Lister Engine Forum

Lister Engines => Listeroid Engines => Topic started by: Tanman on January 21, 2019, 06:25:40 PM

Title: Good price?
Post by: Tanman on January 21, 2019, 06:25:40 PM
Hello all,

Would love some opinions on a listeroid I found for sale in the midwest. It is a Metro premium 6/1 (no idea what premium means) with ST 5kw generator on a steel I frame. Engine is describes as like new, generator is described as used but good shape. He is asking $3000. Is that a decent price in 2019? Would love some input.

Thank you.
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: John (Boston) on January 21, 2019, 06:33:54 PM
My opinion is - that's a pretty good deal, especially if you are going to pick it up (no shipping).

-John (Boston)
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: BruceM on January 21, 2019, 07:06:58 PM
In my mind, value is based on what was done before putting it in service.  If the crankcase interior paint is the stock green over sand Rajkot crap, you better look closely at the upper bearing surface for sand damage.  Best to assume it's a kit with base and start over.  The price including ST5 and steel base isn't sky high.  It would be a great deal if the engine was done over in 38ac's fashion.  Look at rocker alignment with valves, watch for tappet rotation when cranking too.   Believe your eyes and not the warm air from the seller about engine cleanup and setup.

Metro Premium-  means it's a Listeriod, modified crankcase, no sump or oil pump, splash only, roller bearing mains, and missing two bolts on cylinder head.  None of those mods are a show stopper to me.  (I have a Metro Listeroid.)  Parts quality varies wildly, the same as any other Rajkot made CS clone or Listeroid. 


 
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: Tanman on January 21, 2019, 07:23:01 PM
Thanks Bruce,

I believe it is just a base with parts kit, the guy didn't run it much so I'm assuming it didn't run great when he put it together and is scared to run it, so time to sell it I guess. What questions should I ask before driving down there?
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: BruceM on January 21, 2019, 07:45:26 PM
I'd be thinking of things to make him come down in price $500.  Like asking about sand damage to the bearings and can you pull the bearing shells for inspection, does it have original paint, and is it a hopper.

Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: mike90045 on January 21, 2019, 07:55:47 PM
Don't trust anyones sand inspection report.   just ask to open it up when you get there to inspect.
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: BruceM on January 21, 2019, 08:05:15 PM
+1, I'd assume the worst unless inspection shows otherwise.  Questions with easily confirmed answers will help put him on his heels on price a bit.
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: ajaffa1 on January 21, 2019, 09:20:25 PM
Hi Tanman, the good news is that spares for these are readily available. If there is any sign of casting sand in the interior, it is going to need stripping, cleaning and rebuilding. Please see 38ac`s Indian engine rebuild on the WOK at the top of the home page. This will give you an idea of the work needed and the techniques involved.

The quality of ST heads also varies enormously, I would recommend pulling the ends off it and checking the bearings. If it has unsealed bearings, replace them with new sealed bearings. Also check the alignment and condition of the slip rings and brushes. Replace the nasty cheap bridge rectifier with something better quality and check all the wiring in the top box.

Putting in the time, money and effort at the begging will ensure you have a reliable setup for years to come.

Bob
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: dieselspanner on January 21, 2019, 09:29:04 PM
+ another 1!

Have a read of the stuff on the WOK, especially the sand stuff, take all your own tools, and a torch, in order to pop the inspection hatch at the minimum, make sure you have sockets, attacking it with a monkey wrench won't make you look very professional, be nice and if you can, show the seller some of the stuff from here that details the pitfalls of Rajkot iron on a tablet, fix your top price and take that much - and no more - in cash, when you are getting close flash the cash and ask which he would prefer you to walk away with, remember that lister(iod)s are like nurses and buses, there's always another one coming down the road, eventually......

Cheers
Stef
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: BruceM on January 21, 2019, 10:06:20 PM
In the midwest DES 8/1 clones are also a good choice, and Gary's support for replacement of defective Rajkot parts is very impressive.  I did a propane conversion of one for my neighbor and think very highly of Gary and DES.  Yes, I did have some blooper parts, which he replaced pronto, and his support for a highly unusual modification was stellar.  He even loaned us a used CA110 propane carb when we were having carburetor challenges due to the gulping intake of the CS, and his technical expertise with other propane engines was invaluable.  We did the whole 38ac procedure and it's been a reliable, great runner for an off grid homestead with around 1000 hrs now. 



Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: ajaffa1 on January 21, 2019, 10:40:04 PM
Hi Tanman, I read in one of your other posts that you are only 25 years old. The fact that there are still some young people with the skills and inclination for this sort of work has made my week, there is hope for the human race. I think I speak for everyone on this forum when I say that you will have our full support.

Bob
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: Tanman on January 22, 2019, 01:13:04 PM
Wow, thank you guys. I really appreciate the feedback. I will keep you updated. My wife said I have to sell my Subaru Robin generator before I can get a lister. A Reasonable request since we just bought our first house together and the money doesn't come down as easy as the snow does. Hopefully it will sell quick! I will continue to do some reading and get more familiar with the platform. Thanks again.
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: ajaffa1 on January 23, 2019, 03:44:50 AM
Glort. I hope your Wife never ever reads anything you post, She might conclude that her husband is a cunning, manipulative SOB.  :laugh:

Bob
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: BruceM on January 23, 2019, 06:06:04 AM
I live alone because my health is crap, and voice, music and sounds affect my epilepsy, not because I think that's a great choice, or that I don't have fond memories of women.

I have only two generators, the 6/1 Listeroid and a 4KW cheapo gas portable backup generator that's been sitting in a Rubbermaid deck box next to the engine shed.  It hasn't had fuel in it's carburetor for about 10 years. 




Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: Tanman on January 23, 2019, 03:13:29 PM
That is great advice, I have a transfer box I picked up that I just need to wire in, and can show her how great it is for her lol.
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: BruceM on January 24, 2019, 02:56:19 AM
That's called the Kruger-Dunning effect.  The strongly opinionated  idiots hugely outnumber the intelligent and thoughtful.  The idiots are always quite certain that they know best and can't be reasoned with.  All humans demonstrate Kruger-Dunning. It's not one of our best traits.

Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: Tanman on January 24, 2019, 04:34:08 AM

[/quote]
There might be a few Young Fella's like Tanman that end up with massive toy collections because there might only be a handful of blokes like them interested in the stuff.
[/quote]

That may happen. At my last sales job in Minneapolis one of my coworkers (almost everyone there was under 30) payed me $40 to do a seafoam treatment on his jeep, then paid me $100 to install some shocks (really simple just a bolt or two on each end) I couldn't believe it. When I first brought up seafoam they thought I was talking about an app for their phone. The world is changing and I seem to have been born in the wrong generation.
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: mikenash on January 24, 2019, 08:14:14 AM

There might be a few Young Fella's like Tanman that end up with massive toy collections because there might only be a handful of blokes like them interested in the stuff.
[/quote]

That may happen. At my last sales job in Minneapolis one of my coworkers (almost everyone there was under 30) payed me $40 to do a seafoam treatment on his jeep, then paid me $100 to install some shocks (really simple just a bolt or two on each end) I couldn't believe it. When I first brought up seafoam they thought I was talking about an app for their phone. The world is changing and I seem to have been born in the wrong generation.
[/quote]

Tanman did that seafoam do any good?  I had a 2002 Corolla for a while with oil-control rings varnished/glazed up & it was an awful oil-burner although otherwise a good, tough, reliable Corolla.  I often thought that seafoam might loosen shit on them a bit

My daughter had it for a year or so and I used to keep an eye on the oil for her.  But one day she noticed it was a bit low and tipped in a whole five-litre pack of 15-40.  There was (apparently) a LOT of smoke & steam but she persevered with driving it until it melted, really

One way to fix it, I guess
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: ajaffa1 on January 24, 2019, 08:31:05 AM
Hi Glort, the problem with the world is that there is too much dependence on money. People devote their entire lives to accumulating it, while the government try their best to steal it from them, unless they are a big corporation. A dollar bill has no value unless the people believe that the government and central bank are going to keep their promises. Not much sign of that happening in any part of the western world at present.

I have lived through a lot of recessions, in various countries. The big end of town always survives, with government support. The little guy always gets screwed and the value of the dollar in your pocket dives, unemployment rises and wages fall; all good for the big end of town.

There has to be a better way of doing things so that young men like Tanman get a fair go and don`t get screwed by this wasteful, inefficient, parasitic system.

I am very glad that I am now old and have lived in an era when money had value and politicians did their best for their constituents. Those days are over and I have grave concerns for future generations. The huge debts that this generation are leaving the next generations are a disgrace and will be a lifelong drag on their lives.

Big business will continue to sell, ever increasingly, not fit for purpose equipment to people with ever decreasing understanding of how it works. People with any technical/mechanical ability are becoming increasingly rare. If I had my, time again I would be studying engineering, electronics and water management systems.

Tanman, please keep learning, studying and improving your skills. The world is going to need people like you, it just doesn`t know it yet.

Bob
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: ajaffa1 on January 24, 2019, 10:31:26 AM
Hi Glort, very worried that you are right, the sheeple have no say in things, the governments have no choice due to their debt repayment responsibilities. Big business always wants to get bigger and, in the present economic situation, are encouraged by the government.

I`m not sure that I want to be around when the sh1t hits the fan, but then again there might be some satisfaction in saying: `I told you so`, as the world goes mad and politicians get lynched.

My brother is a very wealthy London banker, everything he has ever earned is invested in the corrupt financial system, if that system ever fails he has nothing but a house in London, which would be unsaleable.

Don`t ever expect that what is the norm today to be the norm tomorrow.

Bob
Title: Re: Good price?
Post by: Tanman on January 24, 2019, 02:33:57 PM

Tanman did that seafoam do any good?  I had a 2002 Corolla for a while with oil-control rings varnished/glazed up & it was an awful oil-burner although otherwise a good, tough, reliable Corolla.  I often thought that seafoam might loosen shit on them a bit

My daughter had it for a year or so and I used to keep an eye on the oil for her.  But one day she noticed it was a bit low and tipped in a whole five-litre pack of 15-40.  There was (apparently) a LOT of smoke & steam but she persevered with driving it until it melted, really

One way to fix it, I guess

Mikenash, it sounds like it had too much $h!t loose. I probably would have tried one of the "engine restore" products that helps build the cylinder walls and rings back up with ceramics and other wizardry they put in the can. I've seen it work very well on low compression worn out tractors and the like. I'll be putting a can through my diesel suburban that has some miles on it soon. Seafoam isn't the best cleaner out there anymore, it doesn't have PEA in it. When they changed the gas and started putting a lot of ethanol in it the needs in a fuel additive changed. Gumout with PEA or any fuel additive with PEA should work much better than seafoam in a modern 4 stroke engine (IMO).