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Everything else / Re: Blasphemy..... Solar power.
« Last post by BruceM on November 19, 2017, 08:22:26 PM »
I concur, AdeV.   Same thing happens with lead acid batteries, but there regular equalization charging (adding water and sacrificing positive plate life for the best cells) is typically used to compensate for the drift in charge rate of individual cells and groups of cells (batteries).

The AGMs in the early EV days were dying very quickly until battery management was developed to reduce it. They could not be equalized for long periods or the electrolyte got dried up.  The simple individual 12v battery shunt regulator (limiting individual battery voltage) as used by Manzanita Power saved the day and is the approach I used for my 120V bank. It works surprisingly well; the batteries become more and more matched over time instead of less, kicking to absorption and float stages within half a minute of each other and a bad battery can be replaced without concern for matching.  Watering just a bit over a gallon every 2nd year doesn't break my heart either.  On my neighbor's upgraded version, we found equalization charging to match individual cells within a battery (checked via hygrometer) can be virtually eliminated by a slight increase in float voltage, since the batteries are typically in float all afternoon.  His system bulk charges at a higher current than mine so we watched things closely the first year.

I think even in 48V wet lead banks battery life could be improved by individual battery management. Yes, it adds cost and complexity, but over time, the ongoing replacement cost of batteries is the biggest component of your power bill. I haven't seen it offered in any 48V system yet.



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Everything else / Re: Blasphemy..... Solar power.
« Last post by AdeV on November 19, 2017, 07:16:00 PM »
Quote
They certainly aren't ideal for off grid power use.

Certainly not as-is, if they're not doing per-cell management... but if you've got the electronical wizardry necessary (I haven't... but I do have a very clever friend I can ask who would be able to work it out), and you can modify the pack to do per-cell management, then you'd be able to rescue a cheap "dead" pack, quite possibly to near-original efficiency.

This used to be what killed laptop batteries off: The individual cells would drift out of sync, so when you charged them, the charger stopped when the most-charged cell reached capacity; but your battery would be "flat" when the least-charged cell discharged. Meanwhile, if the "most charged" cell still had 90% of its charge - tough! The battery was apparently flat. And charging the battery would only put (in this case) around 10% charge into the discharged cell before it stopped. Hence the "5 minute runtime" and the bad rep Lithium batteries got early in their lives. These days, all cells are individually monitored and charged, so laptop batteries don't degrade anything like how they used to. I do wonder, how many perfectly good LiIon or NiMH batteries got thrown away, just because they weren't being charged correctly?
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Everything else / Re: Blasphemy..... Solar power.
« Last post by BruceM on November 19, 2017, 06:23:10 PM »
I did a bit more reading on the Prius battery packs. No wonder so many are available cheap-  they don't have a good cell management system so cells are drifting out of match and then failing prematurely.  You must then replace all of your mixing varying aged cells will result in very poor performance. They seem to be monitoring two blades of 7V in series but don't provide enough detail to know what the problem with their battery management system is. Individual cell voltage/charge management isn't use and I believe most EVs do that to avoid this type of problem.

http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.1028.2529&rep=rep1&type=pdf

They certainly aren't ideal for off grid power use.




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Everything else / Re: Blasphemy..... Solar power.
« Last post by BruceM on November 19, 2017, 05:40:54 PM »
Hmmm-  Prius cells are only 6.5 ah, so I'm not so sure about this approach. I don't know what kind of individual cell charge management they use in these Prius modules; some approaches don't lend themselves to parallel cells. I also wonder what the residual cycle life curve looks like after 80% depletion.




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Listeroid Engines / Re: new listeroid. super hard to crank thru compression stroke
« Last post by cujet on November 19, 2017, 12:50:50 PM »
Ah, the joys of starting a single cylinder engine with a coffee can sized piston, a 17 to 1 compression ratio and thick oil. I'd carefully look into compression release and exhaust valve adjustment. This can help. In any case, the starter should be able to crank it over fast enough with the CR engaged that, when released, inertia alone is well more than enough to get the engine through a compression stroke.
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Listeroid Engines / Re: new listeroid. super hard to crank thru compression stroke
« Last post by carlb23 on November 19, 2017, 10:05:50 AM »
Check the valve clearance you may have it too loose.   Get it spinning real good before disengaging the the decompressor
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Everything else / Re: Blasphemy..... Solar power.
« Last post by mikenash on November 19, 2017, 09:38:22 AM »
Hey Starfire, re China and EVs

Dunno if you take any notice of the Nurburgring?  It's kinda THE forum to sort out the men from the boys when someone claims to be making a genuinely fast car.  Not just fast in a straight line, or fast off the mark, or fast through a set of tight bends - but genuine real-world point-to-point FAST

Last time I looked the fastest thing around the Nurburgring was, you guessed it, a 1400 HP, Chinese-built electric car

Way of the future perhaps?
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Listeroid Engines / Re: new listeroid. super hard to crank thru compression stroke
« Last post by Hugh Conway on November 19, 2017, 01:24:53 AM »
@ Davesiegler
That 10/1 you've got was originally from a dealer in Ontario Canada, John Ferguson. He was associated with George Breckenridge of Utterpower. John sold his business to Jim Calder who now runs it as Just Live Off Grid.
I bought a 6/1 and a PMG from John  (Belleghuan was his brand, it is really a JKSON) several years ago. It is in service mainly charging batteries when the sun does not shine........most of the winter here.
As for your engine being hard to crank through compression, I am imagining you mean once you dis-engage the valve lifter. Assuming no mechanical problems (sounds like you covered your bases) I can tell you that I had and still have the same problem when its cold here (Canada, winter) Spinning it up by hand can result in the compression stopping the turning with the hand crank anyway. I have a starter/generator belted up and usually spin it at least 5 to 7 injector creaks before disengaging the valve lifter......it has always started then. Many times cannot get it started by hand if the temp is around or below freezing.
Nature of the beast! It will loosen up a bit after you get some hours on it, and I bet it cranks lots easier after it is warmed up. Mine sure does.
Cheers,
Hugh
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Listeroid Engines / Re: new listeroid. super hard to crank thru compression stroke
« Last post by davesiegler on November 19, 2017, 12:10:19 AM »
thanks mike.
the whole engine has been disassembled, cleaned, checked for sand and reassembled with lucas assembly lube. all the points you spoke about are lubed/greased.
i shouldnt have to go thru the injection pump should I? It has never been run. truly never run. not a bit of soot or combustion evidence anywhere.
good point i suppose on the non toxic antifreeze, ive just always used it in my outdoor boiler and the first liquid cooled generator I had.
rotella t4 10-30 with lucas additive is what i bought. its getting cold in maine this time of year.
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Listeroid Engines / Re: new listeroid. super hard to crank thru compression stroke
« Last post by mike90045 on November 18, 2017, 09:31:34 PM »
OK, you have a job to do first, to get the fuel system primed.

Did you check for sand and clean it out ?

Why do you need non-tox antifreeze, you are not supposed to be drinking it.  Do you use non-toxic diesel or motor oil ?

With freezing temps, you may need to go to a thinner grade of oil, I use delo 15-40

But even without coolant, you can fire it up for 15 sec, and have it run.

You know about the oil points before starting :  (my homemade list)
Oiling before start:  [ starting from top, going down ]

Rocker Arms pivot.   oil hole at the pivot (2)

Rocker Arm Ends : each end, where it contacts the other moving parts
 (pushrod & valve cap) (4)

Valves - Springs & Keepers/caps
 caps at the top of the stem  (2)
 some oil in the big sump at the top of the head, into the deep spring well.
         (some folks use 90w gear lube here)


Fuel Pump:
 Metering shaft (in the middle of the pump that the linkage connects to)
 linkages to governor
 Tappet wells  (access thru flywheel spokes) - fore & aft sumps  couple drops each


Tappets - top side where pushrods reside.
 
Camshaft bushing - next to Ex tappet, unscrew and squirt oil down into it after long idle periods. ( more than 48 hours since last run)  (this oils the camshaft bushing)

Crankcase level:  somewhere between the tips of the castle nuts on the crank, and the middle of the dipper

 >48 hrs since last run, add:
open crankcase door and oil the 2 wells on the connecting rod
open plug far side next to Ex tappet, and dribble 1 tablespoon down center of hole
 (this oils the camshaft bushing)
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