wasn't that a chrome type bore with a proprietary finish?
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Stan

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Re: What's the story on rings??
« Reply #11 on: December 11, 2006, 04:50:07 AM »
Yes, and Peter can correct me if I'm wrong but the Listerhard "bore" was chromed using an electroplating process which reversed the polarity of the current at the very end of the process fracturing the chrome.  These "fractures" then allowed the oil to remain embedded in the surface making for a very hard, slippery surface.  The rings were/are cast iron which "sets" or wears in as the engine is broken in.  Chrome rings would be too slippery and hard and the engine would never be properly broken in.
Stan